Black People : If euros Owe Us Reparations, do we owe native americans?

Discussion in 'Black People Open Forum' started by kemetkind, Oct 14, 2007.

  1. kemetkind

    kemetkind Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    This topic has been on my mind since bro oldsoul's class last week where he touched on us as black people being invested in the european system when we make claims to property and/or wealth in america.

    Our ancestors were enslaved and their labor helped fund the genocide of native americans in this land.

    In some cases such as the buffalo soldiers we helped the european impose his will on this land.

    Now, most of us benefit from that genocide especially when our living standards are contrasted with other black folk on the planet.

    If we own land in this country, or we own property, should we give reparations to native americans if we are to be consistent in our expectations that we are owed reparations?

    Does the fact our ancestors were oppressed and we are still dealing with oppression today ABSOLVE us from any accountability for benefiting from a stolen land?
     
  2. Metaverse

    Metaverse Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Bro. KemetKind,

    the topic that has been on your mind, is clearly the topic that we should be discussing and learning more about. By coincidence this was the topic of discussion for the thinking Black Men and Women around me last week as well. Keep in mind, this is something we don’t want to talk about, because if true- where does this leave us?

    One of our Brothas made this point:

    Let’s say you’re a Mechanic and someone brings in a car to have you fix it. He wants you to paint the car, change the wheels, fix the leaky engine, and give it a tune up. That’s like a $2,000 job. You do everything that he asks. Its takes you about a 2-3 days to finish. He comes back, and says to you, look I only have $500, but I swear to you, I’ll give you the rest later. You trust his eyes, and his words, and so you give him the keys. He jumps in and takes off.

    The next day, the Police show up at your shop- telling you the Car was stolen and they arrested the Car Thief the night before. They ask for any extra details you might have on the Thief or the Car itself. But the only detail you have to offer is that this guy still owes you $1,500 for all the repairs you did to the car! The Police shrug their shoulders at you. There’s nothing we can do about that. That’s your loss.

    So you’re out $1500. Its not like you can go to the Car Thief for the money, he’s in jail. You can't ask the owner of the Car for the money, because legally they didn’t ask for any repairs.

    What can we learn here? America is the stolen car. Land that we have labored on, worked for, our Ancestors have died for, we continue to die for America. We were promised 40 Acres and a Mule that we never got. Like the Car Thief who promised the Mechanic the balance of his money. All we ever got was a down payment on our freedom, nothing more. We’re still living off the down payment. I’ve heard in several cases the Reparations agenda has become part African and Native American. The point still is, America is stolen property, and we are stolen people.

    America will be returned to Native blood. Whites who understand metaphysics and karma already see this taking place. Mexicans aren’t invading America, they are returning to the land of their Native blood. And there’s nothing anyone can do about it, because they are justified spiritually.

    As spiritual people, we have to learn how to get out of the way of spiritual matters, and attended to our own. Let’s use a little Socratic reasoning here.

    If America was stolen away from Native Indians, and now we find those with Native Indian blood returning to the land of their Ancestors who were killed and slaughtered by Whites, it is possible that since Africans were stolen away from Africa, that the Africans in America should be returning to the land of their Ancestors where they were stolen away from?

    If it is true that we were stolen away from Africa, then there is property in Africa that belongs to all of us here, and this is the land we should be fighting for. We have our own Empires that need attending too. I understand also that perhaps not all of us came to America on a slave ship, and some were here along with the Native Indians. This still helps to unite the Red and Black. If there is any real fight for Reparations from America the Red and Black should be repaired, and both should recieve justice.
     
  3. Goddess Auset333

    Goddess Auset333 Banned MEMBER

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    :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:

    KgMw MS writes: This still helps to unite the Red and Black. If there is any real fight for Reparations from America the Red and Black should be repaired, and both should recieve justice.
    Reply With Quote


    I have always said that when the Our Red brothers and Black brothers Unite, it will be on for sure.
    :SuN030: :SuN030: :SuN030:
     
  4. jamesfrmphilly

    jamesfrmphilly going above and beyond PREMIUM MEMBER

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    yes, it does. both peoples are owed reparations from the white devil.
     
  5. oldiesman

    oldiesman Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    if euros owe...

    we were duped just like the red man so we owe him nothing,what alot of us seem to forget is that there are many rich native americans in this country...and besides this talk of reparations is just that-TALK-cause the man ain't NEVER gonna give it up.
     
  6. Da Street So'ja

    Da Street So'ja Banned MEMBER

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    no euros owe them too

    of course
     
  7. Blackbird

    Blackbird Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Aaskënö'kêôk Kemetkind! Të'ë niyutyéê? (Greetings Kemetkind! What's happening?)

    I'm no expert on such matters; only my elders have such authority, but my heart felt compelled to respond. I am a proud descendant of the resultant admixture of African and First Nation peoples. My bloodline includes the enduring lineages of West and Central Africa, as well as, the courageous Numunuu (Comanche), Unyææshæötká' (Black Minqua/Ohio Seneca) and Skarure (Tuscarora) peoples. Indeed, like so many of my relations, I am both Red and Black -the epitome of a Pan African and American Unity in the human physical form. I work with both the vodu, nkisi, orisa and egunwa from the African side and the Corn Mother, Thunderbirds, little people and ancestral spirits on the First Nation side. I sprinkle tobacco and blow smoke at the four corners, smudge with sage, cedar and sweetgrass, wash with efun, osun dudu and shea and generally attempt to carry myself in a sacred manner that brings honor to my ancestors of both worlds. I'm equally comfortable at a playing to the orisa or an intertribal powwow.

    I am an Ab'orisa and Vodunsi initiate and an apprentice medicine man (Bearwalker), blessed by my 9th generation grandfather with the ability to shapeshift. I am fulfilling my blood, genetic and spiritual obligations.
    Nuff said...

    The history of the African and First Nation person was as peculiar as that infamous institution of slavery. Sometimes, like in the case of Maroons/Seminoles, Yamasee and Natchez, they were allies - fighting a common oppressor; yet other times, their interaction was worst than the white enemy's relationship with either of them. The Cherokees, Creeks, Chickasaws, Choctaws and Seminoles are known to have enslaved Africans and reign over them in some of the most brutal and oppressive ways. Called the Five Civilized Tribes, they sought earlier on even before forced removal (Trail of Tears and Hungry Bellies) to emulate the tabu (White rabbits) and adopted many of his ways from his style of dress, housing, and religion to his ideology. Surprising enough, in the 1830's the Cherokee Nation ratified their Constitution which forbade the marriage of any Cherokee citizen to a Negro! The other groups went on to eventually adopt some law (spoken or unspoken) that seeked to disenfrachise and consider those African descent as less than. One Chickasaw individual is said to have "enslaved" more Africans than any other slaveholder in the American South; an estimated number exceeding 1000 enslaved Africans. My paternal grandfather's own people, the Comanche, would capture runaway slaves and either sell them back into slavery in Louisiana or Old Mexico. Our history is capricious at best.

    The Buffalo Soldiers were African people, newly jubliant from the liberation of slavery and vogue of Africans in the Union Army, engaged in battles and skirmishes from Texas to Colorado to Nebraska to Arizona between the 1860's and 1890's. They fought my grandfather's people along with the Cheyenne, Kiowa and Arapaho at Palo Duro Canyon in ancient Kwahadi lands. Eventhough the "possible" atrocities committed by these men can not be excused, they were operating under the ever present hope that our valiance would prove our self-worth among the Big Knifes and Heavy Eyebrows. The Buffalo Soldiers earned the respect and admiration of the Cheyenne who gave them their sacred name.

    Furthermore and ultimately, it should be understood that both Red and Black peoples were unwilling participants in the clash of civilizations, worlds and cultures by their staunchest enemy - the Washicu. We, as Black people, owe no more to the First Nations or their ancestors than they owe to us. Consequently, our destinies are intertwined through this science project called Amerika. One can not blame the dog for attacking another person when his master is the one who put him against the other.

    Old Man Coyote once told me in dreamtime, "You wouldn't know your nose existed if it weren't on your face. You think so much like a white man." We can not allow what is obviously apparent to be missed by our perception because the white man's guilt. Our people have no power to take another's land and capitalize our its resources. Our people are still fighting to be free.

    Blackbird (shaking the turtle-shelled rattle and the shekere' at the same time, holding the sacred tools of the Numunu Tuhwi society)
     
  8. Destee

    Destee destee.com STAFF

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    Brother Kemetkind ... i don't have the answer to your question, but i wanna invite you to join Mr. Fuller's Elder Interview tonight. When speaking with him briefly yesterday, about his life growing up, he has LOTS to share about the Indians! OMG! You know, it doesn't take someone saying a whole lot, for me to find something in it that i didn't know ... but omg ... i didn't know about any of the stuff he shared, just in passing, about his early days and the Indians. So you won't want to miss this, and he may be able to give a new, different, or applicable perspective to your questions.

    Much Love and Peace.

    :heart:

    Destee
     
  9. kemetkind

    kemetkind Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    I'll be there. :D

    Thanks for the reminder Destee!:love:
     
  10. King Tubbs

    King Tubbs Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Lets not forget some Cherokee and other native people had African slaves and not only are they not even thinking about giving us reparations, they are busy trying to exit and exclude tribe members with African blood but interestingly do not try to exclude those with European blood.
     
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