Black Spirituality Religion : God Is No Respecter of Persons -Sekhemu

Discussion in 'Black Spirituality / Religion - General Discussion' started by rmstkd, Jul 28, 2003.

  1. rmstkd

    rmstkd Member MEMBER

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    Sekhemu, (I'm responding to you from the Interracial Dating thread) sorry it took a while to post this, but had a power outage here from thunderstorm.

    I could not locate the passage you wrote. "I set you apart nation from nation that you may know each other." Nevertheless, the way that it is worded, for now I am going to assume that is from the Old Testament which I would guess that a covenant was involved. God made a promise and in order for that promise be fullfilled, the person/people he made the promise to had to abide by His word. And the covenant made affected everyone in that nation - children of Israel.

    Some people see a covenant as show favoritism. I don't. Its just a promise between you and God that you will do your part and He will sho' nuff do His.

    Think of it this way. I have a God fearing mother (who is a minister btw) and she has a convenant with the Lord. In my days of raising hell with the rest of the hoodlums, they manage to get caught by the law, but I didn't. Why is that? Because I had a prayer mother who constantly stays in the word and doing what she promised God she would do. Therefore, that covenant (whatever it may be) covered me too even when I was a hell raiser. It wasn't that I got away with that because I had her to deal with and trust me when I tell you that when you have God fearing mother it's best to be on your BEST behavior.

    A scripture comes to mind that does not involve a convent. Romans 2:9-11:

    9 There will be sorrow and suffering for Jews and Gentiles alike who keep on sinning. 10 But there will be glory and honor and peace from God for all wo obey him, whether they are Jews or Gentiles. 11 For God treats everyone the same.

    Anyways, I hope that clears that up. If not, I will try again.

    BTW, I don't think of us as Heinz 57, but a beautiful multicolor rose garden God has made.
     
  2. Sekhemu

    Sekhemu Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Thank you for responding sistah, however I will have to agree to disagree with you on a number of points. I am not a Christian. So I let me get that out of the way, nor am I a muslim or "Jew" With that said I believe that the prophecies and scriptures in the old testament do refer to us, subsequently appropiated, during the council of nicea in 325 a.d. by the Romans. However, if we are to honor that promise that would mean that all of laws, intructed "God" for us to obey would and should be adhered to. Including mixing our seed. From a socio-psychological, historical and contemporary point of view.... we can see today that mixing, particuliarly with the descendants of the slave master and other europeans has not done a thing to bring us back around full circle to the glory we once had. In fact. it has caused a pathology of self hate and a tremendous sense of despair and hoplessness.

    If we were to remove the religious dogma from the discourse and look purely on the basis of history, there would be no question that over the past 6000 years, all of our great civilizations and cultures were destroyed by naive, (at best) weak leaders who were all to happy to integrate with people from Asia and europe. The consequences of this were total and complete destruction of all of our kingdoms. Starting from Khemet(Egypt) on down to Songhay in the western Sudan.... primarily at the hands of Arabs and converted blacks to Islam.

    So in short. to this very day, we are still enamored, and inundated with the images and the premiums... placed on white superiority. We maintain a rigid fixation on hair texture, eye color and complexion... thru concious and sub-concious behavior. Until black people in this country and abroad, can demystify and deprogram the vestiges and legacy of white supremacy in our psyches, then integration will do nothing more than maintain and reinforce the status quo

    It has been said that to worship the God that your oppressors forced on you will severe the bond and tie you have to your ancestors. The traditions we had before we were brought to this country, honored and venerated the ones who came before us. They acted as the trunk to the root of the tree we call God acting on our behalf as well as protecting us and guiding us. Alas they are nowhere to be heard and are forgotten Unfortunately western religion has taught us that this connection is evil and that this is of the Devil. Perhaps this is why the anglo-saxon stripped us of language and the ability to make the drum. All of this was prophecied long before there was a religion called Judaism or christianity in Khemet in the Medu Netcher i.e. heiroglyphs. But I guess we black folk just harded headed.

    Hotep my sistah

    One
     
  3. ifasehun

    ifasehun Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    i concur w/ Sekhemu.

    God dont like ugly - and He dont like foolish either. Why would we attempt to act like God wants us to date and marry into ethnicities that by and large - hurt us.

    By and large all of the following is true:

    1. whites that can be completely trusted by black people are few.
    2. whites that would forsake their own race to stand by us in times of need are few.
    3. whites that would encourage to reclaim our own culture are few.
    4. white that understand the importance of us reclaiming our culture and would put aside their own selfish desires if they stood in the way of us reclaiming our culture are few.
    5. whites that understand, believe and dislike the role their race currently plays in killing all people of color's cultures is few.
    6. whites that understand they inadvertly play a role in the destruction of diversity is few.

    now why would God want you to marry into a family that might eventually kill yours? now if you go on and do that, maybe He supports - as all good parents do - He doesnt leave you out to dry. but that doesnt mean He is saying, "now that was not the best choice to make silly child. now you gotta work harder than ever."
     
  4. rmstkd

    rmstkd Member MEMBER

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    To Sekhemu I'm glad that we had this chance to discuss this, though I disagree with you on a few things. And that's healthy to agree to disagree.

    The Old Testament is based on " the law" and we also have the New Testament which is based on the Holy Spirit. Both Testaments are for "us" not just one. However, there are people who try to live by the OT but without the Holy Spirit and that just can't be done. It was prophesied in the OT about Jesus coming and He came to fulfill the law of the OT.

    You stated: We maintain a rigid fixation on hair texture, eye color and complexion... thru concious and sub-concious behavior."

    Who is "we"? I'm sure every black will not agree with that statement. Granted I believe there are quite a few of us will fall into that category but definitely not all.

    You said: "It has been said that to worship the God that your oppressors forced on you will severe the bond and tie you have to your ancestors."

    Interesting. During slavery the masters did their best to keep our folk ignorant. They made it illegal to read or write.(Some learned anyway). They keep them ignorant by telling them that God only reveal the truth thru one man (they twisted the bible to their advantage) and how it was illegal for them to think for oneself. I can't see where the forcing on of God by the oppressor came from. Because at no point during slavery education was forced on slaves.

    In my family, we have Mormons, Jehovah Witness, Cathothic, Baptist, atheists, two muslims that I know of, etc. We all get along (from time-to-time). No God, no Buddha, no Muhammad, no anything or anybody was forced on my family. Everyone made their own choice as to where they wanted to be. Yes, there was so question as to why some chose this or that, but it was their chose and we still love them regardless if their faith is different.

    Well, I have to get ready for my class. I will come back to this later.
     
  5. Sekhemu

    Sekhemu Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    I will answer you by your first question first. True enough "we" may sound like all, however I do think you get my gist. Most of us are still enamored by hair texture, perhaps to a lesser degree by eye color and complexion. However you sort of side stepped the fact that far too many of us are influenced by what was learned on the plantation in terms of beauty and self esteem, passed down from one generation to the next. You mention that during slavery, masters did their best to keep slaves ignorant. ignorant of what they wanted us to learn. How do you explain the fact that there was a tried and true practice of breaking a slave, including forbidding him/her from speaking their original language and practicing traditional african religions. Although this was not carried out as strictly in Cuba or Brazil. I'm sure you're aware that slaves did attend church... the overseer and/or slave master was the one who preached the sermon on Sundays. This is a form of indoctrination at best, and brain washing at worst. So we are not talking about education, we are talking about traditional african Gods being subverted, or forced by a thorough and comprehensive campaign to make black people weak and docile. Religion was the main tool to emplament this plan. I would say they've done a very good job too, unfortunately
     
  6. ifasehun

    ifasehun Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    I.
    it would be a great exxageeration to imply that the majority of black in the world are over their issues of skin, hair and gender issues created by slavery.

    II.
    if someone controls your knowledge of the religious options and places before you options that are not of your origin. and associates options of your origin with satanism or paganism or idolotry they are in essence - CONTROLLING your religious options.

    In time the control does not have to be so obvious. And in time the longing for other options ceases. Leaving a person to unknowingly follow the will of a master long dead and gone.

    Proof Follows Below:


    that sounds like they "gave" us christianity on purpose.

    this clearly shows the legacy of a variety of ministries available to the early african and what each did - and the benefit and danger to the white man's empire based on that type of ministry.
     
  7. PurpleMoons

    PurpleMoons Administrator STAFF

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    NOT QUOTING FROM ANYONE BUT SPEAKING FROM MY OWN THOUGHT. I BELIEVE THAT WITHIN THE SPIRIT WE HAVE SOME SENSE BUT NOT COMPLETE SENSE OF WHAT IS RIGHT AND WRONG. I,VE SEEN A VERY INTERESTING DOCUMENTARY OF ONE OF OUR ANCESTOR RELIGIOUS PRACTICES. WHERE MINGI WAS SO FEARED THAT THEY WOULD KILL THEIR OWN IN ORDER TO ESCAPE THE WRATH OF MINGI. IF A CHILD WAS BORN OUT OF MARRIAGE THE ELDERS WOULD READ THE INTESTINES OF A ANIMAL AND DECIDE IF THAT CHILD SHOULD LIVE OR DIE.
    IF A BABY TOP TEETH WERE FORMED BEFORE THE BOTTOM TEETH THEN THAT WAS MINGI AND THAT CHILD WAS KILLED. IF A MAN WANTED TO MARRY A WOMEN/CHILD HE HAD TO PAY THE FAMILY OF THAT WOMEN\CHILD. IF THAT MAN DID'NT HAVE ENOUGH COWS TO PAY FOR THE DAUGHTER OF THE FAMILY THEN HE COULD NOT MARRY. ACCORDING TO HOW MANY COWS HE HAD IT DETERMINED HOW MANY WIVES HE COULD HAVE. MY POINT IS THAT IF OUR ANCESTOR WERE SO RELIGIOUSLY CORRECT THEN WHY DID SLAVERY DESTROY SO MANY OF US?WOULD'NT THEIR HIGHER POWER HAVE PROTECTED THIER CHILDREN FROM THE CAPTIVITIES OF MEN? SOMEHOW I FEEL INSIDE MYSELF THAT THIS RELIGIOUS PRACTICE HAS CURSED OUR RACE. I DO BELIEVE THAT WE SHOULD NOT MARRY OUT OF OUR RACE BECAUSE OF RELIGION. IF TWO COUPLES HAVE DIFFERENT RELIGIONS ONES ANCESTORS MIGHT BE CURSED OR BLESSED. WHICH INTERFERS WITH GODS PLAN FOR EACH INDIVIDUAL. HOWEVER, I BELIEVE THAT PEOPLE SHOULD SEEK THE TRUTH ABOUT GOD OR WHATEVER NAME THEY ADDRESS THEIR HIGHER POWER IN ORDER TO KNOW ITS EXPECTATIONS AND WHAT ONE HAVE TO DO TO MAINTAIN ITS CONNECTIONS/OBEDIENCE SO THAT HE MAY LIVE FOREVER IN HARMONY WITH HIS HIGHER POWER. NO RELIGIOUS PRACTICE IS TOTALLY CORRECT BUT THE MESSAGE REMAINS THE SAME. BOWDOWN TO THE CREATER. PLACE NO MAN OR IDIOL BE FOR IT.
    LOVE EACH OTHER. RESPECT AND OBEY ITS LAW BRING NO HARM UNTO ANOTHER. FOR IT (THE HIGHER POWER) WILL BE THE ONLY JUDGE OF MAN. THE CREATOR AND THE CREATOR ALONE WILL HAVE THE FINAL WORD OF A MANS FATE. MY QUESTIONS I POSE ONTO YOU ARE: HAVE YOU FOLLOWED THE LAWS OF YOUR HIGHER POWER COMPLETELY? IF YES, ARE YOU TOTALLY SURE WITHOUT QUESTIONING YOURSELF? THEN I SAY THIS TO YOU
    WHAT DOES IT MATTER WHICH RELIGION IS CORRECT IF YOUR FAITH AND OBEDIENCE TO YOUR HIGHER POWER STANDS FIRMLY ROOTED TO IT? I DONT KNOW MUCH ABOUT TO MANY RELIGIONS BUT I KNOW THAT I AM NOT PERFECT BUT I'LL STRIVE TO BE OBEDIENT TO MY HIGHER POWER/ MY CREATOR. HE WILL ALONE JUDGE ME IN THE END AND NO MAN WILL DESTROY MY FAITH IN HIM OUR MY DESIRE TO BE CLOSER TO HIM. I CONTINUE TO PRAY FORGIVENESS, STRENGTH, KNOWLEDGE, WISDOM, AND COURAGE BECAUSE EVIL IS REAL AND I FALL SHORT OF MY CREATORS DEVINE SELF.
     
  8. ifasehun

    ifasehun Well-Known Member MEMBER

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  9. PurpleMoons

    PurpleMoons Administrator STAFF

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    You raised some interesting points. ones I will consider and I dont resent my ancestors I just know that they too were'nt perfect. you are right, God don't curse his people. So, we are being punished because our lack of faith and obedience to our ancestors and not to him? Then when did this lack of faith begin, Was it before slavery or after? I know that we must struggle in order to grow, learn,and I must continue to pray for strength, knowledge,wisdom, and courage. Each journey that I take, each aquaintance that I face is indeed a learning process for me. I will continue to be open to the knowledge that is shared here but I will always question mans intentions be it black or white. For I myself is'nt perfect but I'll strive to be.

    Thank you Ifasehun! your knowledge is welcomed here!
     
  10. rmstkd

    rmstkd Member MEMBER

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    I side stepped because this has nothing to do with the topic at hand. However, I will oblige you by saying, there are a lot of things that are passed down from generation to generation out of ignorance. That's just one of the things and another is racism. When the seed of ignorance is embedded so deep, there's not much we can do to change their way of thinking. It's called the "divide and rule" I pray they are delivered from such ignorance. One person at a time.


    Yep, I am well aware of the breaking of a slave. Yes the slave owners forbade the slaves to speak their native tongue and for them to not practice their traditional religions. One of the main reasons why masters did not want their slaves to become Christians was because of the Bible. They didn't want slaves to interpret the teachings of Christ as being in favour of equality. This was one of the main reasons why most slave owners didn't want their slaves learning to read. Also, slave owners didn't want an uprising.

    From my studies of slavery and things told to the family by my late Grandmother (born in 1900 - died 1988) about her mother and her Grandmother, not saying it didn't happen, for those slave owners (which were few) who didn't have a major problem with slaves having church, I never noticed where the overseer or the masters preached church sermons to the slaves. The masters got missionaries and there were times that black ministers came in to preach the service but the master and/or the overseer was also in attendance to ensure things didn't get out of hand.


    I would love to continue this coversation today, but I'm off on vacation for a few days. I will be respond to your posting when I return.

    Peace.
     
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