Black Spirituality Religion : The Book

Discussion in 'Black Spirituality / Religion - General Discussion' started by Music Producer, Jun 21, 2004.

  1. Music Producer

    Music Producer Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Zech: 5:
    1: Then I turned, and lifted up mine eyes, and looked, and behold a flying roll.
    2: And he said unto me, What seest thou? And I answered, I see a flying roll; the length thereof is twenty cubits, and the breadth thereof ten cubits.
    3: Then said he unto me, This is the curse that goeth forth over the face of the whole earth: for every one that stealeth shall be cut off as on this side according to it; and every one that sweareth shall be cut off as on that side according to it.
    4: I will bring it forth, saith the LORD of hosts, and it shall enter into the house of the thief, and into the house of him that sweareth falsely by my name: and it shall remain in the midst of his house, and shall consume it with the timber thereof and the stones thereof.


    Interpretation:
    What other religious roll exist that has two sides and is in just about every household of the thief (servants of Jesus)? It is the KJV Bible or an interpretation there of. And as I have explained, the New Testaments have stolen many things from the Old Testaments and the servants of Jesus swear by it everyday.
     
  2. Aqil

    Aqil Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    THE TRUTH ABOUT THIS BOOK:

    The people of Jerusalem had problems. The had begun to rebuild the temple, but the new temple could never be as great as the original one. There was no king from David's family, and Judah was only a small part of the Medo-Persian empire. In the first part of this book (v.1-8) Zechariah tells how the Lord gave him eight meaningful visions to help the people overcome these problems. You have quoted the sixth vision, which reads as follows, under the heading, "Sixth Vision: A Flying Scroll":

    "When I looked the next time, I saw a flying scroll, and the angel asked, 'What do you see?' 'A flying scroll,' I answered. 'About thirty feet long and fifteen feet wide.' Then he told me: This scroll puts a curse on everyone in the land who steals or tells lies. The writing on one side tells about the destruction of those who steal, while the writing on the other side tells about the destruction of those who lie. The Lord All-Powerful has said, 'I am sending this scroll into the house of everyone who is a robber or tells lies in my name, and it will remain there until every piece of wood and stone in that house crumbles.'"


    Your rather dubious interpretation is found wanting, Music Producer. The KJV of the Bible that people read today has nothing to do with the scroll in Zechariah's vision. Are you implying that the "servants of Jesus" (as you so euphemistically call Christians) are not servants of God?
     
  3. Music Producer

    Music Producer Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Let it be known, you are the first to call out a specific religious sec, not I. I am saying servants of Jesus deny GOD. They do not serve GOD and there is prophesy in the Old Testaments that gives warning of them. To believe in the New Testaments is to deny GOD.


    Isa:45:21: Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me.



    Why would GOD say that? Why would HE choose those specific words?
    I thank you have more of a problem believing that references could actually exist in a book that was written about 500 years before what it is referring too came into existence. This alone is a miracle and proof of a Higher Power.

    Found wanting by who, a person that alters the word of GOD, I don’t think so.
     
  4. Aqil

    Aqil Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    So what? Aren't Christians servants of Jesus?


    Who told you this nonsense?


    First of all let me say that the prophet Isaiah spoke for the Lord (i.e., God) to the people of Judah during the reigns of four kings of Judah. Over this period of about 40 years, the Assyria empire was expanding. Nations joined together to fight Assyria, but Assyria finally conquered Israel and most other nearby countries. Thousands of people were taken as prisoners, and although the kingdom of Judah wasn't completely conquered, it had to pay taxes.

    You quoted Isaiah 45:21, which is in the second part of this book, in which the Lord God (through Prophet Isaiah) spoke to the people who had been punished (40:1-2). They were discouraged, and He offered them hope. But God wanted them to understand that the idols have now power, and that He alone is the true God. If the people of Israel turned back to Him, then He would rescue them from Babylonia and the other where they had been scattered. They would return to their own land, and He would bless them and make them prosperous. I shall quote Isaiah 45:18-25, under the heading, "Everyone is Invited":

    "The Lord alone is God! He created the Heavens and made a world where people can live, instead of creating an empty desert. The Lord alone is God; there are no others. The Lord did not speak in a dark, secret place or command Jacob's descendants to search for Him in vain. The Lord speaks the truth, and this is what He says to every survivor from every nation: 'Gather around Me! Learn how senseless it is to worship wooden idols or pray to helpless gods. Why don't you get together and meet Me in court? Didn't I tell you long ago what would happen? I am the only God! There are no others. I bring about justice, and have the power to save.'"


    He didn't. Isaiah did...


    The latter part of the 44th chapter of Isaiah and the beginning of the 45th could only have been written by some person who lived at least 150 years after Isaiah was dead. These chapters are a compliment to Cyrus, who permitted the Jews to return to Jerusalem from Babylonian captivity, to rebuild Jerusalem and the temple, as is stated in the book of Ezra. Isaiah, according to Biblical chronology, died soon after the death of Hezekiah, which was 693 years before Christ...and the decree of Cyrus - in favor of the Jews returning to Jerusalem - was, according to the same chronology, 536 years before Christ, which is a distance of time between the two of 157 years.

    I do not suppose that the compilers of the Bible made these books, but rather that they picked up some loose anonymous essays, and put them together under the names of such authors as best suited their purpose. They have encouraged the imposition, which is next to inventing it, for it was impossible but they must have observed it.


    Found wanting by whomever reads your nebulous meanderings and farcical opinions, as evidenced by the above facetious statement... :rolleyes:
     
  5. Music Producer

    Music Producer Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    What translations of the Old Testaments do you use? It is time to put it through the test.
     
  6. Aqil

    Aqil Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    The translation you use needs testing...:laugh:

    (Btw, it's Old Testament, not "Old Testaments.")
     
  7. Music Producer

    Music Producer Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    What translations do you use?
     
  8. Aqil

    Aqil Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    The Contemporary English Version. What translations do you use?
     
  9. Music Producer

    Music Producer Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    I use the English Bible that came with my Bible Codes software, KJV, Tanakh and Torah and I must say that the English Bible, KJV and Tanakh have been in disagreement with your renderings of many passages you have posted. Your renderings completely remove the word, “Saviour” from Isaiah 45:21.

    KJV
    Isa:45:21: Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me.

    English Bible
    21 Declare, and bring them near; yes, let them take counsel together; Who has declared this from ancient time? Who has told it from that time? Did not I the Lord? And there is no other God beside me; a just God and a savior; there is none beside me.


    KJSV
    Isa 45:21 Declare ye, and bring [it] forth; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath showed this from ancient time? who hath declared it of old? have not I, Jehovah? and there is no God else besides me, a just God and a Saviour; there is none besides me.

    Hebrew Script
    Isa 45:21 ;[yim.vih yim w'D.x;y .Wc][\WIy @;a .WvyiG;h.w .WdyiG;h h'wh.y yin]a aw{l]h H'dyiGih z'aem ~,d,Qim ta{z qyiD;c -lea y;d'[.l;Bim ~yih{l/a dw{[ -nyea.w yit'l.Wz !Iy;a ;[yivw{m.W

    I don’t know if the Hebrew Script will post, but just between the two versions we can see, your rendering disagrees drastically. Your rendering removes the word, “Saviour” and moves it all the way to the end and replaces it with, “save”. I will tell you right now, the Hebrew Script of that verse does not end with, “save”. Your rendering is foul and serves a specific purpose. The hebrew script will not display correctly but if you want I can cut and past a .giff file and put it on a web page. Would you like that?
     
  10. Aqil

    Aqil Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    "Disagreement" is not the proper word, Music Producer...they differ, that's all. And they're not "my renderings"...I quoted from the Contempary English Version of the King James Bible that is published by the American Bible Society.They're all different versions of the same book, you know. Read my thread titled, "The REAL King James Version" for further clarification and edification.


    So what if the archaic English word "Saviour" is not included in Isaiah 45:21 in the Contemporary English Version? What is the difference between "a just God" and "a just God and a Saviour" pray tell? You say Jesus is Satan!...is that in the Hebrew scripture?


    And your renderings render you a babbling idiot...

    Here is the King James Version of Isaiah 45:21, from the New Open Bible Study Edition (Isaiah is speaking):

    "Tell and bring forth your case; Yes, let them take counsel together. Who has delared this from ancient time? Who has told it from that time? Have not I, the Lord? And there is no other God beside Me, a just God and a Savior; there is none beside me."

    Here is the Contemporary English Version of the same verse:

    "Why don't you get together and meet Me in court? Didn't I tell you long ago what would happen? I am the only God! There are no others. I bring about justice, and have the power to save."

    Now you tell me, what is the difference?


    Hebrew is the language of the Jewish people, and the language of the religion of the Jewish people, which is Judaism. The Old Testament was translated from the Hebrew language to Greek, then from Greek to English. Do you speak Hebrew? Do you practice Judaism? If not, then your charge is ludicrous...


    I don't need it...
     
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