Black People : Brown V. Board of Education

Discussion in 'Black People Open Forum' started by MANASIAC, May 17, 2004.

  1. MANASIAC

    MANASIAC Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Hello Community,

    We all know that this month is the celeberation of Brown V. Board of Education. I wanted to start a thread about the current state of Education and what progess and or non-progress has anyone seen at the hand of this landmark decision, which was enforced with All Delibrate Speed,

    Manasiac.
     
  2. Nita

    Nita Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Manasiac

    A wonderful thread to start brother.

    Personally,I think our education system here in Arkansas is still in bad shape. I have some info I want to lQQk up so I'll be back to add to this topic.
     
  3. NNQueen

    NNQueen going above and beyond PREMIUM MEMBER

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    The beginning of the Civil Rights Movement

    Hey Brother Manasiac...good topic.

    I'm what people refer to as a "baby boomer" so I know firsthand what it's like to have attended a segregated Black public high school and an integrated white public high school.

    Because of Oliver Brown and his landmark challenge of the segregated public school system in Topeka, Kansas, most of our children have the ability to be educated equally with white students. In what ways has that benefitted us and in what ways has that hurt us? Unlike Plessy v. Ferguson when the U.S. Supreme Court held that "separate, but equal" was okay, the Brown decision paved the way for much more than integregtion of the classroom. (Did you know there were a total of four States involved in that one case that began it's history in 1952?)

    Many people who are products of the 50s and 60s are now debating as to whether to describe the 50th anniversary of the Brown decision a "celebration" or simply a "recognition." Personally, I prefer the latter description because I don't believe there's much to celebrate in terms of the quality of education that we were/are afforded under an integrated system. I would like to see a comparison of graduation rates of Black youth pre-desegregation to those post-segregation and then let's see whether there's any significant improvement in the quality of our education.

    And for the record, the enforcement of the Brown decision did not occur with "all deliberate speed" either. In 1955 the Supreme Court had to declare that schools should ve desegregated that way. Even then school districts across the country took their time to implement the changes. It took 10 years before my school district enforced it, by court order in 1964. Prince Edward County in Virginia vehemently refused to enforce it and actually shut their school system down for five years in protest. So for five years, children had to get their education the best way they could all because school administrators at that time were in support of Jim Crow Laws.

    There's a little known fact that there was a case that preceded Brown by 9 years and it challenged segregated public schools in California in 1945 (Mendez v. Westminster). The NAACP Legal Defense Fund also participated in this case, led by Thurgood Marshall. But this case was brought by a Mexican family who protested the fact that the State of California separated Mexican children from white children in public education. Nine years later, the famous Brown case was successfully and brilliantly argued before the Supreme Court Justices (100% white men) by Marshall. It was that case that launched Marshall's famous legal career in the U.S. judicial court system.

    Has segregation of our schools been as successful for our youth as it was hoped to be? Segregation was lauded as a "better" education for Black youth. Has the "quality" of education improved for them? Was there ever a concern about the socialization of Black youth once they attended these schools? How has that contributed to the education of our children?

    Queenie :spinstar:
     
  4. panafrica

    panafrica Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    This is indeed a great topic. Educational opportunities for black people have greatly improved, but much improvement is still needed. Segregation is still prevelant in today's school system. This segregation is not race based, it is economic & community based. However the end result is the same, as the communities which make up educational districts are composed of populations dominated from specific ethnic & economic backgrounds. The school systems in urban, Black & Latino dominated areas are inexcusably inferior to middle & upper-class school systems. This inferiority extends to both classes offered, and resources such as books, computers, etc.

    It is assumed that if a Black or Latino child is sent to a middle class school, then they will receive a better education. Thousands of Black & Latino families move to suburbs with the idea of providing their children with a better education. As a parent, I can certainly understand this desire. However sending black kids to suburan middle-class schools does not automatically guarantee them a superior education. Black & Latino kids are routinely segregated within suburban schools, they are often placed in special education programs (or placed in non-college prep programs). Thus while a black kid might be going to a top school, they might not be getting a top education.

    Currently the resources of schools are meant to maintain the established social-economic structure. The upper-class school systems are meant to maintain students within the upper-class; middle-class schools are meant to maintain kids within the middle-class, and the lack of resources at lower-class schools help to maintain students in poverty. There has to be more parity between schools, so these differences will not continue. Until urban Black & Latino school students can get into Ivy League colleges at the rate rich suburban white students do. Until urban school students can enroll in college without having to take extra courses to help them improve their basic math & reading skills....the work of Brown v. The Board of Education is not yet finished.
     
  5. Therious

    Therious Banned MEMBER

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    THERE WAS DOCUMENTRY ON CNN ABOUT THE "PROBLEM" OF BLACK KIDS nOT "DOING WELL" IN SCHOOL.

    FIRST OF ALL I THINK IT IS A TRAVESTY TO EQUATE INTELEGENCE WITH GETTING "GOOD GRADES"

    SECOND IS THE BRAINWASHING PROBLEM. BLACK KIDS ARE STILL LEARNING EUROCENTRISM (WHITE SUPREMECY) IN SCHOOL.

    THIRD THE METHOD OF TEACHING, I SAY IT DULLS THE MIND. MAKING KIDS GET UP AT 7AM TO DO BORING WORK, THEN DRAINING THERE BRAINS WITH TESTING AND HOME WORK.

    THIS IS A SUBJECT I FEEL DEEPLY ABOUT. AS A HIGH SCHOOL DROP OUT I REMEMBER LITERALY DREDING SCHOOL AS MANY STUDENTS BLACK AND WHITE.I ATTENDED A BLACK/LATINO SCHOOL IN CA , THEN LATER A WHITE SCHOOL IN THE MIDWEST. THE WHITE SCHOOL WAS NEWER, BETTER BOOKS AND EQUIPMENT BUT I THINK I WAS BETTER OFF AT THE BACK SCHOOL.

    THE WHITE TEACHERS WERE BORING, AND I DID NOT RELATE. THE BLACK TEACHERS SEAMED MORE PASSIONATE ABOUT THERE JOB. ALSO ATTENDING SCHOOL WITH MOSTY BLACKS FOR MY SELF WAS UPLIFTING. I FELT AT HOME,AND I WAS MORE INTERESTED IN BEING AT SCHOOL.

    IM TIRED OF SEEING DUM BLACKS ON T.V. AGREEING WITH WHITES ABOUT THE NEED FOR "PERFORMANCE" OF OUR CHILDREN IN SCHOOL.

    I BEIEVE BLACKS ARE NATURALLY SMART I THINK THE METHOD OF BLACK THOUGHT IS TOTALLY DIFFERENT THAN ANY OTHER HUMAN, AND BLACKS ARE CURRUPTED BY AMERICAN SCHOOLS, SAYING YOUR DUM IF YOU DONT WASTE ALL OF YOUR FREE TIME (WHEN YOU COUD BE THINKING UP NEW INVENTIONS) STUDYING USELESS INFO TO GET A HIGH LETTER GRADE. AND DO NOT SUPPORT NATURAL BLACK THOUGHT.

    I LEAVE YOU WITH THESE QUESTIONS

    WHATS MORE IMPORTANT "GOING TO COLLEGE" OR LEARNING PROPER MONEY/HEALTH MANAGEMENT SKILLS,

    GETTING AN A ON THE TEST, OR OWNING YOUR OWN BUSINESS?

    WHICH IS A BETTER INVESTMENT A DEGREE OR REAESTATE?

    WHATS WORSE GETTING AN F ON THE TEST, OR BEING IN LIFE TIME DEBT FROM "EDUCATION"

    I AM A DROP OUT (W/GED AND 9 COLLEGE CREDITS)

    I GOT BAD GRADES, I HATED SCHOOL, I USED TO PARTY ALL THE TIME.

    I AM ALSO A SELF EDUCATED MAN, ENTRAPRENEUR, MUSICIAN, AND NOT IN DEBT UP TO MY NECK.

    BOTTOM LINE I THINK WHAT WE NEED ARE ALL BLACK SCHOOLS THAT SEEK TO REINFORCE NATURAL INTELEGENCE and stimuate scientifical, mathematical, and spiritual growth , NOT CREATE CLASS SYSTEMS.

    PEACE ON THE PLANET!!!!
     
  6. MANASIAC

    MANASIAC Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Great Replies by all. Lets keep them coming.
     
  7. NNQueen

    NNQueen going above and beyond PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Therious, what an inspiring testimony. I will always promote the value of a formal education because I think that's the path that the majority of us will take in terms of learning. However, schools don't usually teach us how to perform critical thinking. For the most part someone teaches us what they want us to know and we learn how to regurgitate that information back to them in exchange for a grade. That's called "formal" education. In high school and college, a great deal of what we take in is temporary except for important lessons such as reading, writing and arithmetic. Those are skills that we retain throughout our lives because we use them every day at school, work and recreation.

    More importantly though, what we need most is knowledge and that can be obtained anywhere and at anytime. Knowledge is much deeper and longer lasting than a formal education in my opinion because it is much broader in scope and far more practical.

    You wrote:

    People will weigh the importance of this question as they apply it to their own personal experiences. For those who choose to work for someone else, a college degree and an A on a test will help them to compete with others like them.

    For those entrepreneurial minded individuals, gaining knowledge about how to successfully operate a business will be more important.

    You know, someone once told me this about our traditional educational system in America in reference to the current grading system: "A" students teach "B" students how to work for "C" students. So as you can see, when it comes to owning your own business, grades don't matter.

    Peace,
    Queenie :spinstar:
     
  8. Therious

    Therious Banned MEMBER

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    QUEEN,

    THANX FOR THE FEED BACK. I GUESS PERSONALITY DOES FACTOR IN CAREER CHOICE.. I DO BEIVE BELIEVE FORMAL ED IS GOOD ESPECIALLY FOR SOCIAL REASONS.

    ITS JUST THAT I HATE WHEN PEOPLE SUGGEST BLACKS ARE IN A STATE OF "CRISIS" BECAUSE OF GRADES.

    THIS IS A GREAT QUOTE MY QUEEN

    You know, someone once told me this about our traditional educational system in America in reference to the current grading system: "A" students teach "B" students how to work for "C" students. So as you can see, when it comes to owning your own business, grades don't matter.
     
  9. Changes_Changes

    Changes_Changes Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Brother Therious,

    Thanks for highlighting issues that so few Africans here in the u.s. are willing to confront. I was gonna post, but I caint say it no betta than you did. Keep teachin us man.
     
  10. toylin

    toylin Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    As I stated in another post, I'm a child of the Reagan years. I grew up in Detroit, MI. I could count the number of white kids around in that school (elementary school) on my fingers and toes. And out of every school I went to, this was the best education. By the time i went to high school, I could count the number of whoite kids in my entire school (about 2500 students) on one hand and have fingers left over.........

    From high school it was pretty much a given that we would continue to college, althugh a large number of students senior year were in co-op programs or vo-tech programs. I went to college, and I wasn't ready. I failed, miserably. I am now enrolled in a technical training program, and I'm doing great. Yes, personality is a factor. Let's face it: not all of us belong in rigidly structured classrooms that have nothing to do with what we want to be when we grow up.

    Has the quality of education changed? From where I sit, not so much. The quanity had changed, as students spend more time in school, with more classes, and more homework. Are they actually learning anything? Depends on what you consider learning. Are they being taugyht to memorize facts, or are they taught how apply theories and models in real life?
     
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