Black Spirituality Religion : Why Our People Won't Embrace Their Own Heritage

SAMURAI36 said:
From whence doest the notion that living somewhere makes your mindset reflective of that environment derive?

In my mind's eye, this "When in Rome, do as the Romans do" mindset is western, in and of itself.

I have lived in a gang-infested neighborhood....Does that make me a gang member?
I don't think anyone is saying that. We are not simply talking environment here. We are talking about our immediate realities. I was born here, so was my mother, so was her mother. I don't consider myself American, but I must factor America into my thinking somehow becuase it is in fact my ever present reality. It must be a factor. We cannot simply ignore its significance and pretend we live in a bubble.


We are not our environments, though sadly we remain ever so controlled by them. Black people in this society have long since been plagued with a having a very provential mentality.

Most of us can only speak English (and we do even that rather poorly), while the rest of the world is bi-lingual at the very least, or multi-lingual at most. Most people in this world, have traveled to other places, while we as Black people barely want to take a trip to the Bahamas (another largely Black society) for vacation......And even when we do, we do so as "tourists" rather than as explorers or potential citizens.

I agree that we are ignorant to many things, mainly because we are in America and the culture is this way. We do not go to schools the effectively teach us multiple languages. But even if we do travel, we are just guests and visitors, even if we feel connected to the indigenous people there. Most of us would be far more comfortable in our "western-style" places of living than in Africa--which, by the way, has been "westernized" itself. Why does this have to be positive or negative? It is simply human nature to be comfortable with what one is used to.

While I hear the juxtaposition or conundrum that you and Brother KENTE present, I am also aware of the old Islamic addage: "if the mountain does not come to Muhammad, then Muhammad must go to the mountain".

Funny you should mention this, but it actually goes "If you can't bring Muhammad to the mountain, bring the mountain to Muhammad," which is just the opposite of what you assert. Using this example, if Muhammad is in America, bring the mountain to him there. Why try to move Muhammad from where he lives?

The only reason I know about these things, is because I took whatever opportunitie that presented themselves to go and learn about them.

And we should always learn, but we cannot change our pasts. If you grew up in America, your memories will be of western things. While McDonald's may be a negative aspect of American culture, being fond of the western-style house where I grew up and feeling comfortable with my neigherhood does not make me a lover of Rome. It makes me human.

I know of numerous Africans who are willing to take people with them when they go home, for the sake of experiencing their home with them.

That may be a moving experience, but what will it change about the present reality of Black people in the Americas?

We as Black people tend to think that this is it for us; either that, or we are sitting around waiting on the "Swing Lo, Sweet Chariot" to come transport us off to some form of "Heaven" or another. We have got to get out of that "Promised Land" mentality.

This is it for us at present. In other words, we are here, masses of our people our hear, most of them read the Bible, for better or for worse. This is our condition. What do we do? Do we all go back to Africa? And being that Africa is a continent with hundreds of tribes, languages, and cultures within it, which one do we pick?

I watched a special during Black History Month where Henry Louis Gates, Jr. traced some famous people's DNA back to the tribes of their ancestors. Oprah was disappointed to find that her roots most likely trace back to Liberia. She has established a girl's leadership academy in South Africa and feels a special connection to the people there. So at the end of the day, it is freeing to know from whence we came, but how will that effect where we will go and where we are?

It is unnatural for a baby to try to re-enter the womb, but we want to know who our mother and father is.
 
uplift19 said:
I don't think anyone is saying that. We are not simply talking environment here. We are talking about our immediate realities. I was born here, so was my mother, so was her mother. I don't consider myself American, but I must factor America into my thinking somehow becuase it is in fact my ever present reality. It must be a factor. We cannot simply ignore its significance and pretend we live in a bubble.

But that's the thing though:

To remain overly concerned about America, is effectually "pretending that we live in a bubble.

We live on Earth, not just on American soil. The word exsisted long before there was an "America", it continues to do so now, and it will continue to do so long after.

I maintain that one of the major issues that continues to hinder our growth as Black people, is our continued affinity for this place.

It's like Cinderella continuing to love the Wicked Step Mother, despite how badly she treats her.

Prince Charming could very well be waiting for us, and so could our "fair god mother" (Gosh, I hate to use that mindless drivel in attempts to prove a point, but c'est la vie).

I agree that we are ignorant to many things, mainly because we are in America and the culture is this way. We do not go to schools the effectively teach us multiple languages. But even if we do travel, we are just guests and visitors, even if we feel connected to the indigenous people there. Most of us would be far more comfortable in our "western-style" places of living than in Africa--which, by the way, has been "westernized" itself. Why does this have to be positive or negative? It is simply human nature to be comfortable with what one is used to.

It becomes a negative, when we are lagging behind the rest of the world in foreign relations. We as a people have no formal fashion of diplomatic interaction with absolutely nobody.

Comfort zones are strictly an illusion; a vaguery of perception that we use as a security blanket, and ultimately as an excuse.....An excuse that we no longer have the luxury of using.

The world is passing us by at warp-9 speed. If we don't start doing something about it, and soon, then we are going to be caught up in the wake of an ionic particle trail.

Funny you should mention this, but it actually goes "If you can't bring Muhammad to the mountain, bring the mountain to Muhammad," which is just the opposite of what you assert. Using this example, if Muhammad is in America, bring the mountain to him there. Why try to move Muhammad from where he lives?

Because Muhammad as a human being, is not an immovable object, like a chunk of rock known as a continent is. People all over the world, are migrating to all over the world.......Everyone except us, that is. We are going to have to adopt an international mentality, lest we will indeed become extinct, or at the very least, an obsolete novelty in the eyes of the rest of the world.

Besides, I've heard that saying spun in different ways, yours and mine including. I prefer mine, for the reasons stated above. Especially considering that historically, it was in fact Muhammad that went to the mountain, as well as other places, because he realized that he needed to do so out of necessity (more specifically, life and death).

And we should always learn, but we cannot change our pasts. If you grew up in America, your memories will be of western things. While McDonald's may be a negative aspect of American culture, being fond of the western-style house where I grew up and feeling comfortable with my neigherhood does not make me a lover of Rome. It makes me human.

Not a lover of Rome, but certainly an empathizer. We cannot complain about how America continuously treats us, when the lot of us are not willing to at least consider viable alternatives to that treatment.

That may be a moving experience, but what will it change about the present reality of Black people in the Americas?

I think "enhance" should be the better goal, rather than "change" (though the 2 could be seen as synonymous).

Reality is based solely on perception. Most Americans (and our people being counted among them, sadly) are the first to say that "America is the best place to live in the world"......Yet precious few of them have never been to any other place in the world for a tourist visit, let alone to have lived there.

So, how on earth is this even remotely and accurate statement? :confused:

This is it for us at present. In other words, we are here, masses of our people our hear, most of them read the Bible, for better or for worse. This is our condition. What do we do? Do we all go back to Africa? And being that Africa is a continent with hundreds of tribes, languages, and cultures within it, which one do we pick?

Nothing necessarily so drastic. The white man beats us over the head with that whole "since you're so dissatisfied with America, you can always go back to Africa" non-sense, knowing that it will only put us on some "act-right" out of fear of the unknown alternative. I say unknown, because little do most Black American people realize, that much of Africa has become "developed" to a degree that would support a lifestyle that the Average Middle Class Black American would find condusive to their lifestyle. It's going on right now in Ghana, for example.

In the meantime, people have to crawl before they can walk. But the white man doesn't want you to do this, so he tries to push you out of the crib right into the street.

That's what he did more than a century ago, with his "Liberian Experiment"; shipping several 1000 blacks off to the Motherland, knowing d@mn well they had not the first piece of knowledge about it........And Liberia has been a laughing stock ever since.

I personall ywill not make that mistake again.

I watched a special during Black History Month where Henry Louis Gates, Jr. traced some famous people's DNA back to the tribes of their ancestors. Oprah was disappointed to find that her roots most likely trace back to Liberia. She has established a girl's leadership academy in South Africa and feels a special connection to the people there. So at the end of the day, it is freeing to know from whence we came, but how will that effect where we will go and where we are?

Moreso the running joke; there are numerous Africans who are born in one part of the continent, yet live in other parts. I know of Liberians who live in Ghana, Algerians who live in South Africa, South Africans who live in Chad, etc.

So why on earth would Oprah be so stupid, as to feel disappointed that she's not ZHOSA or ZULU? She acted as if she was told that her people came from Mars.

It is unnatural for a baby to try to re-enter the womb, but we want to know who our mother and father is.

Even the Bible says "all things go back from whence they came". Establishing ones point of origin is essential in establishing one's trajectory.

Do you know how to get to your house from Tajikstan? ;)

PEACE
 
This is why the way should never be led by a realist. There is a place and a role for the realists. However if we let them lead us we would still be living in a primitive society because if you can't dream of a house you can't build one. The proper place of a realist is to point out the areas where we should take caution in what we do. But never let a realist tell you what to do. You will go no further than where you are and may even go back some.
 
river said:
This is why the way should never be led by a realist. There is a place and a role for the realists. However if we let them lead us we would still be living in a primitive society because if you can't dream of a house you can't build one. The proper place of a realist is to point out the areas where we should take caution in what we do. But never let a realist tell you what to do. You will go no further than where you are and may even go back some.
Realism comes from idealism,without the idea you have no plan to implement them into the paradigm of realism,nor do you have the ability to grasp what is realism because you only see what is in front of you today, not what is behind you yesterday,not was is old last year,as well as beyond you next week.In order to be realistic,you have to be idealistic first.
 
I-khan said:
Realism comes from idealism,without the idea you have no plan to implement them into the paradigm of realism,nor do you have the ability to grasp what is realism because you only see what is in front of you today, not what is behind you yesterday,not was is old last year,as well as beyond you next week.In order to be realistic,you have to be idealistic first.
Right brotha, right. Realism sees the raw material but has no idea what can be done with that material only that nothing is being done right now. This is our major problem as a people. Everytime one of us has a dream some realist comes along and guns it down so everybody goes back to chasing the dollar.
 

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