Black Spirituality Religion : The Quran says you must believe in Jesus.

Discussion in 'Black Spirituality / Religion - General Discussion' started by CrunchyStuff, Apr 27, 2003.

  1. CrunchyStuff

    CrunchyStuff Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Al-i Imran (chapter 3).

    When Allah said: O Jesus, I shall cause thee to die and exalt thee in My Presence and clear thee of those who disbelieve and make those who follow thee above those who disbelieve, to the day of Resurrection. Then to Me is your return, so I shall decide between you concerning that wherein you differ (3:54).

    The Quran states here quite simply that all who disbelieve in Jesus will have to answer for it.

    It also states that all of those who follow Jesus will be superior to those who do not follow Jesus.

    The Quran also of course backs up all of the Christian claims about Jesus being born to a Virgin. About Jesus being a Messenger of God. About Jesus being sinless. About Jesus being "begotten" by God and not by man.

    Etc, etc. I didn't post them verses.

    That said, let us understand it in light of the African Situtation. We have to the north of the Sahel people who follow the Quran, which in their Holy Book, they must follow Jesus and their Holy book says that believers in Jesus are superior.

    And then we have to the south of the Sahel people who follow the Bible, which of course is about Jesus from Genesis to Revelation.

    We have in Jesus a unifying factor that would unite all of Africa.

    As Jesus says: If I be lifted up, I shall draw all men to me.

    All Muslims should believe in Jesus and thus there is the potential to unify All of Africa.

    If not we can at least work with the majority of Africans below the sahel who believe in Jesus.
     
  2. Aqil

    Aqil Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    No Ofense, But Muslims Love Jesus As Much As Christians Do...

    By John Casey

    Some years ago an agnostic friend of mine married a Jewish woman who practiced her faith seriously. He took instruction in Judaism and seemed quite likely to convert - but eventually did not. His chief reason was that he remained agnostic. But there was another obstacle that surprised even himself: "I found that I just did not want to give up Jesus."

    In European culture, there is no getting away from Jesus even if you are agnostic. True, Nietzsche tried to reject him with detestation and contempt, calling him an "idiot"; a purveyor of a sick, decadent view of the world. Nietzsche thought that the only figure in the New Testament who commands respect is Pontius Pilate. Yet the very ferocity of Nietzsche's onslaught on Jesus showed how strong in his heart was the image he wanted to destroy.

    Now what if my friend had married a Muslim? The interesting thing is that he could have kept Jesus - not the Jesus who was the Son of God, admittedly, and who was crucified, but certainly the Jesus who was Messiah and miracle worker, who conversed regularly with God - who was born of a virgin and who ascended into heaven.

    Jesus is referred to quite often in the Qur'an (Muslim holy book) six times under the title "Messiah." Yet I had long-supposed that the importance of Jesus as prophet in Muslim tradition was not much more than a matter of lip-service, something to which Muslims gave (to use Cardinal Newman's distinction) "notional" rather than "real" assent.

    This impression was strengthened when I went to Ur of the Chaldees in southern Iraq and visited the so-called house of Abraham. It is only a few piles of sun-baked mud bricks, but you would have expected hundreds of Muslim Arabs to be visiting the birthplace of their Patriarch. I saw none - whereas the shrines of Muslim martyrs in Najaf and Kerbala were thronged. I assumed, therefore, that Jesus must be a marginal figure in the Muslim world.

    How wrong this assumption was I have learned by reading a fascinating and instructive book, The Muslim Jesus, by the Cambridge academic Tarif Khalidi. Professor Khalidi has brought together, from a vast range of sources, most of the stories, sayings and traditions of Jesus that are to be found in Muslim piety from the earliest times.

    The Muslim Jesus is an ascetic, a man of voluntary poverty, humility and long-suffering. He literally turns the other cheek, allowing his face to be slapped twice in order to protect two of his disciples. He teaches the return of good for evil: "Jesus used to say, 'Charity does not mean doing good to him who does good to you... Charity means that you should do good to him who does you harm.' "

    He loves the poor and embraces poverty: "The day Jesus was raised to heaven, he left behind nothing but a woolen garment, a slingshot and two sandals." He preaches against attachment to worldly things: "Jesus said, 'He who seeks worldly things is like the man who drinks sea water: the more he drinks, the more thirsty he becomes, until it kills him.'"

    Many of the sayings of the Muslim Jesus are clearly derived from Biblical sources - "Place your treasures in heaven, for the heart of man is where his treasure is"; "Look at the birds coming and going! They neither reap nor plough, and God provides for them." Sometimes there is a sort of gloss on words of Jesus from the Gospel: "Oh disciples, do not cast pearls before swine, for the swine can do nothing with them...wisdom is more precious than pearls and whomever rejects wisdom is worse than a swine."

    He is certainly a wonder-worker. He often raises the dead, and gives his disciples power to do the same. More than once he comes across a skull and restores it to life; on one occasion granting salvation to a person who had been damned. The skulls, like everyone else in these stories, address Jesus as "Spirit of God." Once he is even addressed as "Word of God."

    I once had a conversation with members of Hizbollah in Beirut. One of them said this: "The greatness of Islam is that we combine Judaism and Christianity. Jesus freed enslaved hearts; he was able to release human feeling; to reveal a kingdom of peace. Jesus's realm was the realm of the soul. Jesus is soul; Moses is mind - the mind of the legislator. In Islam, we interweave both."

    This is certainly the Jesus of these stories - the Jesus of the mystical Sufi tradition. The great Muslim philosopher Al-Ghazali actually called Jesus "Prophet of the Heart."

    The Muslim Jesus is not divine, but a humble servant of God. He was not crucified - Islam insists that the story of the killing of Jesus is false. He is, as it were, Jesus as he might have been without St. Paul or St. Augustine or the Council of Nice. He is not the cold figure of English unitarianism, and he is less grand than the exalted human of the Aryans. As you read these stories, what comes across most powerfully is that the Muslim Jesus is intensely loved. There is an element of St. Francis of Assisi in them.

    It is good to be reminded, especially now, of the intimate connections there have been between Islam and Christianity, and how close in spirit Muslim and Christian piety can come to each other. Curiously enough, the Muslim Jesus, shorn of all claims of divinity, could be more easily held onto by my agnostic friend than the Second Person of the Holy Trinity.

    One other thing: Since Muslims deny the crucifixion, their emphasis has been on the wonders surrounding "the birth of Jesus, Son of Mary," born as his mother sat under a palm tree, and miraculously speaking from within the womb.

    There really is no reason why schools that put on Nativity plays, or anyone who wants to insist on the Christian meaning of Christmas, should fear that they may offend Muslim sensibilities, for Jesus really is shared by both faiths...
     
  3. CrunchyStuff

    CrunchyStuff Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Aqil,

    The Bible:
    Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.


    The Quran:

    Say: The angel of death, who is given charge of you, shall cause you to die, then to your Lord you will be returned.(32:11).

    When Allah said: O Jesus, I shall cause thee to die and exalt thee in My Presence and clear thee of those who disbelieve and make those who follow thee above those who disbelieve, to the day of Resurrection. Then to Me is your return, so I shall decide between you concerning that wherein you differ (3:54).

    If Muslims believe as their Quran shows that Jesus was raised from the dead, then they are saved if they confess Jesus with their mouth.
     
  4. Aqil

    Aqil Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Saved??? From what??? You mean like saved, sanctified, filled with the holy ghost and speaking in tongues as the spirit gives the utterance...?
     
  5. CrunchyStuff

    CrunchyStuff Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Aqil,

    I have heard Muslim scholars talk about the fact that in the Quran only two people are sinless: God and Jesus. Not even Mohammed was shown as sinless in the Quran.
     
  6. j'hiah

    j'hiah Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Crunchy Stuff,

    ln the Quran, l have read the same thing and then much more, giving Jesus titles like 'Messiah' 'Word of God' 'Sinless'.... admitting his virgin birth, etc....

    .... and still the muslims, in their inane theology want to undermine his Exaltation to just 'a great teacher'/ 'a great prophet'...

    l think, with a laugh of unbelief "they have got to be kidding me"
    especially since in their own basis of belief (Quran), it has written these things about Jesus which are unnaturally fit for any man on earth....

    it's funny.

    Jesus is the 'Word of God'. The 'Word of God' lives.... eternally.
     
  7. Aqil

    Aqil Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    The Holy Qur'an also states that Prophet Muhammad ibn Abdullah (saw) is the Prophet of Islam...a fact you seem to intentionally overlook in your mendacious zeal to discredit the religion...
     
  8. CrunchyStuff

    CrunchyStuff Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    J'hiah,

    Nobody else ever born on the earth, can claim to be sinless and without faults except Jesus Christ.

    That is why He is the King of Kings and the Lord of Lords.
     
  9. Aqil

    Aqil Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    You were born sinless and without fault, Crunchy...what sin and/or fault had you committed in your mother's womb?
     
  10. j'hiah

    j'hiah Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Aqil :nono:

    you have sinned on earth unlike Jesus Christ is what this means

    you're not dumb.... you know what he meant. :rolleyes:
     
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