Black People : On the use of embryonic stem cells.

Discussion in 'Black People Open Forum' started by RAPTOR, Dec 2, 2009.

  1. RAPTOR

    RAPTOR Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    First,

    Let me start by saying, I have no problem with the use of embryonic stem
    cells, or stem cells of any kind, for or towards medical use.

    With that said...

    There are those who are against the use of embryonic stem cells for
    medical reasons.

    Most notably, those who feel it goes against their religious/moral perspective.

    That the cells are not what 'god'/nature attended for them to be used, in any way, other than in the making of a baby.

    I pose the following:

    If there are those who agree with the notion that the use, of embryonic
    stem cells, for anything other than what they are/were 'godly'/naturally attended for, is 'ungodly'/anatural, then I ask.....
    is it 'ungodly'/anatural, the practice of in vitro fertilization?

    For if either party of a hetero-couple are, in any way, naturally infertile (and for those who believe
    'god' make no mistakes), yet partake of the in vitro fertilization means of having a child[ren], is that
    also an 'ungodly'/anatural act?

    Thoughts?
     
  2. delsydebothom

    delsydebothom Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    I would argue that any act that fails to honor the intrinsic link between the unitive and procreate aspects of human sexuality is objectively contrary to the dignity of the human person. Any deliberate severance of the two is "ungodly" in the sense that it obscures in human beings the "image and likeness" of God. So in vitro fertilization would certainly be an intrinsic moral evil. That said, since the reason why it is evil is not immediately apparent, I don't think that the evil is deliberate in most cases. The people who commit it would only rarely be fully culpable.
     
  3. Ankhur

    Ankhur Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Well take a good look at who or what has found a use for useing dead fetuses as medecine?

    Is it the alternative medicine community from folks like,
    like Yale scholar, Dr Kamau Kokayi?www.drkokayi.com
    or Dr Gary Null?www.garynull.com

    Or does it come from the corporate and pharmaceutical, as well as health management agencies and lobbyists?

    Once that point is clear,
    everyone knows about how many white mice must be used and discarded to find a particular cure,
    how many embryos will be needed?

    and where will they come from?
    and what community will they probably be comeing from?


    NOW, once a cure from embyos is found, the logical premiss is that a huge resource of fresh embryos must be harvested for mass production, therefore, what nations does one assume will be the targeted resource centers for fresh embryos?
    And how will fresh embryo production be propagated and funded?

    Practicaly all cures do not require stem cells from embryos, but can rely on the patients own cells, and those which have not been cure, alternative protocals have been ignored or the research underfunded.
     
  4. RAPTOR

    RAPTOR Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Ankhur,

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but as I understand it, the embryos that are used for medical purposes come from the result of a woman (any woman) using fertility drugs which makes her body produce more eggs than desired.

    And thanks for sharing your thoughts.
    You to, delsydebothom.
     
  5. Ankhur

    Ankhur Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    And you are saying that is ok?

    and there are no side effects, and wheredoes the sperm come from to produce the embryo?
    immaculate conception?
     
  6. delsydebothom

    delsydebothom Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    That is very often the case, but eggs must be fertilized to become a human embryo. That said, a freshly fertilized egg becomes a zygote, not an embryo. A zygote grows into an embryo, an embryo into a fetus, a fetus into an infant, and infant into a toddler, etc. The divisions are somewhat artificial, since never are the differences between the stages of human development differences in substance. They are merely differences in property.
     
  7. RAPTOR

    RAPTOR Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Ankhur,

    I said in the beginning that I have no problem with the use of stem cells of any kind with respect to medical cures.

    So, yes, I'm saying its okay.

    As for side affects, are there any with respect to using embryonic stem cells
    for medical reasons? I myself, is not aware. Yet if so, what is life without
    lost and gain...risk?

    As for the sperm...
    Immaculate conception? No.

    Immaculate ejaculation, maybe? :em2300:

    You are not cool with it, the use of stem cells from embryos, that is.
    Is my assumption correct?

    And if my assumption is correct, can that....your, same line of reason be applied to ivf?

    I'm not looking for final resolution, just opinionated answers regarding that
    which I have posited in my first post. "Yes, because"; "No, because" and
    that's it.
     
  8. Ankhur

    Ankhur Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Well exactly were will this massive number of embryos be harvested from?

    And are you saying that the contemptary data has proven a embryo can be produced from an egg alone?
     
  9. RAPTOR

    RAPTOR Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Women who produce more eggs than are desired.

    No Ankhur...Sperm indeed has to play its role.

    Now Ankhur,

    I'm not interested in a debate.
    Only your opinionated answer.

    I've answered your questions honestly.
    Will you then be so kind as to return the favor?

    Whatever ones response, I will render no "agree/disagree"
    response. I'm only interested in what y'all think with respect
    to that which I have posited in my first post.
     
  10. Ankhur

    Ankhur Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    I disagree for these reasons.

    1. There is not one, not one illness or condition that requires the use of embryo, that cannot be treated by alternative medecine, or stem cells from the patient.

    2. The tests products as well as the harvested embryos will come from exlpoited impoverished nations and more then likely from Africa
    hence providing a sizeable residual financial return from ethnic genocide programs
     
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