Black Spirituality Religion : The Hyksos from a black perspective:

Discussion in 'Black Spirituality / Religion - General Discussion' started by Music Producer, Aug 22, 2006.

  1. Music Producer

    Music Producer Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    The Hyksos from a black perspective:

    In my reading of the Sirius Mystery, which I have yet to complete but have read the chapter, “The Rising of the Serpents Tooth” my suspicions that the Hyksos were an African tribe grew and now had a source. In the chapter a book was referenced that was published around 1967, “Lost Worlds of Africa”, by James Wellard, witch I now have on order. In this book there is a reference to “The People of the Chariots” that describes an ancient African Empire of the Libyan Desert. These people were called the Garamantes and their Empire goes undated and unexplored as the ruins waste away in the desert to this very day. The Dogon are suspected to be descendants of the Garamantes. Other historians such as Herodotus, writing in 450BC also makes references to these Garamantes people and their Chariots. Also we have another historian that has referenced them and their Chariots, Strabo.

    As I was reading this it came to me that these Garamantes just might be our Hyksos. The Garamantes had a continued and long history of constantly raiding the Ethiopians in their Chariots and pillaging Ethiopian villages. As I did more research on the net there is indeed ancient ruins in the Libyan Desert, that have basically gone untouched by archeologist because they are in odd locations.

    In the white mans standard history of the Hyksos we have a problem that arise to me as I was looking at a map of ancient Egypt. Understand that in ancient Egypt the water levels of the Nile and the Delta were much higher then they are today, much of the Delta of Egypt has dried up. So my question became in looking at the route the Hyksos would have had to take in order to reach Memphis as the white man presents them would have taken them right into the Nile River. How did they cross a River or a marsh land Delta with Chariots? You ever ride you bicycle through mud? Surely the Egyptians with their harden Army would have took this as a perfect point of ambushing the Hyksos, while their Chariots were stuck in the mud or while they were crossing a raging river.

    Something just doesn’t add up with this picture. One reason the white man would continue this perception is to place him in Egypt and being responsible for the growth of Egypt. But in reality the Hyksos crossing a river or marsh lands of the Delta in Chariots to war with the Egyptians may be one of the biggest myths created by the white man because they see Rome as being the originator of the Chariot.

    With this new information of the Garamantes Empire of Libya that is historically recorded as having Chariots and running frequent raids on surrounding nations I now suspect they are the original Hyksos people. Manetho records them as coming from the North, which caused the assumption that they came from Jerusalem and reinforces the white mans desire to establish them as the original Chariot inventor. But what if they followed the Mediterranean Libyan coastline until reaching the Delta. This route would indeed make them come from the North as they approached Memphis. This rout also has no obstructions such as river or marshlands that would hamper a chariot and horses.

    What is your thought on this newfound information?

    This is a page that has some basic information on them.
    http://www.saudiaramcoworld.com/issue/200403/libya.s.forgotten.desert.kingdom.htm
     
  2. emanuel goodman

    emanuel goodman Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    one problem

    YOU cannot type a thread with information and say "Just might" after that any thing you say is merley specultive or subjective and thus not credible.
     
  3. Music Producer

    Music Producer Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    No, its only speculative and subjective, not discredited just like the white mans explanation of the Hyksos. None of us were actually there, thus all information is subjective when dealing with History.

    Do you have anything to add that may refute or inhance the information?
     
  4. Keita Kenyatta

    Keita Kenyatta going above and beyond PREMIUM MEMBER

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    http://manuampim.com/ramesesIII.htm

    Well....I had to post this for you. Number #1. It is directly off the tomb of Ramses III and depicts the fact that there were white people somewhere. However, this is not the first image. History reflects that we have been at war with the Asians for quite some time.

    Remember, there was no Europe as we know it back then. They called them Asian. Caucus means dead and Asians a man...so cauc-asian was a dead man....no skin color. Now we can play all the games we want to, but then that places us in the position of having to say that our people back then did not correctly depict what they saw or was in contact with. This time period would have been right around the so called birth of Moses...and based upon the drawings...the hyksos were there already.
     
  5. ANUK_AUSAR

    ANUK_AUSAR Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Well, in terms of enhancement, I would suggest consulting a very good spell check program, accessible through most modern word processors, and running each of your posts through that before presenting them on the board as a means to deplore the arguments of others.

    As far as refutation, since there was not much substance to your post, I would posit only this consideration: that you presented the connection between the Dogon people and the Libyans on a spurious basis; i.e. that they are both located West of Kamit. The augustine scholarship of Cheikh Anta Diop in The Cultural Unity of Black Africa delineates the problem with making the Libyan people into a wholly African phenomenon by virtue of the Amazonian phenomenon unique to Northeast Africa, situated so close to Europe and ripe for the inundation of its hordes.

    Furthermore, you have supposed that the geography of the Delta is dismissive of passage through the Delta of Kamit with chariots, as if the entire country was conquered with a single campaign, rather than the gradual acquisition of Northern and then Southern lands which characterized the less sophisticated hordes of the Hyksos.

    To this we can append the following difficulty: you have not established *which* battles would have necessitated the passage of a horse or a chariot or both across any difficult terrain, or whether this has been confirmed as a problem by the ambiguous "white man historians" who you so vehemently lambast (if the problem is with them, I then wonder, how come you don't present these issues to those persons in a public and scholarly forum?). So in other words, you are attempting to sweep aside empirical evidence in favor of inductive reasoning, which alone cannot suffer its original form when further questions are posed, such as those I've above mentioned, and this especially in matters of archaeology.

    Peace.
     
  6. Music Producer

    Music Producer Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Please do not show me cartoon characters that have been colorized by someone who forced the image to fit what they believe. Please show me an unedited photograph of the Egyptian antiquities, preferably containing the museum catalog number.

    You have totally, totally, totally confused the Egyptian time-line. Ahmose I was the Pharaoh that kicked the Hyksos out, which you place as the Biblical Exodus, which would have been the time of Moses, which would have been the beginning of the 18th Dynasty.

    How in the world have you jumped Moses all the way up to Ramesses III who was of Dynasty 20 witch was 420 years after Dynasty 18?

    You obviously have absolutely no concept of the Egyptian Time-Line and what Pharaohs reigned in what period.
     
  7. Music Producer

    Music Producer Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Information about the African Garamantes Empire of Libya has just come to my attention but I always suspected the Hyksos were simply another African Tribe. I know have more credence to that fact.

    Did you know of an African Tribe dating back as far as the Hyksos that used Chariots before you read my post?
     
  8. Music Producer

    Music Producer Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Keita,

    These would be real photos of Egyptian antiquates of Ramesses III tomb. As you look through them you will see the true image of the one you tried to pass off on me.
    The photo is called “view 57”. Please look at it closely.
    http://www.osirisnet.net/tombes/pharaons/ramses3/e_ramses3.htm

    There is NO white people.

    I also have the book “The Complete Valley of the Kings” ISBN 0-500-05080-5.
     
  9. ANUK_AUSAR

    ANUK_AUSAR Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    You do not have more "credence to the fact", in fact what you do have is ancient testimony that there were Libyans who possessed the same technology as the Hyksos, and the irrational idea that these are somehow connected to the Dogon, who for whatever reason (probably the two peoples' dissimilarity) do not have the chariot as a cultural fixture.

    Now, to the Libyans being an indigenous African people, this issue has already been clarified by Cheikh Anta Diop, many, many years ago.

    So, once again you've lost, because you've failed to establish any criteria for even the contiguity of the Dogon people and Libyan charioteers, and once doing that, of the commonality of these African Dogon charioteers and the Hyksos.

    Peace.
     
  10. Music Producer

    Music Producer Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Please give Book title and ISBN also page numbers of the information.
     
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