Black People : The Star-Spangled Banner: The Missing Verse

[RAPTOR]

"Hireling" was a derogatory term for a mercenary, someone who fought for pay. They were not looked upon favorably.

I didn't mean to offend with the "so what" remark. My point is even if what this thread claims is true (and I don't see it): A literally never used verse of a song written by a white slave owner over 200 years ago, generations before slavery was abolished, reveals he didn't really care for blacks fighting for the enemy, I say...what's the significance?

I provided a link as a source. (Did you click on the link?) Given the source, I say he did care about enslaved afrikans fighting for the brits.

Yt's thought they were doing afrikans a favor by dragging them into 'civilization. After all they
have done for the coloreds and fighting on the side of the brits is how the repay the enslavers,
-that was the sentiment he expressed.

Now,
If you have a source to the contrary, and not mere speculation, I
am open to it.

 

[KMeister]

I provided a link as a source. (Did you click on the link?) Given the source, I say he did care about enslaved afrikans fighting for the brits.

Yt's thought they were doing afrikans a favor by dragging them into 'civilization. After all they
have done for the coloreds and fighting on the side of the brits is how the repay the enslavers,
-that was the sentiment he expressed.

Really? Please quote the words in the Star Spangled Banner in which Key expresses those sentiments. I admit to knowing nothing about verses 2-4 of the song because we never sing them, so I would be very interested to read words that indicate what you purport in the lyrics.

Now,
If you have a source to the contrary, and not mere speculation, I
am open to it.

I did click on the link and actually agreed with you that Key (a slaveowner) didn't care for slaves running off and fighting for the Brits--or hirelings (white mercenaries) fighting for the Brits either. But the lyrics of the song clearly states that the hireling and slave would find no refuge from (1) running away after getting their butts kick or (2) getting killed.

No refuge could save the hireling and slave
From the terror of flight or the gloom of the grave

Still, this was over 200 years ago. We don't sing the third verse of the song, so what's the point?

 

[RAPTOR]

Really? Please quote the words in the Star Spangled Banner in which Key expresses those sentiments. I admit to knowing nothing about verses 2-4 of the song because we never sing them, so I would be very interested to read words that indicate what you purport in the lyrics.

I did click on the link and actually agreed with you that Key (a slaveowner) didn't care for slaves running off and fighting for the Brits--or hirelings (white mercenaries) fighting for the Brits either. But the lyrics of the song clearly states that the hireling and slave would find no refuge from (1) running away after getting their butts kick or (2) getting killed.

No refuge could save the hireling and slave
From the terror of flight or the gloom of the grave

Still, this was over 200 years ago. We don't sing the third verse of the song, so what's the point?

"What's the point"... of what exactly? Stop beating around the bush. What are you asking me specifically?

Now then:

You keep saying 'did not care' as if it was one of those 'I'm not thrilled, but I'm not going to get
all worked up over it' kind of expression. So for clarity's sake, I say key had contempt for those
who would fight on the side of the brits, enough write those words in the poem.

And what do you mean quote the banner? I quoted the piece, highlighted in blue that part and interpreted
that part as it relate to events and situations in history from which that piece in the song/poem
had sprang from. Key was offended that the afrikans would fight with the british 'after all yt's have
done for them "subhumans"'. Not just the mere running away of enslaved people.

The enslaved afrikans "ran off' with the brits because they fought with the brits as I have
said. Check the history regarding afrikans fighting with the brits. The brits lost the war yet had the
decency to take those afrikans who fought on the side of the brits away from the 13 colonies,
for they knew there would be retribution.

No, Key did not say those words exact words, for it is/was a poem in origin. Poems do
not always express in detail, verbatim all that they mean. So to understand some poems
and in this case, the verse in a poem, one has to know/understand the time place space and
conditions for which that poem was written in order to give such an account.

Are you familiar with "ring around the rosy"..., assuming you do not have to go
off and google for its meaning, then return like you knew what that poem entailed
all along:

Well, thanks to brotha info-moetry, a member here on Destee.com, for whom
I've learned the background to the song, had to do with the bubonic (sp) plague
in europe and how it impacted those people. I would not have known had brotha
info not break that down.

So given all that, your looking for actual non-poetic words by key that couples what
I've interpreted tells me that you do not understand.

Or,

You may have a different interpretation which is why I asked that you render sources
to the contrary, that I can better 'see' where you are coming from, even if there is a
chance that I would decide to stand by my explanation of that piece that I posted.

But again: "What's the point"... of what exactly? Stop beating around the bush. What are you asking me specifically?

 

[KMeister]

"What's the point"... of what exactly? Stop beating around the bush. What are you asking me specifically?

Now then:

You keep saying 'did not care' as if it was one of those 'I'm not thrilled, but I'm not going to get
all worked up over it' kind of expression. So for clarity's sake, I say key had contempt for those
who would fight on the side of the brits, enough write those words in the poem.

And what do you mean quote the banner? I quoted the piece, highlighted in blue that part and interpreted
that part as it relate to events and situations in history from which that piece in the song/poem
had sprang from. Key was offended that the afrikans would fight with the british 'after all yt's have
done for them "subhumans"'. Not just the mere running away of enslaved people.

The enslaved afrikans "ran off' with the brits because they fought with the brits as I have
said. Check the history regarding afrikans fighting with the brits. The brits lost the war yet had the
decency to take those afrikans who fought on the side of the brits away from the 13 colonies,
for they knew there would be retribution.

No, Key did not say those words exact words, for it is/was a poem in origin. Poems do
not always express in detail, verbatim all that they mean. So to understand some poems
and in this case, the verse in a poem, one has to know/understand the time place space and
conditions for which that poem was written in order to give such an account.

Are you familiar with "ring around the rosy"..., assuming you do not have to go
off and google for its meaning, then return like you knew what that poem entailed
all along:

Well, thanks to brotha info-moetry, a member here on Destee.com, for whom
I've learned the background to the song, had to do with the bubonic (sp) plague
in europe and how it impacted those people. I would not have known had brotha
info not break that down.

So given all that, your looking for actual non-poetic words by key that couples what
I've interpreted tells me that you do not understand.

Or,

You may have a different interpretation which is why I asked that you render sources
to the contrary, that I can better 'see' where you are coming from, even if there is a
chance that I would decide to stand by my explanation of that piece that I posted.

But again: "What's the point"... of what exactly? Stop beating around the bush. What are you asking me specifically?

I didn't see my responses as beating around the bush. Two hundred years ago slavery existed, blacks were enslaved, even presidents owned slavery or had been slave owners. Life was not good for black people. Over 200 years ago Frances Scott Key wrote the lyrics to a song that later became our country's national anthem. He wrote four verses but we never sing anything but the first verse.

Now here's the meat of the matter: In the third verse Key wrote something to the effect that white mercenaries and former black slaves would flee or die from attacking the United States. I don't understand why this bit of trivia means anything worthy of posting a thread about it because I don't see anying significant about it. So I keep asking: So what? Why should anyone care about this?

 

[RAPTOR]

...I don't see anying significant about it...

Finally, the chase you decided to cut to.
So the best thing to do in that sense, is to move along.
There are plenty threads where which I feel the same
way, however I do not engage a thread to say how
insignificant it is. For the response will be mostly
likely, "Then why are you here?"

Because I did not create this thread with you in mind,
it is okay that you "don't see anying about it".