Black History Culture : Were all Ancient Egyptians black?

Discussion in 'Black History - Culture - Panafricanism' started by StefiA, Aug 24, 2010.

  1. StefiA

    StefiA Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Now I'd always thought that the ancient egyptians were supposed to be black people, but yesterday I had some time off and I went to an exhibition in a museum all about Egypt and Nubia - now looking at all the exhibits there it is obvious from the facial features of the people on the statues of the pharoahs and the sarcophogus covers of the chief priests that that is the case....
    But, some of the smaller statues there and some of the people shown on the wall paintings have quite european features (they also look light brown) - so my questions is were the ancient egyptians really all black or was it the case that it was a society run by black people but which had some mediteranean european people in it as well? - the sort of people who would now be cypriots or siscilians, since presumably the early european civilizations like the Mycaneans must have got their ideas from somewhere.
    I found a thread on this that already existed, but it was from a religious angle and way too complicated to understand so I thought rather than try and restart that one I'd make this new one.
     
  2. largo

    largo Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    As a start to answer this question for yourself, you should read the works of S.O.Y. Keita. There is also a forum called Egypt Search and Egypt Search reloaded that is a good place to start for reference material and discussion on this topic. And of course the archives of Destee. HTH
     
  3. ru2religious

    ru2religious Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    When it comes to genetics S.O.Y Keita he's one of the best but he is not the only one. Here is a good starting place with understanding ancient Km.t and its Khemenu people.

    S.O.Y. Keita - The Bio Cultural Origins of Egypt








    S.O.Y. Keita - Ancient Egypt, Its Neolithic History and its Sudanese & Saharan Connections


    S.O.Y. Keita - Limb Proportions, and Living population example of the Egyptian mummy skeletal type



    S.O.Y. Keita - Afrocentrism, Eurocentrism, The Reinforcement of African Diversity.
     
  4. StefiA

    StefiA Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    @Hartwell

    "Originally Posted by hartwell
    Once again stefia gives her opinion and never facts which is the reason why you continue to get shot down.

    Arabs invaded Egypt in the 7th Century AD; Remember, Egypt wasn't invaded by Rome until 300 BC. Therefore, Arabs have no more connection to Ancient Egypt than Europeans have to Ancient America. Egyptian is an Afro-Asiatic language. (AFRO, AFRO) The national language of modern day Egypt is Egyptian Arabic, which gradually replaced Coptic. (Coptic--Ethiopia)Black Egyptians were eventually mixed with invading Libyans, Persians, Greeks, Romans, Turks, Arabs and Western Europeans. That is where the mixed people of the modern-day Arabs come from. And of course you have the hyksos invasion. The Hyksos were composed of a number of Semitic peoples driven from Western Asia into Africa by instability and famine during the Second Intermediate Period around dynasties thirteen thru seventeen the so called shepherd kings.They were finally driven out by king ahmose the first the founder of the eighteen dynasty. Go ahead read The African Origin of Civilization: by: Cheikh Anta Diop and the Destruction of Black Civilization by chancelor williams. So you see stefia all those people are nothing but invaders and not the indigneous wooly haired africans. So save your eurotwisting conjecture okay.

    I already went over the berbers and moors with you in another thread can you give me something besides your opinion"


    [​IMG]

    OK, how to reply to all that...
    Well first yes it was just my opinion, not a statement of fact, that's why I didn't begin what I said a different way, but started with 'I thought' - when people start a sentence like that it sorta implies they're saying something that isn't supposed to be taken as necessarily true....

    Second, is there like some new rule that says I have to give evidence to back up every opinion or thought that I have while everybody else can just make statements of fact without showing their evidence - like in your reply you made a whole lot of statements of fact, like "Arabs invaded Egypt in the 7th Century AD" - now you may well be 100% right with these statements, but you didn't show me any evidence - I'm just expected to believe you. People do this all the time, they just state things at me and I'm just supposed to take them as true. Now if I did that with everyone's comments on here I'd have to accept that I'm 2/3 artificial since apparently white people aren't actually human, but some weird artificial creations, I'd have to accept that I can never have any kind of spiritual life unlike my sisters because they came out with lots of melanin in their skin and I didn't etc etc etc

    Third, will you stop with all this 'eurotwisting' / eurocentric nonsense - you really think all the white folks in Europe are going to be jumping up and down with joy if some mulatto girl tells them that white asiatic (not European) people used to be ruled by black people in Ancient Egypt - no, they won't, instead what I'll get is all the usual cr*p I get from them about me being all Afrocentric!

    Fourth, yes you did go through the Berbers with me in that other thread, but other people on that thread disagreed with you - Blackbird said Berbers must be black since the Berber language is Afro-asiatic, now that's one of the reasons you're giving for the ancient Egyptians being black, so if it works for one group of people as evidence, why doesn't it work for both groups?....

    Fifth, I know you think I'm about as bright as a 20 watt light bulb, but I'm not like a total retard, I don't actually think that Ancient Egyptians looked like the Arabs who live their now...

    Sixth, now I didn't give any facts, true, but I did post this picture - now what's going on with this picture in particular - me, with my 20 watt airhead brain looks at it and sees a black woman of some importance, a noblewoman, queen maybe having her hair fixed by some pale, pasty girl while another pale, pasty girl hands her a comb. So me being as dim as I am looks at it and thinks ahh, so black people had white servants to do all the boring jobs they didn't want to do, just like today English people get Polish people to do the cleaning and serve your coffee at Starbucks. Now this isn't just an isolated picture, there are hundreds, thousands even of similar wall paintings. So what's going on - are the two white girls really invaders?, has some white guy gone around with a little pot of paint painting over black people and making them pink? - cause if he did he was a real dumb white guy cause he surely should have painted the queen pink and left the servants black. So my evidence for my whacky theory is all those wall paintings. Plus to me it makes perfect sense - you're talking about a country right up in the corner of Africa right next to white asiatic people - surely you would have had some movement backwards and forwards, asian ambassadors, asian merchants etc - so why not asian servants - maybe the pay was better in Egypt, maybe they were captured by the Egyptians in battles, maybe some of these merchants married local girls. I mean if Romans had black soldiers and a black Emperor why is it so far fetched that Egyptians had white folk in their army or as their servants? Now maybe it even went further than that cause I remember seeing these two statues of Nofret and Rahotep her husband (who was a high priest) - now if that isn't a pale, pasty white woman then I seriously need some hard evidence to explain why not....

    [​IMG]

    Lastly, what is this thing I'm getting with black folk and Egypt - like why is it so important to people that every Egyptian was black? - I mean you've got lots of African civilisations throughout history with fantastic art, culture and so on, like Nubia for a start which many scientists believe predates Egypt, and I've never seen anything to suggest a single one of them wasn't black. Plus almost all of us have ancestors from west Africa - so why aren't people more interested in Tenkamenin than in Tutankhamen?

    Now I'm sorry if this all comes out as some kind of rant or if the tone sounds rude, but that's what I end up sounding like if I think people are singly me out for grief and just trying to make fun of me.
     
  5. Zim

    Zim Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    That last image is a forgery.
     
  6. StefiA

    StefiA Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    @Zim

    "That last image is a forgery."

    Of course the statue might be a forgery, that's a possibility, though we need some evidence of it being a forgery, like carbon dating, paint analysis etc. From what I've read her parents are unknowns - so there is the possibility she's a foreign princess married to an Egyptian as a contract between her people and Egypt - anyways that's just speculation....
    Besides despite what some people believe I'm not arguing along some Eurocentric idea that the Egyptian royal family had any white in them necessarily or that the ruling class wasn't black - all I'm saying is I think (note - 'I' think - not this is true) from pretty much the beginning there were pale people in Egypt too - probably holding low status jobs, servants, foot soldiers, stall holders that kind of thing - and I don't see what would be so terrible if that were the case. :10500: To me the important thing is that black people ran the place, for black people - a few pasty underlings wouldn't effect anything.
     
  7. Clyde C Coger Jr

    Clyde C Coger Jr going above and beyond PREMIUM MEMBER

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    In the Spirit of Sankofa and Peace and Love!




    Welcome to Destee.com, StefiA...also, you may find these links helpful in sorting out proof concerning the forgery of 'Nofret and Rahotep.'



    http://destee.com/forums/showpost.php?p=599495&postcount=26
    http://destee.com/forums/showpost.php?p=599513&postcount=27
    http://destee.com/forums/showpost.php?p=604275&postcount=40
    http://destee.com/forums/showpost.php?p=604330&postcount=41
    http://destee.com/forums/showpost.php?p=604874&postcount=53
    http://destee.com/forums/showpost.php?p=606364&postcount=56

     
  8. StefiA

    StefiA Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    @Clyde Coger
    So is the color difference in all these paintings you reckon just down to stylism? Or is that just when showing married couples? Am I making some fundamental error in thinking the paintings of pale, pasty girls are exactly that or are servants just painted white to show they're servants? Basically I guess it comes down to the question are the paintings supposed to be realistic or not?
     
  9. Clyde C Coger Jr

    Clyde C Coger Jr going above and beyond PREMIUM MEMBER

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    In the Spirit of Sankofa and Peace and Love!




    Basically yes...The problem is profound and involves a delineation of color through time lines. In other words, history would have to pin point the details of mutation, which question has never been asked of history.

    Suffice it to say that Mt DNA has come close without providing the actual point at which mutation occurred, in my view.

     
  10. StefiA

    StefiA Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    @Clyde Coger
    Sorry I really didn't understand that reply - are you saying that people hadn't gone white by the time of the Egyptians or that we don't know if they had or something completely different - sorry I just have problems with comprehension at times and I'm a bit lost as to what you're meaning.
     
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