MAMA DESTEE

Discussion in 'Violators and Violations (Possible Ones)' started by Isaiah, Feb 28, 2005.

  1. Isaiah

    Isaiah Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    MAMA DESTEE...with regret, and all due respect, I have to call you on closing brother Sekhemu's thread on Africans helping Africa... I do not believe the thread had outlived it's ability to impact on both sides of the family here...

    I do believe that ONE particular continental African took strong offense to some of the relatively innocent and tame statements made in the thread, and we, in our attempt to be hospitable, gave in to her wishes... That is all well, but it is not necessarily for the good of Africa, Africans, or the Diaspora... Africans must find the solution for the redemption of Mother Africa within herself - as a point of ownership of the most valuable and sacred piece of property on the planet... That is what Sekhemu has been saying... That is what I have been saying... This is what so many others understand to be the case... Yes, African Americans do not have our house in order... How many times must we say this before others - including some of our own - understand that that's no stick to be held over our heads???(smile!)

    The very fact that some use that to sort of browbeat us into being quiet and submissive is unconscionable and disgraceful... At least we are, on many levels, attempting to rectify our situation without making others responsible for our misery except those who have been most responsible for it - the American White Man... That a Continental African can fix their lips to proclaim myself or a brother Sekhemu as the cause of their problems is astonishing, and I am sorry they feel that way, but it aint moving me off my mountain... I will be doing as I've been doing, and attempting to do the right thing by those who've suffered here with me in the Lion's Lair...

    As for Continental brothers and sisters suffering more than me, that is all relative... That presupposes that we African Americans didn't have to run a gauntlet of bat, pipe, chain, and shotgun weilding ******** to get our "ease and comfort..." Again, this kind of ignorance galls the hell outta me... Talking about ignorance of Africa, what the hell about their ignorance of our history - or does our history have less importance than theirs??? That's a ********* joke! OOOPs, I see I'm starting to get a little bent, as we say in my neck of the forest, so I'm gone bounce 'bout now... Just want you to know how I felt about that thread being closed down... We shouldn't cave into folk who come up in here talking' about how offended they are about our honesty... They should be thankful that we are, as afterall, honesty is virtue possessed by too few in this world... Love you anyway, Destee...

    Peace!
    Isaiah
     
  2. Sekhemu

    Sekhemu Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    I want to thank you brotha Isaiah for speaking on my behalf.
     
  3. Destee

    Destee destee.com STAFF

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    Brother Isaiah ... i love you too !!! ... and you aint hafta cuss me ... dadgummit !!! ... but that's okay ... MAMA DESTEE still loves you ... :love:

    Brother Isaiah ... i love it when you challenge me, please don't ever regret doing so! It gives me a chance to spank you publically !!! ... lol ... :wink: ... No, but really, you provide more evidence for everyone in this Family, to see that they are free to respectfully say whatever they please, to whomever they please, including me. I really do love it. Thank you.

    Now you know i'm long-winded and stuff, so i'm sure you anticipated a thorough response from me. I will begin providing it now ...

    Brother Isaiah ... the thread had become somewhat hostile, a Sister and Brother virtually jumping on each other, drawing other Sisters and Brothers into the fray ... and at the direct suggestion of Brother Sekhemu, the thread starter, the thread was closed. While you may not agree with him, i did. So your complaint is with him, i just work here. :wink:

    Now, in regard to the particulars of the hostility found in that thread, i didn't base my decision to agree with Brother Sekhemu on them ... but rather, i considered the entire community and what the continued fighting does to the Spirit of this place. It weakens it.

    No matter who was right or wrong in that debate, in my opinion, the greatest good that could be gleaned from that experience ... had already presented itself ... and that was to recognize that we still have much work to do. That no matter the topic, we will disagree, and must challenge ourselves to do that respectfully ... or else that negative experience continually manifests itself.

    This community's main purpose and goal ... is for us to live together peacefully and respectfully. We have been blessed to do that, and no one Member, topic, discussion, thread, or post, is worthy of jeopardizing this great blessing that has been bestowed upon us.

    Brother Isaiah ... i have learned so much interacting with you all for so very long. I mean, i have really learned a lot! I have learned that Brothers are not the same as Sisters! Oh my gosh! I mean ... i am JUST NOW seeing, experiencing, standing in awe, at the magnificent differences between Brothers and Sisters.

    To have so many active Brothers in this community, ready to fight for and defend us at the slightest sign of trouble, excites me in a way that nothing else ever has. I believe that one of our greatest strengths in this community, is the grand representation of Black Men here! I am honored and have the highest regard, respect, and consideration for all you say and do. I believe, that each of you believes, that what you say and do here is right and correct. One cannot ask for any more than that.

    With that being the case, and leaning on my newfound respect of our differences, i try my best to stay out of the way ... out of the particulars. But i cannot ignore the end results. I cannot ignore the shaking of our peace. And so when Brother Sekhemu suggested that the thread should be closed, i simply embraced his wisdom.

    Thank you Brother Isaiah, for being here, with us. You know i am honored.

    I anticipate your response.

    Much Love and Peace.

    :heart:

    Destee
     
  4. Sekhemu

    Sekhemu Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    If I may, I'd like to bring a little perspective here, maybe another angle of light. What I think has been slightly overlooked is that, the reason I suggested to have the thread closed was that I failed in getting a member to see that my concern for my home did not mean I hated other black people.

    Their reaction to this attempt was to spread a lie, yes a lie... because that's what it was, the lie that I had no concern about Continental Africans. This was a vicious and vile character assissination, that had little to do with me taking the heat in my own thread. Unfortunately, it was allowed to take on a life of it's own with little opposition with the exception of Panafrica and one or two others.

    if a member or member(s) cannot agree to disagree. let us be vigilante that no member is slandered in the process. Because nobody wants to be lied on.
     
  5. Destee

    Destee destee.com STAFF

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    Brother Sekhemu ... failing to get one particular person to see your concern, is not necessarily a failure.

    We all present our concerns here, in hopes that others will see ... but we have absolutely no control over them doing that. While the person we want to "get it" might never, another Sister or Brother may. As a Member here, presenting my concerns daily, my focus is not on how many see (embrace) what i'm saying ... but rather ... do i believe and embrace what i'm saying, and have i presented it in the best of manners.

    For example, you know i have presented my concern for the Family to become Premium Members. You heard me and responded. A few others have as well, but the vast majority of Members have not. I have been publically called a host of ugly things ... thief, liar, cheater, spy ... i was even called a B! ... since asking the Family for help, since presenting this concern ... but these responses, or lack thereof, are not my focus. I am confident in the sincerity, hope, and honesty of the concern i presented.

    My "success" comes from believing and embracing what i've presented. I give all that i have to this community, and have done so for many years. I believe in my heart that God and our Ancestors are pleased with this effort. I know my sincere hope for us as a people depends on our being able to come together peacefully and respectfully. I believe that we must be willing to go beyond talking the talk, and we must also walk the walk ... by spending our money to support our own.

    Again, my confidence is in what i believe, not what i'm able to convince others to see, and i encourage you to do the same.


    Brother Sekhemu ... it is a jump, to go from what she actually said, to a vicious and vile character assasination. What she said, was ...


    and you said to her ...


    Of course you both said more than that, but my point is ... she only shared her opinion, which she's entitled to ... and she was not alone in saying things that caused the closing of that thread.

    Yes, Brother Pan did speak to your concerns, but please know ... it is our policy, when at all possible ... to let one Moderator handle an issue, rather than several different Moderators getting involved. So please don't feel neglected if only one responds.

    I'd like to note too, it will serve your position better, to not have violations of your own in the thread ... when pointing out the violations of others.

    A person can say, "i don't think you care." I don't see a great violation in those words. I don't understand your outburst at this one person's opinion. She's entitled to it. She is welcome to share it, in the manner that she did, within that thread. She did nothing wrong in my opinion.

    I guess i've experienced so many attacks, until i am becoming numb to them. I don't want to be insensitive now, but i just don't see how those few words she shared, combined with all the words the two of you have ever shared, caused all of this.

    In regard to your being slandered, if that is what you're saying happened, i'm no attorney. I don't know what truly qualifies as slanderous, but if you need anything that has been posted here, to aid in your case against her ... you are welcome to it.

    I love you Brother Sekhemu, and appreciate you being here. I believe all that takes place in this community is necessary for our forward movement. We are all learning how to better interact with each other. We are unique, in that we are the first of our people to be able to simultaneously interact with each other, from all over the world, in real time, discussing the issues close to us.

    Let us continue to do it in the best of manners, setting an example for all those coming behind us.

    :heart:

    Destee
     
  6. Isaiah

    Isaiah Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Hi, Destee, everthangs still everythang witchoo and me, ma!

    And I understand your position, as well as, Sekhemu's... The board's continued existence as a bridge between a wide gulf, is far more important than a particular hotly-contested thread... I am just about up ta here with intorlerance of unpopular viewpoints...

    Unfortunately for African people all over the world, the message that we must take agency of our own upliftment is a message many find unfathomable... We start looking for excuses to avoid that studpendous responsibility by making everybody else and their mama responsible for our condition... Hey, we can continue to blame our enemies, but one thing about our enemies, they don't much care... We're just a buncha whining negroes to them... We need to remember this when we whine before seeking solutions to our situation... That is all I am asking, and I think, that is all Sekhemu was asking... BTW, Lil Mama, that extends to the funds needed to keep this tower of blackness standing... We must take care of our own... It sho is sweeter that way...

    Peace!
    Isaiah
     
  7. Destee

    Destee destee.com STAFF

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    Brother Isaiah ... i knew i'd enjoy your response. Thank you for it. I do have one question though, regarding the intolerance of unpopular viewpoints ... are you saying that the management of our community appears that way to you?

    :heart:

    Destee
     
  8. Sekhemu

    Sekhemu Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    . If someone tells a lie on you, that is slanderous, I don't need to have to level a law suit to show this. With that being said, I thought it was my duty to accurately portray my concerns for our people here, not because I had a burning desire to convince this woman of their validity but to show the other members that what she said was not true. That is the crucial point here. If someone lies on me, in the context that she did, that is character assissination in my book, maybe not in yours, but it is in mine.

    If you notice, I said I have never lied on anyone here about anything, and this is why Panafrica had to step in to correct her about this. I created the thread to ask a question. She never challenged any of the merits of the replies made by any of the other members or myself. she simply alleged that I created the thread to scorn continental Africans. She made it a personal crusade to prove something that never existed.

    So if we want to be united here, how can the actions of a member doing something like this, who claims to want solidarity be given credence? It cannot. Yes I said she was a bitter and mixed up woman, after being attacked by her several times, unprovoked, and with no input from the moderators.

    I did my level best to avoid her, but I can only turn the other cheek so many times. This woman made it personal the moment she decided not to address the question of the thread. How much clearer can I be on this matter.
     
  9. Isaiah

    Isaiah Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Not at all, Destee, I think management here is flexible and most tolerant of unorthodox viewpoints...

    It is those who come here with the preconceived idea that African people have to be monolithic in our points of view, and if we are not, that is cause to hammer them... Nope... That is not cause to hammer, but to agree to disagree without being disagreeable...

    In the future, I would that folk would show me where my point of view is wrong, rather than resorting to personal/ad hominem attacks, callling folk ignorant without providing any kind of information to substantiate that claim... I would think that I have done that whenever I have taken a strong position against a person which might, otherwise, be considered a personal thang(Indya, for example) If a person is expressing ignorant points of view on the regular, then that is a different story... Sekhemu does not do that to my knowledge, yet this sister took off on a riff on the brother... I must agree with him when he says that it was a personal thing...

    In the past, Sekhemu and I have had a disagreement of two, but clearly it did not stop either of us from apologizing, and moving on... We may have difficulty in the future, too, for all we know... However, understanding is reached when both parties are open to it... I am wondering if this sister is open to understanding based on her heated responses in the now defunct thread??? Hmmmm...

    Peace!
    Isaiah
     
  10. Destee

    Destee destee.com STAFF

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    Brother Sekhemu ... i am so tempted to play Judge Mathis and ask you to please present the evidence that proves you have been slandered. Where are your witnesses that have said they now think less of you, after reading her words. What injury have you sustained, and how much do you believe it is worth? Did you do all you could, to avoid interaction with her? Is she justified, in her own mind, to believe the things that she shared? Is it at all possible, that you could have given her reason, to think as she does?

    I think the term "slander" is a legal one, used to prove or disprove injury caused by the words of another. Injury with financial compensation, if proven to be true. Anything less than that, is not slander, but some other word ... perhaps inconsiderate, disrespectful, short-sighted, close-minded, difficult, obstinate ... but probably not slanderous. You'd not win this case if i'm the judge.

    I have been here from the beginning, and this Sister is not the first Member that you have had trouble getting along with. Different folk, different topics, different situations, but the results were the same. Two members fighting.

    I'm not sure what makes you experience this, or even if you can see the pattern. I know that you love your Sisters and Brothers. I know that you want the best for us. I know you are willing to go way beyond what most will do. I know that you have much wisdom to share, and that you share it. I know you are ferocious! I know that you are not easy. (ferocious and not easy are very good things!) I know that you are very protective, of that which you love. I know that within you, is what our people need. Yet there is the reality of the fighting that occurs from time to time.

    You did not do your level best to avoid her. You have the ability to put her (or any Member) on ignore, but you did not do that. Putting a Member on ignore, removes each of their posts, all of their words, from your view. This reasonable measure to avoid conflict was not taken, and it hurts your case.

    A Member is free to respond to any one part of a thread or post, that they'd like. Just yesterday, a thread with lots of posts, and several sentences by one Brother ... i highlighted one sentence he said, and responded to it. That is allowed. You can't control what a person chooses to respond to.

    If you are trying to prove to others, where you stand, stand there always. Let all of your writings, all of your interactions, all of your comings and goings, be in that place ... so when your integrity or character is challenged ... you can let the record speak for itself. You don't have to say anything in your own defense, though i recognize the desire to do so is great.

    I would suggest you go back and make a truce with your Sister. If you are truly concerned about what others think of you, i challenge you to work it out with her. Become the friends, the Sister and Brother, that is in you to become. Extend your strong hand to her Brother, in peace, love, and respect ... and i have no doubt that it will be received in that same Spirit. You are the oldest Member, between the two of you, which puts the greatest responsibility on your shoulders. Lead the way Brother Sekhemu.

    in Judge Mathis' absence ... i must dismiss your case.

    Case Dismissed :court:

    :heart:

    Destee
     
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