Black People : Gil Noble; 1960s, interview with: a mad man or wise man?

Ankhur

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"A mad man or wise man?"

...Or a mad wise man who is blaming and pointing the finger
at everyone/thing but us?:?:

please listen to what he is really saying and you can see that even back then he was blaming our lack of focus or clarity regarding our understanding or penetration of the concepts of political ideology as a manifestation of voting for ones choices , ones own choices, decided by regular people not corporations andobviously,
not just the lesser of 2 evils.

His message clearly speaks to us, and our perceptions conceptions and misconceptions and how they effect our individual attitudes towards collective input regarding devlopment or lack of development of the community.
 

RAPTOR

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Sep 12, 2009
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please listen to what he is really saying and you can see that even back then he was blaming our lack of focus or clarity regarding our understanding or penetration of the concepts of political ideology as a manifestation of voting for ones choices , ones own choices, decided by regular people not corporations andobviously,
not just the lesser of 2 evils.

First, let me began by saying,
I was being sarcastic. Sometimes
my use of sarcasm fails to get my
point across to others.
Oh well, feast or famine is how I roll
with it.

I was listening.

I heard him say things like, "the vote has been used as a tool of oppression against"....(who?).... "black people".
He goes on to quote, [albert] camus, by saying "what better way to enslave a man, then to give him
a vote and call him free?
"

Brown then states something similar to what I've said regarding the vote in another thread:

"It does not profit black people or poor people anything to have the vote and not be able to select
the candidates they wanna choose"....."To really believe that we can put someone in office and that
these people be responsive to our needs is naive, politically naive, because even if one of the black
candidates ran for office were to take the office as president, then black people must be prepared to
fight against that person....because the system mandates the action of that person
".

His message clearly speaks to us, and our perceptions conceptions and misconceptions and how they effect our individual attitudes towards collective input regarding devlopment or lack of development of the community.

What you said in the above seems to be an observation, not blaming.
There is a difference. And yes, brown's message indeed speaks
to us, not at us. There again, is a difference.

"...Now in terms of black people-occupied positions, amerikkka has created in cleveland, washington dc and gary indiana
a type of neocolonialism. In other words, the man has set up a puppet regime. These black people are responsive to the
needs and the whims of the democratic party and not of the masses of black people.
"

Noble queries with regard to black folk in prominent positions amounting to tokenism.
Brown's calls for an examination in the sense of progress and as to whether black
people had made progress in this country, and h. rap's contention:

"Black people have not made progress in this country. Amerikkka
has given blacks some concessions out of political necessity. Their
political necessity. They gave thurgood marshall a position on the
supreme court to appease black people. In other words, we didn't
put thurgood marshall there. They can take thurgood whenever
they get ready. We put adam [clayton powell] in office, they
took him out... That has to be viewed in the light of concessions.
The very fact that a man could concede a position to you, tells
you that you do not have a position of power where you can
demand, or that you can mandate something
".

Brown then ends by saying that black folks have to be about
revolutionary change, because the system isn't gonna change
itself. In his opinion, the system is incapable of changing
itself.

If from all that, we are to deduce that brown is calling us out for
allowing black folks to come before us in some leadership
capacity who are working more so in the interest of yt and not
black folks as "pointing the finger at us", then okay.

But this is where focus is lost....some folks will overlook all
that
only to see the "...yt" and from that piece cry out that we are
entirely blaming everything on yt. All the emphasis on our detrimental
level of naivete with respect to politics -being called to task,
and rightfully so, vanishes whenever the term 'yt' or the connotation of, pops up.

I am starting to see the term "blame" used as a thinly veiled
convenient means of censorship. Because it takes a considerable
amount of effort to get in there and grapple with the issues concerning
black folks. Not saying that you, Ankur, don't make that effort...I'm speaking in general.

Bytheway. What is the difference between blaming
us and blaming "our lack of focus and clarity"?:10500:
 

Ankhur

Well-Known Member
REGISTERED MEMBER
Oct 4, 2009
14,325
2,956
Brooklyn
Occupation
owner of various real estate concerns
First, let me began by saying,
I was being sarcastic. Sometimes
my use of sarcasm fails to get my
point across to others.
Oh well, feast or famine is how I roll
with it.

I was listening.

I heard him say things like, "the vote has been used as a tool of oppression against"....(who?).... "black people".
He goes on to quote, [albert] camus, by saying "what better way to enslave a man, then to give him
a vote and call him free?
"

Brown then states something similar to what I've said regarding the vote in another thread:

"It does not profit black people or poor people anything to have the vote and not be able to select
the candidates they wanna choose"....."To really believe that we can put someone in office and that
these people be responsive to our needs is naive, politically naive, because even if one of the black
candidates ran for office were to take the office as president, then black people must be prepared to
fight against that person....because the system mandates the action of that person
".



What you said in the above seems to be an observation, not blaming.
There is a difference. And yes, brown's message indeed speaks
to us, not at us. There again, is a difference.

"...Now in terms of black people-occupied positions, amerikkka has created in cleveland, washington dc and gary indiana
a type of neocolonialism. In other words, the man has set up a puppet regime. These black people are responsive to the
needs and the whims of the democratic party and not of the masses of black people.
"

Noble queries with regard to black folk in prominent positions amounting to tokenism.
Brown's calls for an examination in the sense of progress and as to whether black
people had made progress in this country, and h. rap's contention:

"Black people have not made progress in this country. Amerikkka
has given blacks some concessions out of political necessity. Their
political necessity. They gave thurgood marshall a position on the
supreme court to appease black people. In other words, we didn't
put thurgood marshall there. They can take thurgood whenever
they get ready. We put adam [clayton powell] in office, they
took him out... That has to be viewed in the light of concessions.
The very fact that a man could concede a position to you, tells
you that you do not have a position of power where you can
demand, or that you can mandate something
".

Brown then ends by saying that black folks have to be about
revolutionary change, because the system isn't gonna change
itself. In his opinion, the system is incapable of changing
itself.

If from all that, we are to deduce that brown is calling us out for
allowing black folks to come before us in some leadership
capacity who are working more so in the interest of yt and not
black folks as "pointing the finger at us", then okay.

But this is where focus is lost....some folks will overlook all
that only to see the "...yt" and from that piece cry out that we entirely blaming
everything on yt. All the emphasis on our detrimental level of naivete
with respect to politics -being called to task, and rightfully so, vanishes
whenever the term 'yt' or the connotation of, pops up.

I am starting to see the term "blame" used as a thinly veiled
a convenient means of censorship. Because it takes a considerable
amount of effort to get in there and grapple with the issues concerning
black folks. Not saying that you, Ankur, don't make that effort...I'm speaking in general.

Bytheway. What is the difference between blaming
us and blaming "our lack of focus and clarity"?:10500:
stuff on other post don't get me hung up, but please understand;
"....."To really believe that we can put someone in office and that
these people be responsive to our needs is naive

that was in reference to a national election of a plutocracy or oligarchy,
however he was not reffreing to the centralizedBlack ommunites were we could select our own

remember how he said Powell was demonized?

that was a call for us to form our own media, and to be honest a strong flow of progrssive and pro Black journals started to come about like Black News, Muntu and others


, politically naive, because even if one of the black
candidates ran for office were to take the office as president, then black people must be prepared to
fight against that person....because the system mandates the action of that person".

 

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