Black Spirituality Religion : There Will Be No Rapture & Jesus Is Not Coming Back - Pastor Dr. Ray Hagins

Discussion in 'Black Spirituality / Religion - General Discussion' started by RAPTOR, Aug 4, 2014.

  1. RAPTOR

    RAPTOR Well-Known Member MEMBER

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  2. UBNaturally

    UBNaturally Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Hagins: "There's actually a verse in the Bible that says, people will do harm to you thinking that they do God a service"

    Hagins uses the Bible at times to explain some of his observations.

    "I love you, I really dooo" ... started sounding like Aaron Hall for a minute

    "There will be no rapture, and Jesus is not coming back" Repeats 2 times for the added effect

    "THE BIBLE SAYS THAT THERE WILL BE NO RAPTURE AND JESUS IT NOT COMING BACK"​

    Just said that in a previous post... to some degree


    Will transcribe what he states:

    Millions of black people, are literally in a cage in their mind and that cage is called the great expectation of the believer (FAITH, in other words).​

    The only thing that gives them a reason for living (both of my grandparents lived into their 80s-90s, and they kept this reason and expectation)​

    Then commences to sing a song they he wrote and laughs about it afterwards, because it hadn't happened yet or he came in contact with the truth.

    The Biblical perspective is one point of view via a section of humanity.

    "We must be able family, if we are going to grow the army of liberated brothers and sisters... we must be equipped to go into their terrain, and rescue them."​

    "Rescue, not attack" ... "Rescue them in love" (Not in Ridicule)
    • Many in the forum could learn from this simply comment above

    Then he goes talking about a "J" not being around...

    Not sure if he was about to suggest simply "Jesus" is not his name.

    Three questions he asks:

    1. Is it possible that Jesus expected his Messianic kingdom to be established on Earth within his generation? ("He didn't because he didn't exist")
    2. Is it possible that Jesus thought that the end of the world was eminent because of a fulfillment of prophecy?
    3. Is it possible that what Christians teach is yet to come has already happened?

    Hagins: "Let's go to the book that you think that is says it is yet to come"

    Luk 21:31
    So likewise ye, when ye see these things come to pass, know ye that the kingdom of God is nigh at hand.

    He claims this means that the kingdom was coming "now", "near".​

    Luk 21:32
    Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled.

    He claims this means "generation" as in people alive then​

    Luk 21:33
    Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.

    Then

    Mat 24:34
    Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

    Mat 24:35
    Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

    He says on this, that ....

    ....I apologize, had to stop trying to figure out what he was doing, botching much of the language while I was thinking he went to a Seminary school to understand the basics of the text.

    Not sure why he presumes something is causing pain either, but trying to figure out how his interpretations come.

    Then he goes here...

    Mat 24:5
    For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.

    And claims the deception were those that came in his name, saying that his is Christ

    But doesn't follow up...

    Mat 24:11
    And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.

    This is referring to those that would use the name of "Jesus", for the claim that they are "prophets"... ahem... Paul.

    Pulpit Pimps are essentially related to this, as they use the context for their own namesake.



    Now, recall this comment from the above video

    Hagins: "We must be able family, if we are going to grow the army of liberated brothers and sisters... we must be equipped to go into their terrain, and rescue them."

    He is in the midst, on "their terrain", but I guess "rescue" means "don't pull the rug, but gently"





    Hagins:

    "What are we here for?"

    Audience members bellow out "Truth", "Clarity"

    Hagins responds:

    "Truth is relative"
    "Clarity, according to who?"

    "What are we supposed to be accomplishing?"

    "You know I don't like biting my tongue"

    "I don't to the thing of proving other people wrong"

    All I see is Africans, then some folks bring up Scipio Africanus... come on man stop being so deep (Unlike the "J" and the "Jesus" thingy)

    Hagins also makes this comment:

    "Everything is true in literature"

    But if you read this, it is true...

    Everything is true in literature... but not everything in literature is true.

    Had to add that to assist Brother Ray.

    Remember Ray gives honor to the African ancestors for giving various gifts and advancement to the world, well read this comment that he makes:

    "If they did or did not exist that aint really got any dog on thing to do with the power I have today"

    Now he wasn't referring to the African ancestors, but it was an interesting comment made when referring to the characters in the various texts of old.

    Ray is doing his thing, and more should have the courage to at least branch out and discover, but sometimes the observation of the process can be painful, where as other times it can be inspiring.

    Regardless, he doesn't bite his tongue, unless he is around people that he might offend.
     
  3. Clyde C Coger Jr

    Clyde C Coger Jr going above and beyond PREMIUM MEMBER

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    ...

    Painstakingly, I followed your assessment of the video after which comes this question; does
    Hagin ever support why there will be no rapture or why Jesus isn't returning?

    Nowhere in your assessment is it mentioned that Hagin supports the assertion that there will be no rapture, and/or Jesus isn't returning; with any biblical or extra biblical basis of fact.

    Neither could I find a citing of the actual scripture, which causes the common interpretation of a kind of rapture is to take place.

     
  4. willa

    willa Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Does Hagin have a god? Because if he does, he does not preach him/her. It appears he leans heavy on the Bible for something to say.
    Hagin states, Truth is relative.
    Clarity according to who? See? He doesn't even support his own god, if he has one.
    He seems to be a spinning top.
     
  5. willa

    willa Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Hagin has to lecture Jesus doesn't exist or the prophets, because he is an Apostate preacher. He NEEDS to justify that to himself. And he claims he is doing god? ... black family a favor. So, what is he putting in the place of Jesus? himself? What's the gospel (good news) about him? What are his beatitudes?

    Hagin says, "If they Jesus and the Apostles and Prophets did or did not exist...(So he just said he doesn't really know for sure. That isn't something that he is all that sure about. In other words he doesn't really believe his own words. Repeat: He doesn't really believe his own words. He goes on to say they don't compare to the power he's got.
    Wooo...man in trouble.
     
  6. UBNaturally

    UBNaturally Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Contrasting some of his videos does make my head hurt as he often uses the text within the Bible to convey the message that the Bible is pure fiction and that even the texts suggest that one should not have faith of something because it was 2000 years ago.

    He does this to bring forth "Truth" and "Rescue"

    He alludes to the "J" not being present so "Jesus" did not exist, but doesn't really point out this connection to his rejection of the existence.

    But he jumps to "Jesus is not coming back" and connects that to "Because Jesus never existed" ... (Because the J didn't exist, which he does not display this connection), though he brings up
    Yeshua Ha-Mashiach.

    But when asked about "Africa" vs. "Akebu Lan", he defers and claims "ok man stop being that deep, if I say I'm an Akebu Lanian, most folk are gonna say you a what?"

    • One could say "Africa" did/does not exist by the same connections.

    Well, wouldn't that be the opportunity to "Rescue" them as well?

    "We must be able family, if we are going to grow the army of liberated brothers and sisters... we must be equipped to go into their terrain, and rescue them."

    • Brother Hagins went into "their terrain" and didn't deny the prophets of Islam or the origins of it, instead he did not want to "rescue them" from the "delusion", at that time I suppose. Was he not equipped?

    His goal is to eliminate the supposed divisions within "black unity" by voiding the context of literary folklore, but not all folklore I pressume.

    This is where Brother Hagins is:

    The Yoruba respond to prayer with Ase, the divine and highly potent power with which Olodumare (God) created the universe and maintains its physical laws. The belief in the all-pervading power and presence of God endows the universe with a sacramental nature. The African view of the world is nourished by a cosmology that is founded on a Source Being, the Supreme God, and other divine beings that are associated with God. As God is the foundation of life, so nothing happens without God. God lives, God does not die, and so indeed humans do not die. Even when we do not occupy a touchable body, we still live on.

    But then again, he does not claim any particular theology, so he is probably more of an Anti-theist of sorts now after claiming to study many forms or literature.

    Just not sure why he goes to an event that is focused on Theological clarity and debate, to denounce the idea of clarifying it.

    "I don't care if you are a Christian, a Muslim, etc if it is working for you and helping you to making it through each day... Ase"​

    That was "at this point in his development" though, so not sure what point he is at now.
     
  7. Clyde C Coger Jr

    Clyde C Coger Jr going above and beyond PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Very good question willa, but I don't think you'll get an answer on that; unless the OP responds.

     
  8. Clyde C Coger Jr

    Clyde C Coger Jr going above and beyond PREMIUM MEMBER

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    ...

    Definitely a good point, willa. Check this out:

    The name of this video is "There Will Be No Rapture & Jesus Is Not Coming Back". The Holy Bible clearly states that what Christians are waiting for has already happened if it ever happened in the first place. Don't get mad at us for telling you the truth. We didn't write this document. This statement is based upon what The Holy Bible states. Dr. Hagins takes you step by step through verses in the Bible that makes it very easy to see.


    The above caption appears underneath the video posted in the OP, and points out, as you have, there's too much doubt to be sure, lol.

    When Hagin makes statements such as these, it seriously challenges his credibility, or it should.

     
  9. willa

    willa Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Thanks.....
     
  10. Clyde C Coger Jr

    Clyde C Coger Jr going above and beyond PREMIUM MEMBER

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