Discussion in 'Black People Open Forum' started by daroc, Jun 14, 2004.
do yall believe in the "blk expereince"?
does the silence mean yes or no.....
or should that subject not be touched?
i believe n the 'blk expereince', f by tht u mean we hv had unique cultural, spiritual, & life altering expereinces (not meaning 2 put words n ur mouth).
f u wouldn't mind, cld u please elaborate n a little more detail precisely wht u mean by the blk experince? then, i will try 2 post a more complete reply.
thanks for ur response Alkebulan
i gues when people say- oh- u dont understand cuz ur not blk whats its like-
it started in the thread on interracial dating but no one responded to my questions- to add to that- does the issues that we as blk are faced with- only blk- if their r any( not to sound ignorant- but all races have suffered)-can someone who is non blk relate?
i gues it kinda also stems from my personal experince... going to both a blk/yt school- back and forth until graduatin- and i noticed the difference in the behavior of the blk students- and the manner the yt kids acted- is their a true blk experience- that only we have?
i think i repeated my thoughts-oops of i did
but if there is one.. do other races have their own?
i mean it seems like blks act as they do- but dont always aprrecaite it- am i wrong?
my mind is jus questionin life...
no no other race can relate. and no other race has suffered to the degree of blacks.im sorry not even native americans or jews were sold like cattle at human auctions. and no other continnt has been raped, S#$%TEd on, or treated like afrika.....
yes i believe there is a true black experience exclusive to us. that starts first with our thought process, language, music, science (thought process) walk, talk, dance, and athletics. and last but not least ..living in a military state (check ur nearest ghetto).
yes other races have there own, but the difference is they always copy ours. of course it's only natural to pick up on things when u hear and c them often enough. but u gots to recognize the source. wich often they don't.
thanx therious....what do u mean by this..can u please explain?
living in a military state (check ur nearest ghetto).
ur thoughts and comments otherwise... are sufficiently on point
what i mean is that , police are trained to target black males. if you remember the whole war on drugs thing started by ronald ragan. later the waR became the manditory sentancing by the first bush administration (and bill clinton) wich gives a black male with a smaLL AMOUNT OF CRACK an AUTOMATIC 5 YEARS IN PRISON, BUT THIS DOES NOT APPLY TO A WHITE GUY WITH POWDER COCAIN.(BLACKS ALSO RECIEVE LONGER SENTANCING FOR other CRIMES THAT WHITES GET LESS SENTANCING)
WHAT I MEAN IS BLACK PEOPLE ESPECIALLY IN LOWER INCOME INNER CITY AREAS ARE STOPED AND SEARCHED, AT RANDOM. THE EXCUSE IS THAT THERE IS HIGH CRIME IN THESE AREAS. BUT CAN U SAY THAT BLACKS SELL MORE DRUGS THAN WHITES? IF ANYTHING ITS THE OPPOSITE SINCE THERE ARE MORE WHITES IN THE U.S
IN THE "HOOD' LIKE I SAID THE POLICE PRESENCE IS MUCH GREATER, THEY ASSAULT, SHOOT, AND ROB (D.E.A STEALS DRUG MONEY) BLACKS. DO THIS ONE DAY, DRIVE THROUGH A INNER CITY BLACK AREA, THEN THROUGH A WHITE SUBuRBAN AREA AND SEE THE EXTREME DIFFERENCE IN THE NUMBER OF PATROL CARS U SEE.YES THERE IS HIGH CRIME IN THE CITY DUE TO GANGS AND SO FORhT, BUT THE POLICE ARE ALSO CRIMINALS WHO UNFAIRLY TARGET BLACKS.
The Blk experience...hmmmm...Can a Black person be separated from their experience? Can THE Black experience be defined and be applicable to every person who is Black?
Can a Black person have any other type of experience and if not, then what do you mean by THE BLACK experience?
"THE" as opposed to "A" Black experience connotes experiences that could be universal to ALL Black people, am I right?
Do ALL Black people share the same experiences because of their race?
Just a few questions as I seek some clarification and other opinions. Good question too by the way!
to clarify any thing--if this helps...here are some questions too
is jus beig blk- a blk experience( the blk experience)
is their an experience that u have cux ur blk( a blk experience)
can a non blk... have a blk experience ( example...a white person in the hood- who is more street than a blk person u kno- can u say they jus ahve the mentality- or do they have a blk expereince?)
this is such a complex question.... feel free to look at it from all angles... thats all im looking for- what do u think?
thank u 4 clarification daroc. sorry no 1 responded 2 ur ?'s n the other thread, i don't remember reading them. u pose som intrigueing ?'s, & thou i lack the expertise 2 answer them definitively, i offer a few of my thoughts.
"does the issues that we as blk are faced with- only blk- if their r any( not to sound ignorant- but all races have suffered)-can someone who is non blk relate?"
since the embeded ? (r there issues unique 2 blk's) appears later in ur post, i will focus on whether a non blk can relate. i agree, all races hv suffered. extrapolating tht even further, we cld say, all humans everywhere hv suffered, or, all living biological organisms hv suffered, 2 som extent. but although it's clear, not all suffering is equal, we wld undoubtedly struggle 2 quantify suffering, reliably on an agreed upon scale. w/o such a tool available, comparisons will sometimes b subjective, capricious, & suppositional.
wld a male, 4 ex., who passes a kidney stone thru his urethra, now b capable of identifying w the labor pain associated w childbirth? suffering is not only culturally defined (isolation is viewed as welcome privacy n som cultures, but egregiously oppresive n others), but the experience of it is perception bound, & highly intrinsicly experienced. i point these aspects out, merely 2 emphasize the difficulty of obtaining an emperical answer. n spite of the above obsticles, i believe the empathic person can, even w/o inclusion/membership n the afflicted group, w focused effort, relate 2 the suffering of another human being.
"is their a true blk experience- that only we have?"
again, a definitive answer wld require an intimate familiarity w the breadth of all the earth's ppl's which hv existed since human inception, something i am woefully unqualified 2 attempt, much less embody. but i do hv som thot's on the matter.
f we agree 2 a working definition of ethnicity as: a group which shares some significant cultural traditions, and some biological kinship ties or at least some historical geographic region or nation of origin, then, almost by definition, such a group wld hv unique ethnocentric experiences which wld distinguish them from other groups. of course, they wld also share characteristics common 2 the human experience, & whether the similarites they shared were gr8 er than the differences which distinguished them, cld b determined by a statistical test (ANOVA), which may b closer 2 the heart of the ? u pose here.
then there is also the issue of the sharred experience, with obverse results emerging. different groups can respond in a dichotomized manner reflecting their different operating paradigms. as an example of this, consider the destruction of the cultural memory:
many of the early african captives & prisoners of war were highly educated & sophisticated citizens of an elevated & politically complex empire. the children of these captive people were taken from their parents at an early age & trained by specifically conditioned people 2 behave n a certain proscribed pattern. this pattern has been clearly stated & documented n kenneth stampp's: the peculiar institution.
1. 2 stand n awe of white power.
2. 2 obey white commands w/o thinking or hesitation
3. 2 stay absolutely dependent on white society 4 everything.
4. 2 identify w the white societys ideals & value system
5. 2 idealize white while hating black & respect western culture
while demeaning african culture & africa
this same conditioning was foisted on white society, but obviously w different results. the legacy of that period is with us today.
another aspect of this same ? is the interactional dynamic of developmental acculturation w geophysical environment. this phase 1st came to my attention thru cheikh anta diop's book, the african origin of civilization, myth or reality?, & remains the best treatment on it i hv read. n short, it is suggested tht the strikingly dissimilar environments two groups of ppl developed in, n this case, yt's & blk's, played crucial, f not determinant, roles n their collective cultural personalities & worldviews.
the euroisolationist (linear) worldview is defined by:
1) evolving dominance & control over nature; man is seen as cognitively different & vastly superior vs. any other element n nature, therefore he has mastery over that which he can contemplate. they r separate from & n constant conflict w nature.
2) social darwinism: survival of the Fittest, where individual survival is more important than group survival. the week will be culled & exploited, or terminated, not cared 4. limitations r seen as weaknesses.
3) prominance on self: individual separate from others. a do ur own thing, me myself & i, mentality. my way or hit the highway. emphasizes self reliance, individualism, uniqueness, difference, independence, material-physical characteristics, and individual rights
4) emphasis on behavioral components like: competition (it's not enuf 4 me 2 succeed, my friends must also fail), aggression, initiation, exerting influence, control.
5) avaristic hoarding: all tangible entities, both living beings & inatimate objects, known 2 exist, r assigned, as soon as they r discovered, a value based on the potential 2 generate profits & there4 facilitate the dual objective of material acquisition & increased wealth & power w which 2 increase one's ability 2 further exercise dominance & exploitation over the known, & as yet undiscovered, universe. all other cultural characteristics must b subservient 2 this one, as it is pre-eminent. so, an indigenous population is seen as a source of cheap labor; a stream, as a future hydroelectric plant; the forrest, a potential paper mill, & souce of lumber 4 factories.
as compared 2 the afrocentric (circular) worldview, defined by:
1) oneness, harmony w/ nature, the oneness of being (as opposed 2 gaining)
2) survival of the group is paramount. 1 is bound 2 the bio-social community, endorsing the value of unity, cooperative effort, a collective responsibility, and concern for the community. n fact, n this setting, expolsion from the community is the severest form of sanction possible.
3) collective identity transcends individual identity, & collective needs outweigh individual needs. self & other r 1. self & group r n an appositional (complementary) relationship not oppositional.
4) xtended family: the family is more than its nuclear components, family includes all relatives & members of the community. e.g. play brother and play sister.
5) sharring & luving: a natural generosity extending even 2 strangers, sometimes even 2 our detriment;
obviously, this is a topic we cld discuss indefinitely (as it probably seemed like this post wld continue). u hv asked som n depth ?'s, i hope u find something n here which sheds a little light on them. i hope u will b encouraged 2 continue 2 investigate further, & delve mor deeply than i cld here.
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