Black People : The right side of the immigration debate

I don't really have an opinion on the issue. I can understand the issue tax payer dollars being used to pay for medical cost et al for "illegals".

On the other hand I'm sure we have enough pork in state and federal budgets to offset these expenditures.

The states with the highest percentages of illegal immigrants are struggling the most financially. California is a prime example.

However there's one thing that we seem to be forgetting, and that is the vast majority of mexican "illegals" are of 1st nation descent.

Arizona, new mexico, nevada, texas and california are their ANCESTRAL lands. Incidentally california was named for the california indians, many of whom are black.

Large contingents of their ancestors were forced to leave these respective states for mexico.

Something worth considering

If you purchased a home in Arizona, would you allow mexicans to have free access to that home because it is their ANCESTRAL land? Would you allow them to come into your house and go into your refrigerator and remove your resources because it is on their ancestral lands?

The fact is if the united states vacated texas, arizona, new mexico, navada, and california and gave it back to mexico, they would still cross the new border for the opportunities that exist in the United States. It is not about geographic location, it is about economic opportunity. Mexico simply does not provide its people economic opportunity...this is related to the WAY the country is run, not the geographic location of the country.
 
And to where would we be sending money? Our family here in the US or long lost family that we don't even know in Africa?


I more or less take your stance on immegration, but maybe some kind of border patrol is needed? Or better border patrol not just for Mexicans but other illegals as well. I don't think I want an open border policy where everyone and anyone can walk, run, or boat over. That could create overcrowding and stretch our resources to the limit.

I don't really know. I don't feel in competition with any illegal immigrant, but with everyone that is under-employed and unemployed... legal or non, US or non. All I can do is better myself and try to make myself more marketable in that respect. I don't think we can blame illegals for taking jobs when they are here in the United States when we aren't trying to blame the white folks and NAFTA for taking jobs overseas. To me that is worse for jobs and employment than illegals trying to get work.

I might get angry when a poor person undermines my ability to work and be employed by offering himself to get paid less money than me.... but I can't blame him. I'd do the same thing. Just like I wouldn't blame people who go work where folks are on strike - they need money and they need to work just like I do.

A compromise... if one is really wanted... should be able to be had somewhere.
I just don't think the governments that be are willing to compromise... and I'm thinking maybe it's more on the Mexican government or any governments that oppresses it's people economically that they have to run from their country, even put their lives in danger... to get here or to the west.

Ok so i see you missed the point i ws trying to make which is why is mentioned 'sankofa' and 'repatriation'. Folks who believe in these two concepts should already be practicing what they preach. Folks been operating in pan african framework going on 200 years so those ties to Africa should already be made. Furthermore, you question assumes that every one of us on this website is 'american'. when i speak of 'black folks' its always from a global context regardless of location. so this is why i recognize its not just 'mexicans' working in the imperial country sending money home. africans in us from ethiopia, ghana, nigeria, south aftrica, etc are doing the same thing. if ya aint got a african people to relate to where you can call home adopt one. as far as border patrol is considered that already exists. ever travel through arizona, new mexico or texas east of elpaso? once you take the 10 out of el paso towards san antonio/houston its like a militarized zone with state troopers pulling over suspected smugglers and traffikers 24/7. then there are the knucklehead minutemen. all this has become is a front for white militia groups to organize under the cover and protection of the right wingnut law enforcement officials.

i wonder when folks will realize that when they blame other countries of oppressing their own people that the countries in question are basically puppet client state of us capitalism which extends its hegemonic influence over these puppet states and when they try to deviate from the ameriklan influence they get knocked out like bishop in grenada, noriega in panama, and aristide in haiti.
 
Ignorance truly is bliss. That my black brothaa and sistahs would display such ignorance is amazing. I am an American born in this country. Your country occupied mine and when they needed cannon fodder for there bs wars, they gave us "citizenship." I pay taxes, I went to public school, evrything else that all Americans do. Now, if I am in Arizona I will have to carry proof of my citizenship? F.U.!!!
More Puerto Ricans have died protecting this country - as a percentage of our population - than anyone else. Not far behind are mexican Americans. I have an old Korean dude in my class who told me that in Korea, amongst old vets, there is profound respect for the bravery of those Puerto Ricans that fought in that war. And now we have to worry about getting thrown in jail if we can't satisfy the local krakka sheriff? F.U.!!
Black Americans of all people should see what this is, it is aparthied, straight up. You are a disgrace to your self, your people and humanity. I worked on a dept. of labor study for 5 years and employers from all over the country said they hire Mexicans because they are the only ones willing to work! If you are an American and you are cleaning hotel rooms, working in a chicken factory or picking oranges you are a loser! a drug addict or something. Taking jobs from black people? Please. No one owes you nothin. If you can't compete with someone who doesn't even speak the language, you are an idiot!
But all of that is secondary. If you think this is good law, you are a fools fool. You are the same fool who complains of driving while black, but have no problem with me being subjected to driving while brown. You are a hypocrite!! I expect such hypocrisy from the likes of Full Speed, the white wonder.
But the rest of you? Incredible. Stinkin Hypocrites.

In all respect, please excuse me from this generalization. I am the one who likened this situation to apartheid and the passbook laws.

I am down for one world solution. A world without borders. You see, ia am on record taking heat here because i dont fear the chinese, the mexicans, the arabs, or anyone else for that matter because my perspective is internationalist, not micro-nationalist and for sure you never hear or see me refer as an 'american'. my ancestors were captured and brought here, or they were here before columbus and they were exterminated by the europeans and those who survived had arbitrary lines drawn through their villages dividing families and these families today are on both sides of these borders and the us/mexico dynamic is similar to the sa/zimbabwe dynamic. americans blame the mexicans and south africans blame the zimbabweans. same ish different demographic. but the dynamics are identical.

last point i dont think its fair to label all of us hypocrites but thats kool i wont take it personal. if i take the bible literally it says all hypocrites and liars will be destroyed. this is one issue which stands to destroy the two party system because without latino support the right wingers will never win a national election unless they get enough black and asian folks to support their right wing agenda.

i aint never been no minuteman and never will be. but i can only speak for myself. peace.
 
The BS that illegal workers use up government services and cost us money is straight up BS! Studies have been done by OUR GOVERNMENT that show that for every dollar spent on illegal immigrants, like $1.50 is made. In addition, as i said, i worked on a longitudinal GOVERNMENT research project. It is a fact that most illegal immigrants pay taxes! It is part of the game, fools! They use bogus socila security numbers and employers deuct taxes. then at tax time, the irs sends the employers a letter with the names of workers whose ss numbers don't match up. The employers "fire" them, they come back the next day and the game continues. Of course, they do not receive many of the benefits of these taxes that they pay. for instance, no unemployment, or disability. or social security. another GOVERNMENT study found that the government had been putting the taxes paid by illegals into social security into a savings account, basically. This money grew so large, the government started tapping into it, and it was found that this money was keeping s.s. solvent!
Ignorance is ugly. Ignorance based on racist feelings is f'd up. Black people aligning with whites in racist demagogery is beyond the pale. You make me sick to my stomach. As bro Omowalejabali has said, the government is gearing up for the police state. the evidence is there for all to see. just connect the dots. Mama Zogbe has been on top of it. go to her site and check her posts.
This is part of an overall plan. Today Mexicans, tommorow your black ***.

Been down this road before...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_Proposition_187_(1994)

Along with the rapid increase in the Latino population in California, some analysts cite Governor Wilson's and the Republican Party's embrace of Proposition 187 as a cause of the rapid decline in the ability of the party to win statewide elections

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_Proposition_209_(1996)


Now this what the did in cali. divided black and brown community organizers on immigration issue in 1994, and this was around election of mandela in south africa, so attention was diverted from anti-apartheid movement to immigration reform. keep in mind this was also after the la insurrection after the rodney king case.

then they come with prop 209. what are the effects of 209?

While African American graduation rates at UC Berkeley increased by 6.5 percent, the enrollment rates dropped significantly. Criticism was made of the fact that of the 4,422 students in UCLA's freshman class of 2006, only 100 (2.26%) were African American. In fact, opponents of Proposition 209 note that there are greater disparities in elite education in the post-Proposition 209 era due to decreased African American and Latino enrollment. Proponents, on the other hand, note that Asian American enrollment rates dramatically increased at a majority of UC campuses.

i can understand where some black folks stand where they do on this issue but it down make their stand correct looking at the larger picture.

there is a historical pattern i see clearly living in cali so all i can do is make plans to safeguard me and mine knowing that if they got plans against immigrants, they also getting ready for a movida against black folks as well.

this entire black/brown dichotomy is driven by the capitalist media propaganda machine and threads like this prove how effective this machine is even among the 'conscious' community.
 
I don't really have an opinion on the issue. I can understand the issue tax payer dollars being used to pay for medical cost et al for "illegals".

On the other hand I'm sure we have enough pork in state and federal budgets to offset these expenditures.

However there's one thing that we seem to be forgetting, and that is the vast majority of mexican "illegals" are of 1st nation descent.

Arizona, new mexico, nevada, texas and california are their ANCESTRAL lands. Incidentally california was named for the california indians, many of whom are black.

Large contingents of their ancestors were forced to leave these respective states for mexico.

Something worth considering

yeah and them ancestors guiding their posterity to reclaim those lands and i for one aint got no problem with that since some of my ancestors are also 1st Nation peoples. my identification is from aztlan to azania, its all one people and one struggle.

i was watching a pbs program the other night and it was on the southwest. it mentioned how the federal government divided the 1st Nations people by dividing the 4 corners right at the point of the center.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_Corners

This is basically Navajo land that we are talking about and this includes the territory in Arizaona. Navajo lands are rich in oil. Same as in Mexico. The imperialists were searching for the gold of Cibola that they never found but they later discovered oil. This is the wealth of today. The right wingers aint concerned about losing jobs or drug trafficking. Its the right wingers who are profiting most from drug trade anyway.

babylon is falling and i won't be a one in the multitude trying to save a nation doomed to its own prophetic rhetoric.
 

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