Black People Politics : Is Black nationalism a conservative idealogy?

Discussion in 'Black People Politics' started by African_Prince, Aug 19, 2010.

  1. African_Prince

    African_Prince Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    I know most Black people traditionally do not divide themselves into the liberal vs. conservative categories because Black liberals and Black conservatives still have more in common with each other than they do with Whites of similar political leanings but there's some research to suggest that conservatism and liberalism are styles of thinking rather than organized belief systems about modern politics. Many researchers believe that conservatives tend to be left-brain dominant and liberals tend to be right brain dominant. Liberals have individualistic views on social issues and horizontal collectivist views on the economy (they favor equality and sharing), conservatives have individualistic views on the economy and vertical collectivist views on social issues (they favor hierarchy, authority and in-group loyalty). Libertarians are considered socially liberal and fiscally conservative and have individualistic views on both the economy and social issues.





    According to Jonathon Haidt, the two basic foundations of the liberal view of morality are empathy/care and fairness/reciprocation. Conservatives place some value on empathy/care and fairness/reciprocation (personally, I think fairness/reciprocation is more important to conservatives than it is to liberals, especially if it includes punishment and reward) but more value on respect for tradition/authority, in-group loyalty and sanctity/purity. (Fiscally conservative) libertarians (or 'liberals without bleeding hearts') tend to place little value on any of these foundations, according to Jonathon Haidt.

    Black nationalism stresses in-group loyalty. BN is critical of interracial dating and Blacks who identify with Whites/White culture or don't express group loyality/conform to group expectations. The left brain has a need for structure and order, the right brain is more tolerant of ambiguity, variance, and 'chaos'. Black nationalists would prefer to see Black couples in Black neighborhoods with Black children etc., because they would like to see the world in neat and tidy, racial categories, could this be a left brain expression of conservatism? The left brain gravitates towards the familiar, the right brain is excited by novelty and variety, maybe this is why Black nationalists prefer the company of their own people and 'multi-culturalists' find different kinds of people appealing. I think Pan-Africanism, unlike BN, is based on empathy for other African-descended people without necessarily advocating independence or separation from other groups. Pan-Africanism only advocates unity.

    I'm not criticizing Black nationalism, I'm just wondering if there's a connection. I know I have both conservative and liberal personality traits, even though most of my political views are liberal. I feel culture shock among Whites and I know I'm more judgemental of them, even though I try not to be. I'd prefer to be around people who are like me.
     
  2. cherryblossom

    cherryblossom Banned MEMBER

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    Hmmm....This is quite a "meaty" hypothesis to attempt comparisons amongst: Left Brain/Right Brain, Conservative/Liberal, and Black Consciousness and Pan-Africanism.

    However, in this "equation" of yours, you left out another "factor" ----

    Black Consciousness.

    So, how would you "compute" Black Consciousness into this "equation?"

    Is it also affected/influenced by the Left Brain/Right Brain component?

    ....Are there such things as "Conservative Consciousness" and "Liberal Consciousness?"

    And if so, how would each, in turn, affect Black Nationalism or Pan-Africanism?
     
  3. Chinelo

    Chinelo Third Eye Is Always Open MEMBER

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    NO

    NO

    Black Nationalism has nothing to do with these divisive white constructed terms of liberal or conservative. If you look closely you can see that white people have throughout history been an individualistic type of people, that are always divisive, even amongst themselves, and only unite when they are threatened, which is the basis of what Nationalism is about, grouping together amongst your own kind, and developing a survivable means for the present and the future.

    The only difference in White nationalism is that they have used violence and all other forms of barbarity to achieve their survival, and at the expense of the rest of the world.

    The irony is that the survivable civilizing they achieved for their descendents here in 2010 based upon white supremacy which is flooded in their sub-creations of "capitalism, christianity, and their social engineered genocidal destruction of others genetic progression, has all been produced through violence and force, whereas now today the "third world" of whome has been put in that so-called position by the white race descended out of the european caves, is now producing nationalistic measures in order to progress out of that stage of third world degression into re-civilizing back to their once prominence, and the leader in the re-introduction to our prominence is the motherland, and the afrikan throughout the diaspora, and the main arm of this revolution(360) is the afrikan inside of the main ring leader descendent european white, which is the Amerikkkan white, and their european brethren and other imperialistic thievery throughout the world, where the aboriginal populace has been usurped.

    Thats why Black Nationalism has nothing to do with a philosophy of what you paint, it is a mere affirmation of the enslaved hostage afrikan to re-claim their LIVES and OUR HISTORY, to be able to survive the present day self-destuctive degression of the artificial world set-up by this artificial white race, and to that point survive and empower for the NEW WORLD that is changing by way of natural forces.

    Black Nationalism is simply a means to survive in our former NATURAL way that was meant and set about by our creator, which is to help, love, progress, and evolve amongst and for your own kind and in our own land setting, climate, that was created for our own geneology and being.

    We are trapped inside of an artificial world, society, and land, and sub-culture, run by an oppressive govermental militaristic hostage type of rule, and that is akin and basic enslavement for the afrikan, and too much dilution and mixing within this framework throughout the diaspora or inside of the motherland, produces a more artificial degression with the one that wants to degress you amidst a fantasical belief, that they are "superior" and "civilized", when in fact they are just the opposite, and when directed to historical and present day fact, they will come face to face with that reality, which is why the white race wants to erase their history, and YOURS, because those two converge, and produce a truthful affirmation of that Nationalistic Mindset needed, that is natural to a being to be able to evolve and survive for the present and for the future, and as that affirmation is noted, the afrikan and hue-manity all over are seeing that it is only one mutated race that came forth and violently, deceitfully, and wickedly stole that natural evolvement and progression, which is why they are termed white devils.

    That is why "Black Nationalism and the mentality and action based components of this "structured" order is what is NATURAL, and what is needed to evolve and progress out of this artifical component set up by the devil, and become saved for the future.
     
  4. African_Prince

    African_Prince Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    What do you mean 'conservative consciousness' or 'liberal consciousness'. Conservatism/liberalism are styles of thinking.

    What are the vaues of 'Black consciousness'? The values of pan-Africanism include unity and co-operation, to me this implies right brain empathy. The values of BN (correct me if I'm wrong) include unity and co-operation but also in-group loyalty which is left brain/conservative. White conservatives are significantly more likely to be racist or prejudiced than are White liberals because they have the same in-group preferences, this may explain their stance on the war in Iraq or on illegal immigration from central American countries.
     
  5. cherryblossom

    cherryblossom Banned MEMBER

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    I only responded to what you presented....

    Yes, Pan-Africanists promote "unity and cooperation."----AMONGST AFRICAN PEOPLE.....GLOBALLY...throughout the DIASPORA...everywhere there are Africans and African descendants.

    Do you think Pan-Africanists advocate "Multi-Culturalism" as in Integrationism?



     
  6. Omowale Jabali

    Omowale Jabali The Cosmic Journeyman PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Historically speaking, there are two strands of Black nationalism.

    Cultural nationalism and revolutionary nationalism. Cultural nationalism has tended to be more conservative than revolutionary nationalism in its rejection of socialist ideology except for those who advocated for "African socialism" as opposed to "scientific socialism".

    This manifests also in differences within the Pan African movement on the continent. Senghor's Negritude is very distinct from Nyerere's Ujamaa and Nkrumahism is distinct from African Socialism.
     
  7. Ankhur

    Ankhur Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Black Nationalists don't give a hoot about what others do with their livesas long as it does not intefere with their and their communities progress and the lives of their family

    now what do you call conservative, not neocon ideas of today?

    Pro life? Nationalsist yes

    Less government? yes

    Tolerant if ones child is
    born homosexual
    but not happy
    about the concept yes

    conserving our
    dollars for our
    own interests yes

    understanding
    the need to buy
    politicians through
    lobbying for OUR
    Interests yes


    Pro right to bear
    arms yes


    pro business? when
    one lives
    as a nation
    within a nation
    then
    business collectives
    and
    collective banks
    are a necessary
    means of survival? then hell yes

    Black liberals and so called Black conservatives are
    delineated nowadays by white valuesand basically what passes for contemporary Black conservatives, are folks who go along with any type of government and corporate graft and corruption, calmly and pleasantly as long as they get their share, while having a caste system disdain and
    rejection of the greater majority of the Black community and view
    us with the same stereotypes that racist whites do.

    If one really wants to know how a computer works then it is best to do the research, rather then assume that a little goblin or gremlin or a hive of insects actually runs the thing

    and if one wants to know what Black Nationalism really is, then one should do thes same,
    since one does not have to go far to do the research since the data is posted here on several present posts as well as numerous posts in the archives
     
  8. Sekhemu

    Sekhemu Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Precisely

    Let's stop falling for the traps layed out by the usage of words designed by white supremacist
     
  9. African_Prince

    African_Prince Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    I don't think pan-Africanism is necessarily in conflict with multi-culturalism. You can advocate unity among your family while still identifying with non-family members.


    I thought that cultural nationalists tended to advocate a community-oriented kind of economy? I never thought of cultural nationalism as necessarily convervative.
     
  10. SophiaG

    SophiaG Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    When someone says the word Nationalism it makes me think of Mein Kampf. I'm wary of Black Nationalism and its objectives. I see it as a conservative ideology from what I've seen/read so far on here.

    I need to read more before I come to a more absolute conclusion.
     
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