Black Christians : The Problem with the NIV (New International Version) Bible

Discussion in 'Christian Study Group' started by Clyde C Coger Jr, Mar 22, 2010.

  1. Clyde C Coger Jr

    Clyde C Coger Jr going above and beyond PREMIUM MEMBER

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    The Problem with the NIV (New International Version) Bible



    In plain view of the Preface for any reader to see, we are told that beginning in 1965, when after several years of exploratory study by committees from the Christian Reform Church, and the National Association of Evangelicals, a group of scholars met at Palos Heights, Illinois, and concurred in the need for a new translation of the Bible in contemporary English.


    “In 1967 the New York Bible Society (now the International Bible Society) generously undertook the financial sponsorship of the project—a sponsorship that made it possible to enlist the help of many distinguished scholars. The fact that participants from the United States, Great Britain, Canada, Australia and New Zealand worked together gave the project its international scope. That they were from many denominations—including Anglican, Assemblies of God, Baptist, Brethren, Christian Reformed, Church of Christ, Evangelical Free, Lutheran, Mennonite, Methodist, Nazarene, Presbyterian, Wesleyan and other churches—helped to safeguard the translation from sectarian bias. How it was made helps to give the New International Version its distinctiveness.

    …Like all translations of the Bible, made as they are by imperfect man, this one undoubtedly falls short of its goals...”

    The Committee on Bible Translation
    June 1978
    (Revised August 1983)

    Names of the translators and editors may be secured
    From the International Bible Society,
    1820 Jet Stream Drive,
    Colorado Springs, Colorado 80921-3696

    First problem, to say a group of scholars or many distinguished scholars is like saying 4 out of 5 dentists recommend Crest toothpaste. Unless we know who the scholars were, why they decided to meet, what was discussed, all of which to explain the extent of exploratory study involved, the intent and motive for the project remains ambiguous and irresponsible. Thus, for such a monumental undertaking, the need for a new translation of the Bible in contemporary English is hidden.

    Second problem, to say the five (5) participating Counties worked together, all considered European, to give the project its International scope is grossly misleading, considering that no Country of Color, from the Continent of Africa or any other is listed. Are the United States, Great Britain, Canada, Australia and New Zea land the only Countries, which just happen to be White, capable of providing non-sectarian scholars? Or is this a matter of exclusion? Moreover, which Countries and or scholars are considered sectarian?

    Third problem, when identifying some of the participating denominations as other churches, again, this is viewed as irresponsible, if the other churches are not named, specifically. Which other churches?

    Fourth problem, to say the NIV project, which consists of creating a necessary contemporary English translation of the Bible, is like all translations of the Bible, made as they are by imperfect man, this one undoubtedly falls short of its goals; renders the project unless, null and void, and should be viewed a disclaimer that is totally unacceptable. To admit the goal was not reached, in plain view, disregards the process of carefully hand picking Countries, denominations and scholars, supposedly, to safeguard the determined need for the translation.

    Furthermore, to add insult to injury, the first noticeable scriptural change occurs in the book of Genesis, and involves switching the terms Ethiopia with Cush. Most are aware that Ethiopia is central to Africa, and Bible students know that Ethiopia is the same as Cush. The question becomes this; why would the Committee decide that Cush would be a better translation for the NIV, than Ethiopia in the King James Version? Keep in mind the Committee’s need of a new translation of the Bible in contemporary English. Cush is not commonly understood to be Ethiopia, and Ethiopia is widely understood to be central to Africa, thus the change is nonsensical.

    (KJV) Genesis 2: 13 And the name of the second river is Gi-hon: the same it is that compasseth the whole land of Ethiopia.

    (NIV) Genesis 2: 13 The name of the second river is the Gihon; it winds through the entire land of Cush.*(h13)

    Glaringly, we find the real reason for the change in foot note (h13) of the NIV translation:

    (h13)…Possibly southeast Mesopotamia

    While Ethiopia is the Greek word for the Hebrew word Cush, interchangeably; Ethiopia is generally identified as Cush. Mesopotamia on the other hand, largely refers to modern day Iraq and sits between the modern day rivers, Tigris and Euphrates. These rivers are clearly not the same as the biblical pre-flood, Tigris and Euphrates. To say possibly southeast Mesopotamia, is a desire to say, definitely not Ethiopia, yet there was no change of Cush not to mean Ethiopia.





    ...


     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2016
  2. Ikoro

    Ikoro Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    This is deep and on point, my Brother. The footnote was a glaring example of scriptural manipulation and bias.

    But you'll forgive my scepticism in asking; what makes the KJV any better? Wasn't that a single monarch and his henchmen who sat down? This book that many place their fate on, in -almost- the same fashion as the Que'an, has been altered or manipulated and comes in so many version... how do you know which one is (the most) 'pure'

    On that note, I'll have to dig up you e-mail from my inbox. In the pursuit of knowledge, and in the name of scholarly humility, I've invited a Jehova's Witness to my home this coming Saturday for the 2nd time to discuss the Christianity and the Bible (and perhaps endtimes?) - I'd like your input on my notes. What say you, Brother?

    One,

    - Ikoro
     
  3. Clyde C Coger Jr

    Clyde C Coger Jr going above and beyond PREMIUM MEMBER

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    In the Spiriti of Sankofa and Real Truth!




    Of course I will my brother friend Ikoro, and thank you for the kind reveiw...I'm still the same person you met a year or so ago, with the same agenda we discussed back then that on several occassions have tried to re-established our earlier meeting of the minds, I'm sure you recall.

    Any help I may be for you in your pursuits, whether with the Witnesses or otherwise, remains as initially offered. As far as answering your specific questions here, in regards to my posted thread, I will prepare a response, as soon as possible. This succinct response will not be to convince you nor persuade you, but will consist of the knowledge I've acquired in my studies.

    If you cannot find my e-mail address, let me know, if you do find it, then write me with verification that you have it...Peace In...I remain a comrade in arms in the struggle for our Unity and Understanding, in spite of the bitter disagreements.

     
  4. Clyde C Coger Jr

    Clyde C Coger Jr going above and beyond PREMIUM MEMBER

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    In the Spirit of Sankofa and Real Truth!




    Ikoro,

    Part of the problem inherent to misunderstanding the Bible lies in the misnomer of Versions and Translations. Although the King James and others contain the word Version, it is a translation. Version proper has more to do with different languages. Here are the Versions of the Bible:

    Samaritan Pentateuch
    Septuagint (Greek)
    Aramaic
    Latin
    Coptic
    Gothic
    Syriac
    Armenian
    Georgian
    Ethiopic
    Arabic
    Slavonic

    Now comes the translations of the English Bible, from some of the earliest translations, Caedmon’s, Bede’s, Alfred the Great’s…down to the King James’(version), considered the final best for centuries, which are central to the Septuagint or Greek translation of the Hebrew Bible. Recently, the NIV has usurped the title from the King James. Obviously, I view the King James Version (so-called), to be the most pure, as you say, of the lot.

    On the Jehovah Witnesses…their NWT (New World Translation) is unique to them and is not considered a mainstream translation, other than for self-serving purposes. For example, Acts 8: 37 is missing completely, ask them to explain why the verse is missing and let that be your guide…Peace In my brother friend, for real!


     
  5. Clyde C Coger Jr

    Clyde C Coger Jr going above and beyond PREMIUM MEMBER

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    In the Spirit of Sankofa and Real Truth!

    Brother Ikoro...this is my favorite.





    [​IMG]

    Relative post located in Color of The Cross thread:
    http://destee.com/forums/showpost.php?p=497251&postcount=745

    Excerpt from…Does Color Matter? Only When Misrepresented!: The Bible depicts the Colors of Man and Consequences of false Representation :

    all took me back to the original King James 1611 Bible and “The Original African Heritage study Bible” by Peebles. I fully embrace the King James Version.




     
  6. Ikoro

    Ikoro Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    I will be studying that thread intensely, thank you.

    Excellent reply, my Brother.

    One,

    - Ikoro
     
  7. Clyde C Coger Jr

    Clyde C Coger Jr going above and beyond PREMIUM MEMBER

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    And you are very welcome Ikoro. Did you see the Jehovah Witness question for your house guest?

     
  8. cherryblossom

    cherryblossom Banned MEMBER

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    WHOLE Bible verses deleted in the NIV

    The following WHOLE verses have been removed in the NIV--whether in the text or footnotes...over 40 IN ALL!!!

    Matthew 12:47 -- removed in the footnotes

    Matthew 17:21 -- COMPLETELY removed [also deleted from the Jehovah's Witness "Bible"]. What are you NIV readers missing?
    "Howbeit this kind goeth not out but by prayer and fasting."

    Matthew 18:11 -- COMPLETELY removed [also deleted from the Jehovah's Witness "Bible"]. What are you NIV readers missing?
    "For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost."

    Matthew 21:44 -- removed in the footnotes

    Matthew 23:14 -- COMPLETELY removed [also deleted from the Jehovah's Witness "Bible"]. What are you NIV readers missing?
    "Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation."

    Mark 7:16 -- COMPLETELY removed [also deleted from the Jehovah's Witness "Bible"]. What are you NIV readers missing?
    "If any man have ears to hear, let him hear."

    Mark 9:44 -- COMPLETELY removed [also deleted from the Jehovah's Witness "Bible"]. What are you NIV readers missing?
    "Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched."

    Mark 9:46 -- COMPLETELY removed [also deleted from the Jehovah's Witness "Bible"]. What are you NIV readers missing?
    "Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched."

    Mark 11:26 -- COMPLETELY removed [also deleted from the Jehovah's Witness "Bible"]. What are you NIV readers missing?
    "But if ye do not forgive, neither will your Father which is in heaven forgive your trespasses."

    Mark 15:28 -- COMPLETELY removed [also deleted from the Jehovah's Witness "Bible"]. What are you NIV readers missing?
    "And the scripture was fulfilled, which saith, And he was numbered with the transgressors."

    Mark 16:9-20 (all 12 verses) -- There is a line separating the last 12 verses of Mark from the main text. Right under the line it says: [The two most reliable early manuscripts do not have Mark 16:9-20] (NIV, 1978 ed.) The Jehovah's Witness "Bible" also places the last 12 verses of Mark as an appendix of sorts.

    Luke 17:36 -- COMPLETELY removed [also deleted from the Jehovah's Witness "Bible"]. What are you NIV readers missing?
    "Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left."

    Luke 22:44 -- removed in the footnotes

    Luke 22:43 -- removed in the footnotes

    Luke 23:17 -- COMPLETELY removed [also deleted from the Jehovah's Witness "Bible"]. What are you NIV readers missing?
    "(For of necessity he must release one unto them at the feast.)"

    John 5:4 -- COMPLETELY removed [also deleted from the Jehovah's Witness "Bible"]. What are you NIV readers missing?
    "For an angel went down at a certain season into the pool, and troubled the water: whosoever then first after the troubling of the water stepped in was made whole of whatsoever disease he had."

    John 7:53-8:11 -- removed in the footnotes

    Acts 8:37 -- COMPLETELY removed [also deleted from the Jehovah's Witness "Bible"]. It's deletion makes one think that people can be baptized and saved without believing on the Lord Jesus Christ. Sounds Catholic. What are you NIV readers missing?
    "And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God."

    Acts 15:34 -- COMPLETELY removed [also deleted from the Jehovah's Witness "Bible"]. What are you NIV readers missing?
    "Notwithstanding it pleased Silas to abide there still."

    Acts 24:7 -- COMPLETELY removed [also deleted from the Jehovah's Witness "Bible"]. What are you NIV readers missing?
    "But the chief captain Lysias came upon us, and with great violence took him away out of our hands,"

    Acts 28:29 -- COMPLETELY removed [also deleted from the Jehovah's Witness "Bible"]. What are you NIV readers missing?
    "And when he had said these words, the Jews departed, and had great reasoning among themselves."

    Romans 16:24 -- COMPLETELY removed [also deleted from the Jehovah's Witness "Bible"]. What are you NIV readers missing?
    "The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen."

    I John 5:7 -- Vitally important phrase COMPLETELY removed [also deleted from the Jehovah's Witness "Bible"]. In the NIV it says,

    "For there are three that testify:"

    Compare the NIV reading with the following Jehovah's Witness reading--

    "For there are three witness bearers,"

    What are you NIV readers missing? What does the real Bible say?

    "For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one."

    This is one of the GREATEST verses testifying of the Godhead. That is why the Jehovah's Witnesses leave it out. They do not believe in the Godhead and they do not believe that Jesus is God. Why does the NIV leave it out...? Whole books have been written on the manuscript evidence that supports inclusion of this verse in the Bible. Reader, do you believe in the Godhead? If so, then this deletion should offend you.




    http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Bible/NIV/niv_deletes_verses.htm
     
  9. Bast Bastet

    Bast Bastet Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Jehovah's Witnesses - (NWT) New World Translation

    Various Contradictions and Omissions in Bible Translations

    This table compares various verses in the KJV, NIV, NASB, and NWT. The term "OMITTED" is used when either the phrase or the verse in question is omitted. This table is a very small sampling of contradictory verses, not an exhaustive one.

    Some people have objected to me comparing the NWT with the NIV and NASB. They complain that the NWT is an "obvious" corruption of Scripture on the part of the Jehovah's Witness cult. Instead of complaining about the comparison, they should be wondering why the NIV and NASB so frequently agree with the NWT.

    I have noticed that in some cases, different editions may not treat a verse the same way. This table represents the verses as I have them in my printed editions (NIV 1984, NASB 1977, NWT 1984).
    http://av1611.com/kjbp/charts/various.html
     
  10. Clyde C Coger Jr

    Clyde C Coger Jr going above and beyond PREMIUM MEMBER

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    In the Spirit of Sankofa and Peace and Love!




    Bast Bastet,

    Couldn't agree with you more about comparing those scriptures that find agreement between the NWT and NASB (and others)...Peace In,

     
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