Black People : The Basis Of Black-Latino Unity Is Not Political

Discussion in 'Black People Open Forum' started by Pharaoh Jahil, May 25, 2005.

  1. Pharaoh Jahil

    Pharaoh Jahil Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    For quite some time we have observed the recent discussions surrounding the efforts to construct "Black-Brown"; "Black-Latino"; or "Black and Hispanic" political coalitions. We have been struck by the manner in which many intellectuals, political scientists and elected officials in their efforts to justify or cobble together Black and Latino Unity, are taking their point of departure from the results of the 2000 Census. We disagree with their approach on a couple of levels. A few months ago, in an e-mail discussion on an outstanding list serve that I am part of, I wrote the following in reference to the issue of Black and Latino unity:

    I am of the opinion that Black and Latino unity can never be generated in the political realm. The root of unity will be found in a discovery and recognition of the common root in history, of which a majority of Blacks and Latinos are still ignorant. This is one area where the power of culture will be the genesis and base of political action. At present, both groups are neither "Black" or "Latino" in their political activity. Partisan politics and local political machinery is dictating the terms of the relationship as well as the mode of politics being used by both electorates and their most visible leadership. In addition, it is important to recognize that the power to define is a basic and an instrumental source of the disunity and the eventual unity that is to be formed. One of the most striking aspects of this recent debate is that the impact of slavery in the Western Hemisphere is never discussed in terms of the classifications, language and cultural barriers that currently exist today. When the debate stops taking its point of departure from the recent census categories and (moves) into the true origins of our divisions we would have found a basis or springboard for constructive unity and political mobilization.

    In essence, our argument is not a difficult one to understand, at its root. We are stating that mayoral elections, like that which recently occurred in Los Angeles and that which is upcoming in New York, are not well-suited to generate the long-talked about Black-Latino unity. We believe that the political establishment, through the two-party system, can not generate or even tolerate Black-Latino unity because such unity would produce a political agenda, created by the self-enlightened interest of the Black and Latino communities that would elevate issues in the political arena that the two-party system is designed to avoid. Neither the Democratic or Republican parties can handle a true Black-Latino united front. The combined power of the vote and the issues that it would champion would present the ultimate challenge to White supremacy in American politics and society.

    But the greatest impediment or enemy to the production of Black and Latino unity is not White establishment politicians but rather the gross ignorance, prevalent in both communities, of their shared history and "ethnic" origin. In essence, both groups lack the true knowledge of themselves, and as a result don't understand that the strongest basis of their unity lies in the spiritual and cultural spheres and not in the political or electoral realm.

    And it is in this area where the recent discussions that take their springboard from the recent Census results are so destructive. We discussed all of this over the weekend with The Nation Of Islam's Latino Representative Minister Muhammad Abdullah Muhammad, who is based in New York City. Minister Muhammad talked about how deceptive the recent census was and how the unsuspecting public bought into the Census' misrepresentation and misclassification of the population growth of Blacks and Latinos.

    "The census has carved up a classification for Hispanics that excludes race and other characteristics of Latino people. This is inappropriate because the Latino people are not monolithic. But not according to the U.S. Census. So a Black Latino and a White Latino are both counted as 'Hispanic'. On the surface, with the rise in the 'Hispanic' population it looks like the Black population is dwindling when it is not. We have to be very careful because when you say that there are approximately 35 million Black people and 35 million Hispanics what are you really saying? Of that 35 million classified as 'Hispanic', you have lets say, 5 to 7 million Afro-Latinos and 23 million that are heavily of the Indigenous population. Most Latin Americans are mestizos which means of mixed race – a combination of Indigenous, African or European."

    Minister Muhammad then described how the classifications of the Census are even more divisive, as in Directive No. 15, with which the Census, without equivocation, classifies Hispanics, under all circumstances, as White. He mentioned instances where law enforcement agencies and correctional facilities are mandated by provisions to count Hispanics or Latinos who are arrested or imprisoned as "White".

    Minister Muhammad Abdullah Muhammad told us that there are a confluence of forces at work here but that two of the major aspects to what is taking place that thus far has prevented Black and Latino unity from forming is the lack of knowledge of self, of both communities, combined with a strong incentive, in society and from the United States government for Latin Americans to identify with Whites before they identify with Blacks. He highlighted the fact that in the last census 80% of Puerto Ricans classified themselves as White. But anybody familiar with Puerto Rico or who has traveled there knows that the commonwealth is heavily populated with Blacks. The same is true of Cuba. Minister Muhammad said that it is an ignorance of the history of many Latin American countries coupled with denial and the seeking of access to resources, power and social equality that contributes to many Latinos rejecting Black and Indigenous roots in favor of an association with a White lineage. Of course, we recognize the same phenomenon among Blacks in this country.

    Minister Muhammad Abdullah told us,

    " If you look at the history you know immediately that Puerto Rico is not filled with Whites. In 1530 Governor Francisco Manuel De Lando made the first census of Puerto Rico. At the time it showed that Puerto Rico was made up of 416 Spaniards, 1148 Indians (free and enslaved) and 2077 Blacks (enslaved). During the subsequent centuries hundreds of thousand African slaves and Europeans migrated to the Island. The Indigenous population did not increase. According to Sociologist Martin Sagrera, in 1802 there were 78,231 whites and 71,510 blacks in Puerto Rico; by 1860, there were 300,406 whites and 241,037 blacks; in 1899, 1930 the black population had dwindled to 20 %; and by 1965 it had dwindled down to 7 %. What happened to all the Blacks? Sagrera attributes this phenomenon to racial prejudice, which has prompted a rejection to a self classification as black among Puerto Ricans Today, many Puerto Ricans reject the classification as Black. They take the opposite approach to identity Blacks have been culturally and legally conditioned to take in America. The Anglo-Saxon set a precedent that in many ways was beneficial to Blacks when he said that if you have 1 drop of Black blood in you then you are Black. In Latin America, according to the system of 'castas', one drop of White blood makes one other than Black. Many, therefore reject being classified as Black on those grounds."

    In addition, Minister Muhammad stressed that it is important to never underestimate the impact that the Indigenous or Indians have in the discussion. He discussed at length with us how many Blacks and Latinos in America are in denial about their shared ancestry from the Indian populations throughout Central and South America and the Caribbean. He even spoke of how few people are aware of how the fact that many people in the Western hemisphere are of a dark-complexion not just because Black blood is mixed in them, but also because of the mixing that has taken place with Indians. Often Indians are described as "red" but that distinction has been oversimplified by many who use it. He wrote to us, "That color red was very dominant in North America. But in Mexico, you find a browner, sometimes almost Black Indian. In The Andes, you will also find a very dark Indian - ranging from red to dark brown. However, due to 500 years of race mixing, you will also find very light skinned mestizos."

    The problem of what to do with the Indigenous people or Indian is prevalent throughout the Western Hemisphere.

    One of our technical consultants at BlackElectorate.com is from Peru and informed us that although there is a significant Black population in Peru, one of their major problems is that while there exists in Peru a reverence for the culture of their indigenous population, there exists, parallel to that reverence, discriminatory practices against the indigenous people of Peru and the elevation of the light-skinned Peruvian on broadcast media and in politics. It is that way in many countries in Central, South America and in the Caribbean. It is that way in the United States and Canada.

    www.blackelectorate.com/print_article.asp?ID=378
     
  2. Ralfa'il

    Ralfa'il Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    PJ

    Salaam black man...

    You know what, I agree with you that ignorance is the main reason we aren't getting along and there needs to be unity-

    But at this point I don't even know if I WANT unity now with most so-called Latinos.

    I'm speaking specifically of the Mexicans.

    You've heard about all the fighting and racial violence that's been going on up in Cali and the same thing is going on here in Arizona and all over the South West on a smaller scale.
    Infact, this has been happening for years.

    I'm tired of black people being the only ones calling for unity.

    If Latinos really wanted unity with us why do they live in the same neighborhoods with us and have absolutely nothing to do with us unless they have to?

    It's the same with the Arabs, East Asians and Indians....

    It's like we're in the Twilight Zone here in America now with all types of exotic beasts popping up and we don't know where they came from or how they got here...but they're here...trying to take our place.

    We didn't ask for them to come to America, white people brought them in to take our place and supplant our growth and progress.


    The only way to deal with these people, earn their respect, and get along peacefully with them is to inflict the same pain on them that we inflicted on whites in the 60's and 70's and MAKE them respect us.


    My word is bond black, (at this point) these people are not our friends and we'll be making a grave mistake to believe such.
     
  3. jamesfrmphilly

    jamesfrmphilly going above and beyond PREMIUM MEMBER

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    i am to.
    this is why i stopped calling for unity sometime ago.
    even though it is a good idea, i will not do it until some of the other "mud" people wake up and smell the coffee.
    blacks need to do for self.
     
  4. karmashines

    karmashines Banned MEMBER

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    They are out there.
     
  5. Ralfa'il

    Ralfa'il Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    James

    I bet our people who were fighting and rioting and organizing in the 60s and 70s to make a way for us in this nation and get us some wealth and respect.....never would have imagined that black people would have allowed themselves to slowly be strangled to death by millions of foreigners riding the coat-tails of our struggles and have excelled past us in some cases.


    I bet they never would believe that we'd be so gullible as to just sit here and let millions of "other people" pile up in our neighborhoods taking our jobs, political clout, and in some cases our women.

    As a young black man who gotta eat and get a family too....this is beyond ridiculous!


    Hell, I don't blame Mexicans or anyone else who comes to a country looking for a better life.

    I blame the clown and fool politician who are letting them in.

    Man....if I was a Senator or Representative up in Washington I'd be organizing other black politians and leading the fight against immigration.
     
  6. jamesfrmphilly

    jamesfrmphilly going above and beyond PREMIUM MEMBER

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    "the battle is between the rich and the poor, and the rich are winning"
    Warren Buffet.

    the combination of immigration and out sourcing will guarantee that black people in this country will not taste the fruits of their labors.

    i think Marcus Garvey once said that in the future the war would be over jobs, if he said it, he was right.

    the only future i see for black people is to gain control over our own economy and do for ourselves.
    when brothers set up that FUBU they need to have the clothes made in a black factory up town.
    we must spend our money with other black folk.

    i live near Chinatown.
    every car they drive is made in Asia.
    they simply do not buy American or European made cars, or anything else.

    if black people do not find a way to do for self, we will die.

    we must turn our money internally in our own community.
    we must find a way to work with each other the right way.
    we know what must be done, we have to do it.

    i do not know how to make black people in America and around the world realize that we need to stop fighting each other and fight the devil.
    sure, we have differences of opinion, that will always be true.
    but our differences are nothing compared to the devil.

    Africans have the resources to be a dominant power in the world.
    we need to wake up, clean up and stand up.
    else the devil will cut our throats in our sleep.
     
  7. panafrica

    panafrica Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    This is absolutely true brother James!
     
  8. karmashines

    karmashines Banned MEMBER

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    Most of the jobs Mexicans are taking are low-class jobs that will get you nowhere. Is Macdonalds worth fighting for?

    As far as immigration, making the laws tougher will prevent more AFRICANS from coming over here too!
     
  9. jamesfrmphilly

    jamesfrmphilly going above and beyond PREMIUM MEMBER

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    yes, MacDonald's is worth fighting for if you have no work.
    Mexicans depress wages all across the economy.
    i belong to the group called African American.
    i fight for my group first before any other.

    each immigrant denies resources from a black American.

    i have never seen or heard an immigrant offer anything to us.
    we need to do for ourselves.
    we have to do for ourselves.
     
  10. panafrica

    panafrica Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Not only does illegal labor depress wages across the industries that frequently hire them. People are incredibly naive if they believe that the only jobs illegal immigrants are pursuing are the landscaper, dishwasher, and maid. Illegal immigrants are pursuing and landing jobs in corporate America. They are seeking positions that pay $20 an hour and more. For corporations having people with the ability to speak multiple languages is more important than their level of education. Illegal immigrants are indeed competing for the same jobs that African Americans are. They benefit from programs which were directed towards African Americans: Minority Scholarships, HUD, etc. Why would anyone seriously believe that all a certain group aspires to do is mow lawns all their life? How can we not be alarmed that millions of people are coming into our neighborhood illegally and using resources which were not sufficient to begin with?
     
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