Black Education / Schools : Grads find job market tougher than job counselors told them

Discussion in 'Black Education / Schools' started by dustyelbow, Dec 5, 2007.

  1. dustyelbow

    dustyelbow Well-Known Member MEMBER

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  2. mrron

    mrron Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Very good article dustyelbow. I wouldn't say that the colleges are failing these youths. The article infers that about twenty percent of them are having a lot of difficulty. I would think that they are the bottom of the barrel. A college education alone will not guarantee anybody a job of their choice. Many of the honor students get multiple job offers. Too many of these kids are just plain spoiled, and they think an employer is going to come looking for them. There are job vacancies in lots of places, but those recent grads have to be willing to relocate to get those jobs. Many of those jobs are overseas in Spain, France, England, The continent of Africa, India and China and other places.

    Many corporations are actually looking outside of the country to fill job vacancies that they can't fill here. Under the H1b visa program, foreign skilled workers are recruited to fill job opening here. Many company's are asking the government to increase the number of visas they issue each year, because there is still a great demand. Some would argue that they are doing this because they can pay less money to foreign workers. To that I say, "whats wrong with that?". We have to compete globally now for everything else, why not labor?

    I work for the federal government, we are hiring a lot of new people for the Dept. of Homeland Security. The requirement's are a college degree with at least a 3.25 grade point average in the major area of study. Many of the new recruits don't want to work the hours we work, which include evenings, weekends and holidays. The pay is excellent, but many start looking for another job as soon as they graduate from the academy. We have been losing about eighty percent of them within the first three years. Many take lower paying jobs to acommadate their social schedules. We have a constant shortage of people.

    I have a twenty six year old step son, who just decided to go to college because he couldn't find the "kind of job" he wants. The major he chose is not in great demand, but he lives in la la land, so he going to take a student loan and start classex soon. This generation doesn't have the attitude of "hustle", that my generation has. In my opinion, you have to take a job when you are unemployed, and look for your pot of gold there, you never know where you are going to find it.
     
  3. FaithSoulSistah

    FaithSoulSistah Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    "I don't think we do a good job of preparing them for the real world."

    This quote from the article sums it up pretty well.
     
  4. KWABENA

    KWABENA STAFF STAFF

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    Ummm....can a Junior Undergraduate College Student get involved in this discussion...LOL!

    I like what is being said here. I am at the center of the discussion, so I feel my view(s) should not be taken lighty.

    I have switched majors a series of times, because my first objective is to know what I am in school for, and develop a sense of direction with the knowledge of why I am in school. I can tell you that I am in my Junior year (if I was not transferring to UMD (Maryland), I would be a senior), i've done a fellowship and an internship in the past 2 summers (applying for another one next summer as we speak), have a Honors level G.P.A., have enough volunteer hours to take a Professional person's career (Smile!); I have one heck of a resume. However, the resume is not as important as what has been done behind the text on the resume. I have literally saved some folk's jobs here where I am, and have done so since Freshman year! I do not say that to brag; I really said that to say college students need to be involved in more than just class/academic work. Sitting in the Dorm(s) studying for extensive hours earning a 4.0 G.P.A does not guarantee a job! You have to have other outside involvement. I may have a "B" average, but once I graduate, I am 110% confident that I can take any job in any school of my choice, especially if it has Housing and a Bookstore. As I sit here and type, I have outstanding Office Management skills, communication is top-notch, management and maintenance skills are top-notch; I will have absolutely no problems finding a job when I graduate. The best thing about that is [speaking of academics] I have been "around the block" when it comes to Liberal Arts (one of my Professors calls it Learning Across the Curriculum), so I have a bit of know-how in many areas of study.

    Anyhow, I can tell you that now, because of what I call "College Politics" (or Collitics), I can not officially work those positions. That does not bother me, because what I am in the midst of doing now (even if it were waiting tables), it is an investment. People do not look at that when considering employment through college. Yes, it would be very, very nice to work in the field to which you belong through college (especially Undergraduate), but it does not always work that way. For instance, I have students/residents in my dorm who are, let's say, Health/Phys. Ed. majors, but they work at UPS moving boxes. That may not be their careers, but they are making an investment. Furthermore, they are not running around the campus looking for Work-Study positions that have already been filled, and starving for an opportunity to earn a dollar. Not only are they making an investment in the work-world, they are also being paid in the process of doing it.

    Lastly, I have to put some of this on the Education(al) System as well. I, to this day, still do not see how a knowledge of (e.g. Calculus) will teach me and help me to run a community, and build a healthy community. The information conveyed in class(es) must be much, much more relevant and applicable to what we deal with in society today. There also must be a more interactive way of dealing with it. For example, I feel that "across the curriculum," there should be more discussion on certain material, in order for pupils/students to be more engaged and for greater clarity and understanding. I certainly know two majors today that are interactive, engaging, and can secure careers at post-grad that people overlook - English and Writing - LOL! I mean, at least there is some significance in it! You actually have Science and Technology-related majors whose English is poor, but they can do the work. What is up with this...what ever happened to being a True Scholar? The curriculum is not set up to produce 'True Scholars,' which is one reason why there are certain [worthless] classes you must take to graduate (e.g. Algebra), versus those of importance (e.g. Government) that you do not have to take.

    I think I said enough. I may be off with my analysis, but now is a good time to get feedback from those who have something great to contribute.

    MK
     
  5. dustyelbow

    dustyelbow Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Thanks all....

    That is 20% of the 50 something percent of WHITE AMERICANS who graduate from COLLEGE....

    ONLY 30 something PERCENT of BLACK PEOPLE graduate with a BACHELORS DEGREE...

    ASIANS have the HIGHEST GRADUATION RATES at 60 something PERCENT...

    I have seen a BLACK HARVARD GRADUATE going a BEGGING in the NATION...

    We have some VERY SERIOUS PROBLEMS in the NATION...

    I will comment later perhaps...
     
  6. KWABENA

    KWABENA STAFF STAFF

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    In today's society, do you know what it takes to get through school? Even students who receive enumerated scholarships and grants are struggling to keep things alive on America's campuses!

    MK
     
  7. mrron

    mrron Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    I guess if you look for trouble, dustyelbow, you can find it on the net, somewhere. Why dwell on the negative information you find? Just about any place you look, at least ninety percent of black college graduates are employed and doing okay. So we can't say that the majority of black college graduates can't find jobs due to discrimination. Now that's not to say that there is none, but if you've been black all of your life, you are well aware of it already.

    As to your Harvard buddy who is unemployed, he is among the minority of black unemployed college graduates. According to a site I found on google, Harvard has the largest percentage of black students at a traditional school, it also has the highest percentage of blacks who do their entire four years and graduate. In fact, most of the Ivy league schools mentioned were in the ninety percentle rage for black graduates.

    You mentioned Asians having a high percentage of college graduates among their people. That goes to show you the advantage of a culture that encourages education, they are not superior, they are driven to succeed. I have five choldren, three of them are college graduates, that is because I drove education into them from an early age, and left no room for excuse's for the ones that I knew had the talent, they didn't all have the same amount of talent, so I didn't push them all. One of the two who didn't attend college, was actually college material, but he liked his girlfriend too much and ended up with two kids before he turned nineteen years old. I have three grandchildren who are college age, and two of them are in college. There is one hundred percent employment among all the people in my entire family, and that is because they know how to find a job, and they must take a lesser job than they desire, if that is all there is available at the time. I'm sure they have experienced racism also, but I don't really want to hear about it. Three are homeowners, and one has been in jail a few times, he was not college material.

    I can't fathom someone going to college for four years and not knowing what is required of them to find a job, what did they learn during all that time? I do know through my own experience, that many blacks are not willing to go where the jobs are, if it means relocating, maybe even a few thousand miles, that is somehting I had to do more than once.

    As I said in my earlier reply, many companies are recruiting from abroad, that means that those grads are willing to relocate to a foreign country to get a job. Black parents need to teach their chldren about global economics, because that is what the future of the world is coming to.

    Kwabena, please go into more detail about the difficulties you and others might be experiencing in college.
     
  8. dustyelbow

    dustyelbow Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Hey mrron I am glad

    OK so if your full of light will you JOIN ME on a PILGRIMAGE through our WORST NEIGHBORHOODS in the NATION for an ASSESSMENT of WHAT NEEDS can be MET, mrron.

    I think NOT...FEAR and HATE are NATION PASTTIMES.

    By the way I dont give NEGATIVE INFORMATION only a PIECE of what LIFE is in the NATION.

    I do not make it up.

    I ask our ADULT BROTHERS and SISTERS how are they doing...if they have a frown and say OK I just dont THINK things are OK mrron. They are in TROUBLE and have GREAT WORRIES that come off and ON....

    LACK of PREPARATION somewhere...(COLLEGE could be a SOURCE)

    I would LOVE to say they are doing GREAT because if they are doing GREAT then I can get GREAT ANSWERS otherwise OK answers leave a GREAT LEVEL of DOUBT....

    Hey BTW I am THANKFUL to be in the MIDST of the NATION mrron...I am in the midst of GREAT SECRETS (MYSTERIES) ready to be EXPOSED in the NATION....It's very EXCITING....I get a FRONT ROW SEAT to SEE it ALL DEVELOP...I could PROFIT off OUR IGNORANCE but that will bring a BROTHER DOWN and SEPARATE HIM (MYSTERY)

    We encourage EDUCATION too mrron otherwise we would not be considered ADULTS in the NATION trying to be LAW ABIDING and follow its EVER CHANGING RULES.

    Otherwise EVERY SINGLE BALCK MAN, WOMAN, and CHILDREN would be in JAIL.

    I could be in JAIL myself.

    I congradulate ASIANS for their NATION EXPERIENCE mrron, it does not mean the BLACK EXPERIENCE in the NATION is any LESS.

    Ruthless white sets our EDUCATION anyway through their FOUNDATIONS even BLACK SCHOOLS got money from FOUNDATIONS to do GREAT THINGS in the NATION. They set the AGENDA mrron. That's FAMILY BUSINESS.

    HARVARD btw has one of the LARGEST FOUNDATIONS FUNDS in the NATION...

    AMAZING...

    Can you PROVIDE a LINK and 2nd does it GIVE STATISTICS of HOW MANY BOSTON LOCAL BLACKS are WELCOME into their FINE INSTITUTION.

    Let me make it a BIT FAIRER, MASSACHUSETTS BLACKS...Thanks

    Greatly APPRECIATE...

    Although I PRAISE YOU mrron, what you are DOING is NOT NEW. It is always a FAMILY AFFAIR in every NATION since their BEGINNINGS mrron. So, I congradulate you on being a TRADITIONALIST. I can count you among the MANY TRADITIONALIST. Being a TRADITIONALIST these DAYS is TAKING A HEAVY TOLL on the POPULATION.

    Interesting...


    Wow that is why TRAINING is a MULTIBILLION DOLLAR LOST on PRODUCTIVITY mrron. Somebody must NOT GET IT.

    RELOCATING is FINE but somehow HABITS tend to FOLLOW and RUIN it for the NATIVES.

    Are we RELOCATING for SELF FULFILLMENT or SOMETHING GREATER?

    QUESTIONS I ask mrron, and I do not get an ANSWER many times....

    I will hopefully come back AGAIN another time...
     
  9. mrron

    mrron Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Thanks for responding to my reply dustyelbow. If you go to google and put in -percentage of black college graduates-, you will get a list of good sites to go to for information on that topic.

    To your assertion that we have a culture that encourages education, I would strongly disagree. We are actually multi cultural, and some of us encourage education. I can't imagine why we would have the disasterous dropout rate among black males, if they were being "encouraged" to get an education.

    I am on a constant "pilgrimage" through the black community. Remember, I am a landlord to many poor black people. I recently had a meeting with a city council member who represents one of the districts I own homes in. She has the same concerns as you and I. She is also as befuddled as I am. We don't understand why there is so much drug dealing going on for one thing. Kids prefer that to school. Guns are another big problem. My son recently had someone knock at his door, and when he answered, some kid was looking for his cell phone which he lost in that area. When my son told him he didn't know anything about it, the kid pulled out a gun. My son closed the door, and ran out of the back of the house. An hour later, there were five people shot, in two different shootings, two died, all of the shootings were near my son's house. We don't know who the assailant(s) were yet. This is a plague, and a sympton that something is terribly wrong within "our" community, alot of anger and neglect, and it's up to us to get it right.

    As to people doing okay, that is what most people say to me, they could be anybody. Most people don't like their jobs, have health problems, financial problems, marital problems, car problems, spiritual problems etc. There is a line from a classic Earth,Wind and Fire song. It say's "if there ain't no beauty, you got to make some beauty".

    As to Harvard, it's ranked number one among all of the colleges in the country, only the best and brightest need to apply there, but they do have an affirmative action program in place, and they do have highly qualified blacks. Where they come from is not relevant.

    I'm currently reading Bill Cosby's book Come On People. I thinks it should be read by a lot of people in our community, but again, he's just preaching to the choir. The ones who need to read it are not likely to read it or any other book, unfortunately. I will be reading another one of Eric Michael Dysons books soon too.

    Perhaps you didn't get my point about relocating, let me make it clear. If I live in Chicago and the job I want is in Atlanta, then I need to pack up and move to Atlanta, because the job is not going to come to me. What is wrong with that? We can't accept any more excuses for unemployment, especially when it concerns black college graduates.
     
  10. KWABENA

    KWABENA STAFF STAFF

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    OK-

    You will have to excuse me, Bro. DustyEl and Bro. Ron. I have just completed my final exams, as tough as this time of the semester can be. Anyhow, on with the discussion...

    I am actually glad to see conversations like this taking place, especially as it pertains to college students. Please y'all, be mindful that I am currently the Resident Assistant of my college dormitory, do not get paid for what I do, yet I work harder, and bust my bottom behind 24/7 to make this place the best that it can be for my Students/Residents. Furthermore, that is needless to say that I have played the role of "acting" Manager for the past 4-6 weeks, still not being paid for it, yet I "held it down" and did an outstanding job. I said that to say the following...

    When you look at that, then look at the fact that I am a Community Health major, have a powerful political/environmental outlook and then some, you will know that things such as "the condition of our people" would interest me. As I mentioned twice before, I am not paid for what I am doing, but what I am doing is what I feel many parents/adults in the communities should be doing. It hurts when I have to bear witness to the fact that I am under-appreciated for my efforts, have to finance my way through everything, have to make tough decisions without any backup whatsoever, etc. Perhaps that is the college experience, but I just have to get that out to allude to the fact that I am one who has done something, and is doing something significant to build and re-build black folk in this country and around the world.

    In reference to your request, Bro. Ron:

    The toughest thing about doing this is no matter how much or what I tell you, it will not compare to reality here on this campus. The other tough thing about this is, as much as I am solution-driven, I have to sound as if I am complaining like I am not doing anything. Consider the fact that I am the same person who spent all day taking exams, all evening placing over 3,000-8,000 [text]books and items back on shelves (tomorrow will be no different), and all night taking care of over 250 gallons worth of trash. I actually just completed the trash. I spend so much time working my behind, body, soul, and heart off to keep things on track (nothing paid for it), I do not even get time to chill out with the Destee Fam! It is funny how I am often told that "it would look good on a resume." A resume is cheap junk food plastic compared to what I have really done! I can not even tell how many volunteer hours I have, because I have been "volunteering" as if what I am doing is a 24/7 job with no vacations, no benefits, no days off, then of course, little appreciation.

    You would actually have to be here to understand what I mean. The only people at this institution who would understand the "experience" inside-out, would be the students here themselves, especially those who have spent the bulk of their undergraduate term on-campus.

    First and foremost, the college is located in a very bad, unhealthy, lazy environment. The people around the school actually despise education, and consider you (as an elder stated to me) "not too well-liked" as a college student. How can I help my people if they look down on me for the person I am in the person of a local college student? I could not even do anything effective when I did work-study at one of the pre-dominantly black middle schools around the corner from the college. You face as much havoc there as on the campus - especially considering the fact that students/children there are definitely treated like prisoners, and perceived as if they are a sorry bunch headed nowhere in life. Then when one of them gets angry and commits a crime, we come back and say "lock them up! They are cruel, dangerous, they deserve to be punished - there is no excuse for that!" Well I can say the same about crooked politicians, foreign military troops, and zealous religion-centered people, who travel the world saying "...if you do not believe in my god/lord and savior, you will "have your place in hell, and will burn in the lake of fire!" These are things that should be brought to the fore-front.

    Anyhow, so much for that. I wanted to allude to the fact that there are no job opportunities around the school. That makes it extremely difficult for on-campus students to get a job. They have classes all day, and Dorm Managers are being fussed at for not doing evening programs with the students, which means that students get fussed at when they do not/can not participate. They can not participate, because they need to have a means of making money, which means they need a job. It is also worth noting that Federal College-Work-Study is limited (insofar as slots available, monies, and duration of FCWS a semester). When they get a job, transportation is limited, so they lose out on that. Also, they have to eat their 3 meals in the cafeteria where they spend well over $1,600 a semester to eat. The jobs that they get have to be something like UPS, janitorial, or something like that, because "overnight" is the best and only thing available to them. Now this invites trouble, because I did not even get a chance to mention the academics/grades! What happens when you need to type a paper, but there are limited spaces in the computer lab, which only opens 9 hours, and there are no computers operating in the dorms? That smells much like trouble to me, especially considering the fact that it costs over $15,000 a year to deal with this madness!

    I only told you about maybe 4% of how things are around here. This is not to say that it is like this in every school; it is surely the case here. Some schools have it better and others have it worse, but the bottom line is we can not keep things going this way time-after-time, and expect progress to be made. Whether they are better or worse, we all need to be pitch in and make every environment for learning and working exactly that - a true working-learning environment. How else will the young folk who follow us get ahead?

    To be continued...

    MK
     
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