Black People : Dumbing Down Tests For Black People

Discussion in 'Black People Open Forum' started by medusanegrita, May 12, 2010.

  1. medusanegrita

    medusanegrita Well-Known Member MEMBER

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2010
    Messages:
    1,903
    Likes Received:
    564
    Location:
    STL Missouri
    Ratings:
    +565
    I have read and heard bits and pieces about this firefighter exam. I'm not sure how I feel about it. I understand any company's desire for racial fairness through diversity, but I don't agree with throwing out a entire test just because enough black people or people of color did not pass it. That in and of itself seems unfair, and makes people think that tests have to be 'dumbed down' in order for black or colored people to pass it. That means we are losing the ability to get things based on merit.

    I don't agree with this sentiment, but what happened to the time when black folks were saying you have to work twice as hard or twice as long as white people to get ahead? I don't think we have to work twice as hard because we are black, but it is required that we study and do our best. If that is done and you still haven't passed..... then who's fault is that?

    I understand the importance of Affirmative Action and 'forced' diversity measures as subvert as overt discrimination against so-called minorities exist, and I am not an opponent of affirmative action. But I am not sure how that can be balanced if we truly are falling behind academically.... meaning we just aren't smart enough to pass things as is. Do things have to be dumbed down for black people?

    It seems like all jobs have test these days, especially the lower paying jobs that don't require advanced degrees or skilled training (which many of us fall into). They get a lot of applicants, and so-called personality-and-character tests have little to do with the job or ability of the person and more to do with the process of elimination.... even tho they claim that those who pass these test have a higher and better work ethic than those who don't.

    However, you notice these personality-and-character test aren't given for the skilled and higher degreed jobs because they have fewer applicants and a bigger need to hire from a smaller pool of applicants. I can't pass many of these online character-and-personality tests, but I will improve my prospects of getting hired by getting a skilled trade which don't require these tests. If employees aren't willing to hire from resume/application/interview process.... then that just sucks. I think all tests that have nothing to do with the job itself should be eliminated. Many of the people passed over and eliminated are black or colored people.

    Please read the entire article, it was interesting and informative.

    'colored people' = people of color such as asians and latinos.
    if you don't like the term, I really don't care. Try to stay focused on the subject.
     
  2. Ankhur

    Ankhur Well-Known Member MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2009
    Messages:
    14,710
    Likes Received:
    3,006
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    owner of various real estate concerns
    Location:
    Brooklyn
    Ratings:
    +3,014
    the discrepency in regards to the fairness of the test seems to be the presence of questions , pertinent to racial orethnic cultur and habits,
    as opposed to psychological, scholastic, general skills, or physical aptitude pertaining to the functions and duties necessary to an EMS/firefighter
     
  3. bientempo

    bientempo Well-Known Member MEMBER

    Country:
    Dominican Republic
    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2009
    Messages:
    736
    Likes Received:
    141
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Dominican Republic
    Ratings:
    +165
    Was that not overturned by your supreme court last year?
    http://www.nasdaq.com/aspx/stock-ma...e=details-of-new-haven-conn-firefighting-exam
    The exam was composed of two sections. The first was a written exam of 100 multiple-choice questions focused on technical job knowledge that counted for 60% of the total score. According to the brief filed by Ricci and other petitioners, the exams were written below a 10th-grade reading level.

    Next came an oral exam, weighted 40%, in which panels of three experts evaluated how well firefighters could assess a situation and direct others in an emergency.

    This was interesting to us due to the reversal of judge Sotomayor while she was being appointed to your supreme court. As she is the first Latina to the court.
     
  4. Blaklioness

    Blaklioness Well-Known Member MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2005
    Messages:
    3,346
    Likes Received:
    1,809
    Ratings:
    +1,812
    I don't believe in dumbing down anything for folks either, but, in this case, Ankhur is right....you have to determine the nature of the questions being missed. Is it information that most would have been exposed to? Most of these so-called placement tests are nothing more than money-making devices that have nothing to do with how a person will function on the job and are often filled with obscure and ridiculous tasks/skills that even the testmakers could not justify if they had and wanted to. Also, how do you know what level of cheating might be going on to 'fix' the scoring in favor of the others?





     
  5. Destee

    Destee destee.com STAFF

    Country:
    United States
    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2001
    Messages:
    34,790
    Likes Received:
    8,984
    Gender:
    Female
    Location:
    betwixt and between
    Ratings:
    +9,684
    Sister MedusaNegrita ... i read all that you said, but the above really stands out to me (as well as the title of this thread), and is a bit unsettling.

    As if "smart" has anything to do with passing a test made by white people for white people, and our "passing" can only be achieved via a "dumbing down" process.

    This is what they want us to think of ourselves though, so while it may be a bit unsettling, i suppose it is the plan ... and like you ... most of us buy into it.

    Thanks for sharing.

    :heart:

    Destee
     
  6. Khasm13

    Khasm13 STAFF STAFF

    Country:
    United States
    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2003
    Messages:
    10,784
    Likes Received:
    4,235
    Gender:
    Male
    Ratings:
    +4,472
    imho....if u can't pass a multiple choice test about the position u r going for then u do not need to get the job...black/white/purple/whatever...

    one love
    khasm
     
  7. medusanegrita

    medusanegrita Well-Known Member MEMBER

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2010
    Messages:
    1,903
    Likes Received:
    564
    Location:
    STL Missouri
    Ratings:
    +565
    I make the titles like that to stand out and be an attention grabber. So that's on purpose. I don't think test have to be 'dumbed down' for black people, but I do agree that they are culturally bias.... well maybe (durn, there goes that fence sitting again :rolleyes:


    We are black Americans. Technically, black and white americans have the SAME culture, so how can a test be culturally bias and we been sharing America with white people for at least 200 years or more?

    Now if I was sitting next to a Brazilian who been in America for 2 months and we were taking the same American test, then the Brazilian could technically claim the test was culturally bias - because they really are from a different culture. But again, as Americans we are from the same culture.

    A classist test? I get that. Somebody ask me a humorous question: 'What color is a banana'
    'Yellow'
    'No, brown or black'

    Technically, they are both right answers, but there can only be one, and the right answer is then 'Yellow'
    They explained to me that would be a culturally bias test, but it's not. If you buy brown or black bananas, then you are likely poor, so the test would be economically bias, aka CLASSIST.

    Yes, I heard about Sotomeyers reversal during her confirmations.

    I have two minds on that. First, I'm glad she reversed it. She is woman who will stand up for minorities and people and color and realize the need for affirmative actions policies, and her decision on that told of that. I like her and I'm glad she was selected for the highest bench in the country.

    But was it a right and fair decision? You say...
    This doesn't sound like a bias test. It sounds relevant to the job. And if Ricci is right (I'm not assuming he is or isn't) then we can't past a 10th grade level test? What the hell!

    But I agree that in order to fully determine that, we need to know what type of questions were on the test, which we may not ever know.

    So I was using the firefighter test for specific and general examples. Black Americans supposedly fall below everyone on any and all test no matter what. Many claim it's because they are culturally bias, which I'm not entirely understanding.

    Warriorprincess said something that definitely would apply here about spatial and sequential learning techniques. That's good to note, but probably won't help. It might entail actual on-the-job testing and getting rid or reducing the importance of written test. Since written test are really for the process of eliminating applicants, I think they are going to keep them.
     
  8. bientempo

    bientempo Well-Known Member MEMBER

    Country:
    Dominican Republic
    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2009
    Messages:
    736
    Likes Received:
    141
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Dominican Republic
    Ratings:
    +165
    MedusaNegrita

    sotomayor did not reverse herself. the US supreme court overruled her lower court ruling. An ruled in favor of the firefighters.
     
  9. medusanegrita

    medusanegrita Well-Known Member MEMBER

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2010
    Messages:
    1,903
    Likes Received:
    564
    Location:
    STL Missouri
    Ratings:
    +565
    Maybe I worded that wrong, not sure.

    Did she agree that the test was bias and needed to be thrown out in favor a more fair one for the hiring of minorities? If so, then that is what I agree with and that's why I like her and I'm glad she made it to the supreme court.

    That means she did NOT rule in favor of the fire fighters.

    That's means she understands Affirmative Actions and stands firm on it.


    But the court overuled that and ruled in favor of them? I can't say I disagree with the court yet then because Ricci may still have a point.

    Sounds like a win-win from where I stand, but I'm sure Sotomeyer is a bit miffed about getting her decision reversed or overruled. No judge likes that.
     
  10. Da Flash

    Da Flash going above and beyond PREMIUM MEMBER

    Country:
    United States
    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2007
    Messages:
    376
    Likes Received:
    390
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    professional internet surfer
    Location:
    The OC............for now!
    Ratings:
    +405

    Your argument for economical versus cultural bias is intriguing but to say that We Black american have the same culture as yt americans or any others is a bit misleading don't you think?? I grew up in yt and Black communities, while there are some similarites, there are also differences!!

    As far as dumbing down test, that shouldn't be neccessary. Aren't we talking about a "10th grade level" test here??:10500:
     
Loading...
Similar Threads - Dumbing Down Tests
  1. HODEE
    Replies:
    3
    Views:
    338
  2. MsInterpret
    Replies:
    4
    Views:
    872
  3. Fine1952
    Replies:
    17
    Views:
    5,852
  4. Goddess Auset333
    Replies:
    1
    Views:
    427
  5. Fine1952
    Replies:
    2
    Views:
    1,032

Users found this page by searching for:

  1. dumb down black folks