Black Relationships : There is no REAL black man shortage!

Discussion in 'Black Relationships' started by A007, Aug 16, 2003.

  1. A007

    A007 Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Many times I hear women say that there is a shortage of eligible, good, heterosexual, black men. Many believe the good ones are either taken or gay. The fact is that this is true only to the degree of expectations that women have for who they consider "good" black men to be.

    Women are leaving, passing up, blowing off, and dissing "good" black men one day and saying there is a shortage the next.

    First, let us TRY to define a "good" man. As I am sure there will be differences in opinion, I will include the charactoristics that are highest on the list. A good man is (in no certain order): single (for the purpose of this post), honest, loyal, secure (mentally), a good friend, intelligent, considerate, strong, fun, and employed.

    Now, I get an agreement from almost everyone woman presented with this list, however the differences come from PERSONAL PREFERENCE.

    These include, but are not limited to: tall, dark or light skinned, handsome, has money, has a college degree, has mucscles, is thin, is cool, has prestige, has a nice car, dresses nice, buys his woman things, and other superficial things.

    Now the point is that there are PLENTY of eligible GOOD black men out there but many women are looking for SUPER black men. The trash man and the man working at McDonald's are not 'good' enough. The overweight teacher is not 'good' enough. The nerdy accountant is not 'good' enough. The small business owner who is seen as cheap is not 'good' enough. The guy in the '94 ford escort is not 'good' enough. This list goes on and on.

    IMHO many women are searching for SUPER MAN and getting frustrated cuz they can't find him, when PRETTY DAM* GOOD MAN is trying to be apart of your life everyday and is just as frustrated at the constant rejection.

    Now the question I get most often when I offer this opinion is "WHY SHOULD I SETTLE?" My answer to that is either...don't considering it settling, consider it being open minded, or wait (but don't say there is a shortage of 'good' black men when you are disqualifying some daily) And now that I've read the post with the "man-sharing" I would say that a WHOLE GOOD man is better than HALF a SUPER man anyday...What do you all think?

    "people who are intent on finding gold will miss all of the diamonds they are surrounded by"
     
  2. Pharaoh Jahil

    Pharaoh Jahil Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Excellent Post A007! I agree with this 100%
     
  3. Deepa

    Deepa Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    First to address the shortage issue. Remember that there are more women than men in general, then when you consider the other factors like prisons, homosexuality, taken, not "man" material (ex. cheaters, street hustlers, giggolos etc.) and the rise in interracial dating, that does tend to take away from the availability pool.

    This is a double edged sword.

    On one side:

    One issue is women's choices of men. In one way, we are taught that men are the breadwinners, the moneymakers, the providers, the protectors, then on the otherhand, instead of looking at the reality of our environment we do what caucasian women do and fantasize rather than realize that a man can not be the "end all" "be all" of the relationship. As much as he offers we have to be able to return, many women don't. Then there are those who settle, believing they can mold a man rather than grow with him. Their eyes light up when they see a man who "appears" to offer some things that they want, but lacks in the most important areas.

    Self-esteem issues abound with these women who figure it is better to fight for half a man than release, and prepare themselves for a whole one. Which leads to another issue, coming into a relationship as part of a person looking to be completed. That puts a lot of stress on the other partner, women get good careers, have a great appearance, behave the right way. Doing all the superficial things society tells them to do, but neglect operating from the inside out, to do vice versa. Naming themselves as part of a religion but not developing spiritually, having "friends" but not really trusting them, reading a book about "How to Get a Black Man" rather than "How to Improve the Inner You".

    Sistas aren't checking each other enough, as mothers, daughters, sisters, aunts, grandmothers, cousins, friends we reinforce these behaviors among each other. Sistas have gained a competative nature that has strained our relations and caused us to reinforce the recycling of the same type of men they claim they don't want, by the way we interact with each other and the way we raise our children. Turning a blind eye to how we effect the community with our actions, instead hoping men will pick up the pieces and take us along for the ride. Dependency issues with a topping of socialization, makes for quite a nasty mix.

    We are constantly searching for something in a man, rather than finding it for ourselves. We are demanding the wrong things from men, diving deep in to the materialism pool hoping their is love at the bottom.

    The other edge of the sword you ask?:

    Men reinforce it. In the media, music, in real life, we constantly watch men stick out their chest to show who's got more (or better yet who's got game) to woo the women. Women walk around like shining china dolls adorned with what their man gave them to symbolize his worth and in turn, theirs. During a conversation with an interesting man, he feels the urge to mention "his ride", "his home" and what he could do for a woman materially, not as a way to say "this is what I have but it is only to show I have them not to make you want me", but as a beacon to come his way because he's got the goods. Then I wonder, why mention it at all at first, knowing that there are women who are going to dash to his heart for the cash.

    Women are encouraged to "dump that zero and get with a HERO". He'll save us as long as we look pretty and play our role. Which leads to men and their choices. Alright looking sista passes by, fairly attractive, nice, wanting more out of life than a Benz, then the "hot like fiyah" sista walks by, I would describe her characteristics but by the time his eyes have caught a glance the importance of those characteristics, good or bad, seem to sprout wings and fly away. Men tend to reinforce the perfect woman stereotype, which is actually an unfortunate comparison to caucasian standards for women.

    Paradoxal standards I'll add:

    Look good but don't act like you think you look good

    Be willing to be a housekeeper but don't look or act like one and don't complain

    Take care of the children but don't cut me out of the relationship

    Make your own money but don't go gold digging but don't talk about being able to be independent and be willing to let a man help you

    Let me be a man to make the decisions but don't expect me to do everything

    Always be a lady but be a freaknasty toughie when I want you to

    Stop looking for the superficial but stop getting with men who don't have anything

    Help me grow and build with me but don't try to change me

    Don't lump me in with all the other men but remember men are gonna do "men things"


    Are we suppose to do all of the above? If we do, don't be surprised at an increase in marital homicide rates.

    Fathers in an attempt to not see their babygirls with losers, try to instill the idea of a man with "something going for him" which usually translates to material wealth, not exactly being a good person, although most fathers would like that too, but how its conveyed doesn't always result in that interpretation. Family members and friends smile with glee as the man tauts his credentials, encouraging the woman to "stick with him, he's a winner".

    Remember the Cosby Show? It was suppose to be a positive role model family for "black america", yet it was one of the biggest proponents of a man having to do something "impressive" in order for the family to be accepting of him. That show was a bit corny, but shed light on our idealism in an attempt to fit into this culture, by accepting certain practices that were more about "good appearance" than being "good people".

    Sanford and Son was looked at as a show about "a garbage man" however it was socially conscious, had two examples of good men (Fred made me wonder sometimes), who didn't represent the middle-class idealist view of a "black family".

    I'll take Lamont over Theo, Alvin, or the military dude, any day.

    Of course making that choice has taken years of retraining my brain, my mother was pretty adament about not taking on societal ideals of the world, but I wasn't tryin to hear it, seemed so much easier to live that way.

    I have to add that simple preferences aren't bad, preferences based on superficial yearnings are. Everybody ain't meant to be attracted or want everybody, but one can expect to get what they don't want when they look for a hero or heroine and the picture of perfection because they don't exist, and the appearance of their existence is a warning that they aren't all that they seem.
     
  4. A007

    A007 Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Thank you, Jah.

    "Remember that there are more women than men in general, then when you consider the other factors like prisons, homosexuality, taken, not "man" material (ex. cheaters, street hustlers, giggolos etc.) and the rise in interracial dating, that does tend to take away from the availability pool."

    I agree, however when you consider the number of women who are taken, lesbian, emotionally or mentally unstable (maybe because of a man), gold digging, or only concerned with career, then we are pretty close to equal. All I am saying is that the percentage is maybe 55% good women to 45% good men. But people are making it seem like its more like 85% good women and only 15% good men.


    "We are constantly searching for something in a man, rather than finding it for ourselves. We are demanding the wrong things from men, diving deep in to the materialism pool hoping their is love at the bottom."

    I agree 100%. So does that leave the question of...What is the right thing to expect of men?
     
  5. Deepa

    Deepa Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    True. I'm one of those people who knows its not just 15%, but many times it appears to be that way. Appearances can be deceiving.

    Expectations, the same that men should expect from women, only what we can offer and are willing to receive.

    For realistic expectations, people will have to take these distorted visions and expectations of media induced socialized ideas of what being a man or woman in a relationship is about and toss them out with the rest of the garbage.

    Will most do it? No.

    Can it be done? Yes.
     
  6. triniti424

    triniti424 Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    no offense my brotha but uhhh...who have YOU been talkin to?lol
     
  7. Sekhemu

    Sekhemu Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Deepa, I want to congratula you for exposing some serious problems that both black men, and women really need to address. We can volley the percentages as long as we want... and I do agree the pool of "eligilibity" is probably closer than most would suggest.

    I humbly suggest that the solution to this problem, starts with being true to yourself, doing a bit of serious soul searching.

    Far too many of us cannot or find it difficult to be sincere with each other.

    In a word many of us replace character and courage, with false bravado and being evasive.
     
  8. A007

    A007 Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    "no offense my brotha but uhhh...who have YOU been talkin to?lol"

    lol...if i were to name names would it help?
    So does this mean that you believe there IS a 'shortage' of good black men? OR that you WOULD consider one of the "good" men I mentioned that many women are disregarding?

    If so, please tell us why you feel this way. I could be dead wrong! (but like charles barkley) I doubt it (lol).
     
  9. NNQueen

    NNQueen going above and beyond PREMIUM MEMBER

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    A007, you wrote, "I agree 100%. So does that leave the question of...What is the right thing to expect of men?"

    Based on what Deepa wrote and I agree with you both completely, the important questions for me are, "What expectations do I have of myself; what am I willing to give and what do I believe that I deserve to receive?
     
  10. A007

    A007 Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Queen wrote--"What expectations do I have of myself; what am I willing to give and what do I believe that I deserve to receive?

    Even though those are GREAT and important questions.....how does it help a woman choose a 'good' man. Or..does the question of "what do I believe that I deserve to receive?" include the common requirements of... looks, education, income, etc.?
     
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