Black Relationships : BLACK WOMEN LOWERING STANDARDS FOR BLACK MEN????

Discussion in 'Black Relationships' started by Isaiah, Apr 19, 2006.

  1. Isaiah

    Isaiah Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Wow, whoever is fostering THIS idea among sisters really doesn't have a very high opinion of Black Men... But, not only that, they don't have a very high opinion of our Intelligence Quotient as a people...

    Firstly, it is an insult to me, as an African Man, that a sister should be primed and programmed for a pity party for me long before she's ever met me...

    Secondly, the lowering of standards for African men means a lowering of standards for the entire community... Once the pity party begins for one group, then why not extend it to the ENTIRE group???

    Thirdly, the whole White Supremacy CRUTCH as the reason why African men cannot succeed at any economic level has done been worn out... That it exists as an obstacle is clear... That it should be used and worn the heck out as an excuse for us to fail has produced disastrous results, and we need to stop it NOW! It has gone on TOO LONG, and has now become a part of the social programming of our women and our men... Just look around us, and you can see it's frightening impact...

    Lastly, lumping the salaries of ALL White Men and ALL Black Men is a major error in prejudice and presupposition on anyone's part.... Firstly, All White cats aren't making major money - most of them aren't, for that matter... And ALL African men aren't making miniumum wage money, or unemployed... But When one begins to lump the major salaried White men with Appalachian white men, and all those in between, then, of course, the final total will seem to tell a different story... Playing games with stats should not lead us into the temptation of lowering our standards for nobody - least ourselves...

    As far as our past is concerned, and aiming toward a solution, I have to say that I KNOW African women found employment as servants and maids, when African men couldn't find employment to save their lives... Our ancestors, therefore, made some major exceptions in their courtships to keep families together... African women - God Bless their practicality - oft tried to make a brother feel that if no one else cared about his situation, she did...which led to some of us developing some very bad habits, namely, using our women as CASH COWS... The great Bluesmen, Big Bill Broonzy, talked of how some sisters, working as maids, would share their servants quarters, and food from the employers, with brothers, who were called "sweet back papas..." Well, that's nice, when all you gotta do is wail a good song, and strum her guitar, and the rest is well taken care of, but it leads to some sorry expectations for yourself...and that leads others to feel sorry for your sorry behind...

    The deal is, we fell into some bad habits long ago as African men, and the system helped push a bunch of us over the edge... WE have to stop making excuses for one another, and make our standards much higher... As I said in a post yesterday, when you're trailing in a race, you got to push harder to catch up, and pass your opponent... You cannot slow down, start making excuses for being so far behind, and quit... If making excuses and quitting is the ultimate aim, then we are all here at Destee's wasting our collective breaths... Again, White Supremacy LIVES! Now What??? We are going to sit there and do nothing about it but repeat it as some kind of disempowering mantra all our lives - and feed that destruction to our children??? Come on, now, tell me it aint so???



    Peace!
    Isaiah
     
  2. uplift19

    uplift19 Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    I agree, but what does one do in the meantime? I mean, if you set the bar high the chances of you meeting someone that meets all of your expecations is not as probable.

    I know sisters who have considered being with brothers that they normally would not all in the name of love. So what he has issues and no clear career path. I love him.

    They generally come to their senses though, after they realize they cannot change them.

    I wouldn't call it lowering your standards though. I would call it compromise and being realistic about your expecations of another human being. That would solve 99.9% of our relationship issues.
     
  3. Isaiah

    Isaiah Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Sister, once African women begin raising that bar - namely in the home among their sons - then the bar WILL be met!

    The problem, sister Uplift, is that African men are not in the homes to provide the example to their sons of what a man NEEDS to be in order to attract a great mate for himself... Even brothers have as their standards for African Women, only her phyiscal attributes... We don't care whether the sister we're going to be with has a college education, or seeks after that... We don't care whether she is a clear thinker, and a disciplined human being who will be HELPING us raise our babies... That stuff never crosses our minds, and it is because we are not taught to have these kinds of thoughts and expectations by our parents...

    I do believe, however, that African women's expectations for their daughters tends to be higher... It does not matter what a sister thinks on a conscious level, it is what she does UNCONSCIOUSLY that tells the tale of the tape... Same for African men... It's a vicious cyle which we can only stop and correct if we are conscious of, and willing to change, our present modes of thought... Now, as a disclaimer, let me say to those brothers who are going to rush in saying "not all brothers are derelict in their duties to their wives and children", that I am not saying that WE are... I am saying there's a sizeable portion of us who are derelict, and they are derelict because they've been ALLOWED that option... Once that option is removed, you sink or you swim, and I believe in the survival instinct of Black men... We will choose to swim...



    Peace!
    Isaiah
     
  4. Isaiah

    Isaiah Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    BTW, I think AFRICAN MEN must play the most crucial and instrumental role of putting our peers on notice that they have to change... Sisters must, then, reinforce that shaping up of Black Men by refusing to "settle" for a brother who is not pulling his own weight... I said "pulling his own weight", not working at high levels in corporate America - unless that is what a sister requires for herself personally...

    Of course, having a job, and only desiring to have that job, with no prospects for moving UP in salary is a bummer too, but, again, whatever the sister requires... Too many of us, Black Men and Women, will require more of ourselves, but not of our mate... On a personal level, the physical attributes of a sister, ALONE, will no longer cut it for me... She's got to be bringing a desire to build something more than the ordinary, run-of-the-mill existence... I am reaching for the moon in order that I might catch a few stars, and that is the kind of woman I seek - and she can be quite ordinary-looking, as long as I think she's attractive... I don't think everyone should apply MY standardsk but I do think it's a good outline...

    Brothers have to get our minds off the booty and the breasts, and design some kind of vision for our future as a community... Tha's also a feature of White Supremacy, to keep us there where we are, standing on our little dirty street corners doing zippo, and hollering at, and harrassing African women to the point where they loathe us...and we play right into it...



    Peace!
    Isaiah
     
  5. Bisabee

    Bisabee Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    I don't believe Black women should lower their standards either. She should require from a Black man exactly what she would require from any man. This will make him stronger and a higher achiever.

    The problem is that just about every week I hear the same message over and over phrased in different ways like "the Black man is the target" or the "white man won't hire a Black man" or the "white man would rather hire or promote a Black woman over a Black man," or the "school system doesn't like Black boys," and " the Black man got framed for that crime" and on and on. So the Black male is presented to Black women as being victim #1 and for this reason, some of the Black woman I know try to cut Black males slack.

    Honestly Black males pay a high price for this because since they're not forced to sink or swim, many don't ever learn how to swim or can't swim on their own. My father (in his 70s) often talks about how when he was a young man, he didn't have any crutch like that to lean on and he says he's happy for it.
     
  6. Isaiah

    Isaiah Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    I'm with you, sister BisaBee...

    Again, I think the very idea speaks to the depth of the low expectations those folks have for us as African men - Whew, and it makes me angry... It is like the use of that old term "boy" is an appropriate term for the perpetual child, the Black Man of America... We should not, under any circumstance or other guise, be promoting this idea... I mean, we already know it exists, but to promote and promulgate it as if it is alright is wrong...




    Peace!
    Isaiah
     
  7. MANASIAC

    MANASIAC Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    No Woman defines me or my standards. I feel what you sayin Brother I, but that does not me to apply me, so it is hard for me to conjur up any other answers.
     
  8. Isaiah

    Isaiah Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Brother Manasiac, what's happenin'!:dance3:

    Actually, I wrote this post based on a statement sister BisaBee made in a post a few days ago... She said that some commentators and people in her circle, had said that standards for Black men when placed up against those of White men, must be lowered... I take exception to that idea, and view it as completely disrespectful to each and every member of our community...

    Even for an African woman to entertain the thought that she has to lower her standards as an act of pity on the Black man, speaks to her contempt of Black men, and our community as a whole... Afterall, many of those men were reared by Black women... Did they impart to these scufflers that that was all they could be, and it became a self-fulfilling prophecy???

    I am arguing that our standards have to be raised to their highest if we are to elevate ourselves as a people... I know that White Supremacy exists, and is an ideology built brick-by-brick over the centuries. I also know that there is no wall built by man's hands that cannot be penetrated by his mind... For us to constantly point out the wall, and never devise a plan to tear it down, is to continually disempower ourselves... If white man will not supply us with a job, then we have to go out, and make one or two for ourselves... That is the only way... It is the way we will either swim or sink...


    Peace!
    Isaiah
     
  9. Bisabee

    Bisabee Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Just want to make this clear that this is not my thinking, but it's out there. I don't believe in lowering standards, because I agree that's offensive.

    I have read numerous articles online and in magazines like Ebony and Essence, to just name 2 publications, where high achieving Black women are pointedly told that if we want to get a Black man, we should lower our standards. They say we shouldn't expect for a BLack man to have as much education and/or make as much money in order to choose him for a mate.
     
  10. NNQueen

    NNQueen going above and beyond PREMIUM MEMBER

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    *raising my hand* I'd like to ask a question to gain more insight into your question, Brother Isaiah....

    Can someone articulate the measuring criteria Black women use to set a standard for Black men? Without that, how can I know whether I'm raising, equalizing or lowering any standards when I choose to be with a man?

    Is there a universal standard or an individual standard? Suppose I tell people what I like in a man but say that only because that's what I think people want to hear and will get me accepted by these people? Am I really "lowering" my standards when I choose a man who actually is the type of man I'm attracted to, although I may not admit it in public? He may not be corporate America who runs major corporations, wears a suit and tie to work, makes lots of money and speaks English with a WM's accent, but are the opposite of these qualities lesser standards? How can you tell?

    Brother Isaiah, are you suggesting that it's been written here that a WM is the standard by which we should measure BM or did I misinterpret your statement?

    I guess that's more than one question...forgive me.
     
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