Pan Africanism : black and native american links black indians

CrunchyStuff

Well-Known Member
MEMBER
Apr 24, 2003
126
1
liviti,

Thanks for the link. I thought you were joking about Indian owning slaves being that I have studied African American history and never heard of this, I was dismissive.

Of course I was right.

From the web site:

...Though less than 3% of Indian people owned slaves...

....Indian masters, however, rejected the worst features of southern white bondage. Travelers reported enslaved Africans "in as good circumstances as their masters."....

***

Liviti,

One has to be very careful when examinging history. For instance there are thousands and thousands of documents showing that African Americans owned many slaves.

The problem?

These African Americans were buying their relatives from white slave masters.

While it may appear on PAPER that African Americans and Indians owned slaves, because of the fact that they were forced to purchase their relatives back from white masters, legally.

In reality this was not the case. As your own website shows, 3 percent of Indians among only 5 tribes who are closely associated by the way with African Americans. Being that this was Oklahoma [where there was a large free settlement of African Americans], is just about the number I would expect to have purchased their own Black Indian relatives back from white slave masters.

I would need far more evidence than this to declare that Indians owned slaves.

This is the shoddy type of research that would have people declaring in a hundred years that because they found a whole bunch of papers showing that African Americans owned slaves, they believed that African Americans were the ones who mostly enslaved Africans.

When a person says Oklahoma and Indians, they are talking about one of the worst massacre's of Indians in the genocide. To then turn around and talk about Indians and whites working together in Oklahoma? Is a little ahistorical.

It is sorta like saying that the Jews who were forced to remove the dead bodies from the gas chambers, were working with Hitler.

Some of that owned slaves, "fought for the confederacy", hired to capture slaves, etc, etc is a real ahistorical misnomer of what was actually taking place.
 

CrunchyStuff

Well-Known Member
MEMBER
Apr 24, 2003
126
1
By the way. I am Cha'taw Indian. My great grandmother was full Cha'taw Indian. This is a type of Black Indian in the Lousiana area.
 

CrunchyStuff

Well-Known Member
MEMBER
Apr 24, 2003
126
1
Liviti,

Now you don't like your own site? Why did you post that site?

Well now you are not going to like these two sites that you just gave.

The first site that you gave states that it was white married to Indians who brought slavery.

......frontiersmen who married Indian women, were the principal slaveholders in the tribes, largely because their fathers had taught them the economics of slavery........

And your second website you gave is about a WHITE PERSON who was RUNNING an INDIAN TRIBE.

From the website, The title of the essay!:

Will Thomas: White Chief Of The Cherokee

Am I suppossed to accuse Indians of enslaving Black people because of this WHITE PERSON?????

The fact that you even consider these web pages about WHITES among Indians enslaving Blacks to be proof of Indian slavery, is LUDICROUS.

It may not be all black and white but please show stories of the RED enslaving the BLACKS.

Not the WHITES among the REDS, enslaving the BLACKS.
 

CrunchyStuff

Well-Known Member
MEMBER
Apr 24, 2003
126
1
Liviti,

You are the one who keeps posting these idiotic sites. That claim Indians enslaved Blacks and then it turns out that the site is claiming that WHITES and WHITES who were part indian enslaved Blacks.

From your website::::

The Company was joined on Thursday by, five waggons and 21 men . . . the number . . . grew to 105 men, 15 negroes and 12 females all under the command of Clem McNair (Wright 1934:183).

The gender and racial data provided in this entry are significant. Cherokees owned slaves. Prior to the arrival of Europeans they used captured Indian slaves. After the Europeans arrived, they began to capture and later purchase African slaves. Joseph Vann, the grandfather of McNair was one of the largest slave holders in the Cherokee Nation. The "15 Negroes" were more than likely slaves.


Hey, maybe we should just have the author of this website GUESS again about who the 15 Negros were among the Cherokee's!

I looked up some of the sources for this website. ANONYMOUS was one of them. LOL!!!!!!!!!

I did not know that Cherokee's went by the name of John Brown, and Thomas Walcott.

And these Cherokee's kept DIARY's of their travels. Isn't that strange?????

Liviti,

of course this makes now the third website of WHITES among INDIANS who POSSIBLY might have owned slaves. This websites ADMITS that they are only GUESSING about that.

Still waiting for 1 shred of evidence that Indians enslaved Blacks.

YAWN.
 

CrunchyStuff

Well-Known Member
MEMBER
Apr 24, 2003
126
1
Liviti,

I don't hold out any hope whatsoever for the Black man, accept through Jesus. So you can forget me thinking that we have a "spiritual" bond with Indians.

My point is and remains that it is a deep mischarecterization of Indians to, based on the behavior of only 5 tribes out of hundreds of tribes, to call Indians slave owners.

Even worse than charecterizing hundreds of Indian Tribes as slave holders based on these 5 tribes, is to charecterize the majority of full blooded Indians among these tribes based on the even smaller percentage of "white" Indian slave holders among them.

For instance from one of your websites we learn that only 3 percent of the Indians in these 5 tribes owned slaves. Most of these the whites who married Indian women.

Yet these same sites say that 20 to 25 percent of the Cherokee Nation was African Americans!

That would be like saying Black Americans are Hindu's based on the fact that less than 1 out of a thousand Black People are Hindu's.

Sure it is true that one can find a Hindu among Black Americans, but it is really lopsided to call Black Americans who are 95 percent Christians, Hindu's.

Sure you can find an Indian among one of these 5 tribes who owned slaves, but then to charecterize the 99.8 percent of Indians who never owned slaves as slave owners, based on that is ludicrous.
 

Create an account or login to comment

You must be a member in order to leave a comment

Create account

Create an account on our community. It's easy!

Log in

Already have an account? Log in here.

Thread starter Similar threads Forum Replies Date
Clyde C Coger Jr African American History Culture : Black Native American descendants fight for recognition African American History Culture 2
Clyde C Coger Jr Black Spirituality Religion : 'Black Muslims' to blame for high school students' confrontation with Native American, mother claims Black Spirituality / Religion - General Discussion 10
Knowledge Seed Black People : Black Native American Nations Black People Open Forum 7
gogounited Black People : Native Americans and Black People. Black People Open Forum 32
Omowale Jabali Omowale Jabali : Eurocentricity and the Rape of Black Native Cultures Omowale Jabali 136
J Black Authors : book on links between black and native americans Short Stories - Authors - Writing 1
Kemetstry Black Entertainment : JUDAS AND THE BLACK MESSIAH Black Entertainment 11
Clyde C Coger Jr Health and Wellness : 'African Gene Theory' Is a Myth, and It's Harming Black Men's Heart Health Black Health and Wellness 0
Fine1952 Black Money Business Jobs : Black On The Bottom Policies - Tariq Rasheed Black Money Business Jobs 0
Clyde C Coger Jr Black People Politics : Barack Obama opens up about the difficulty of 'being a functioning Black person in America' in surprise appearance Black People Politics 1
Clyde C Coger Jr Black Christians : Feeling politically powerless, black Christians find more comfort in black church: study Christian Study Group 1
R Black Poetry : yeah black history is a whack mystery and my back still blistery from being whiplashed , ready to grip some cash and run to the underground railroad a Black Poetry - Get Your Flow On! 2
Clyde C Coger Jr Black People Politics : Black Women Aren't Saving America For You. They're Protecting Themselves Black People Politics 0
Clyde C Coger Jr Black Travel : For Black Americans, a Heritage Trip to West Africa Can Be Life-Changing Black Travel 0
Kemetstry African American History Culture : THE BLACK SPARROW African American History Culture 2
Fine1952 Black Money Business Jobs : Black Tax: The Cost of Being Black In America Black Money Business Jobs 0
Clyde C Coger Jr Black Positive People : Black female scientist at forefront of COVID-19 vaccine development Black People Doing Positive Things 2
Clyde C Coger Jr Black People Politics : Joy Reid nails the difference between white and Black people after Capitol riots Black People Politics 4
Destee Pets / Animals : Black the Rottweiler - playing with his toy Pets / Animals 1
Clyde C Coger Jr Health and Wellness : America has an urgent need for Black doctors: 'It's hard to be what you can't imagine' Black Health and Wellness 0
One-Hundredd Black Entertainment : Jewels of Wisdom found in GTA 5's Black protagonist Franklin Clinton Black Entertainment 2
Clyde C Coger Jr Black People : Kwanzaa Is Not ‘Black Christmas’—Here’s What It Actually Is (And How We Celebrate) Black People Open Forum 2
Discerning Black People Politics : Black People: Know your REAL enemy Black People Politics 14
OldSoul Black People : "Elijah Muhammad was the greatest psychologist that Black people ever created, bar none" Black People Open Forum 0
OldSoul Black People : "Elijah Muhammad was the greatest psychologist that Black people ever created, bar none" Black People Open Forum 1
Clyde C Coger Jr Black Parenting : The reality of Black men's love lives and marriages is very different than what's usually shown on TV – I spent years actually talking to them Black Parenting 0
Clyde C Coger Jr Black Education / Schools : A Black Student's Mother Complained About 'Fences.' He Was Expelled Black Education / Schools 3
Kemetstry Black Money Business Jobs : BLACK OWNED ATH;ETIC BRANDS Black Money Business Jobs 0
Clyde C Coger Jr Black Relationships : New Book Claims the Destruction of Black Relationships Is 'America's Unrecognized Civil Rights Issue' Black Relationships 0
Kemetstry Black Money Business Jobs : BLACK OWNED HAIR CARE PRODUCT LINE IN NEIMAN MARCUS Black Money Business Jobs 0
Fine1952 Black People : The Black Tax - *Black Lives Still Don't Matter* Black People Open Forum 25
OldSoul Black People : CONSCIOUSNESS RAISING ONLINE - Nov 15, 2020 - Topic: Black People Dont Want No white God Black People Open Forum 0
C Black People : The Destruction Of The Black Afrikan Woman Black People Open Forum 0
Clyde C Coger Jr Black Positive People : 'You are my wildest dream': Sydney Barber will be first Black woman to serve as US Naval Academy brigade commander Black People Doing Positive Things 0
I_AM_HER Steals and Deals : Black woman -owned Candle Shop in Houston, TX Shopping - Steals and Deals! 0
I_AM_HER Black Women : A black woman's experience and the failed U.S. healthcare system Black Women 0
Discerning Black People Politics : Take that, you Black and Latino defectors! Black People Politics 8
Clyde C Coger Jr Black Spirituality Religion : Louisiana man sentenced to 25 years for burning Black churches Black Spirituality / Religion - General Discussion 0
C Black People : Will The Black Divine Beings Ever Rise Again? Black People Open Forum 1
C Black People : The Problem With Black Afrikan People Black People Open Forum 0
C Black People : Black Afrikans Has No Knowledge Of Need Black People Open Forum 0
Discerning Black People Politics : Older Black Voters are doing their part Black People Politics 0
C Black People : There Is A Difference In Black Afrikan American And Black Afrikans In America Black People Open Forum 0
OldSoul Black People : What Ever Happened to Hazel Scott? One of the most Brilliant Beautiful Black Women Ever! Black People Open Forum 1
C Black People : The Problem With Black Folks Is Black Folks Black People Open Forum 1
Discerning Black People Politics : Kristen Welker made all Black women proud tonight Black People Politics 4
Clyde C Coger Jr Black People Politics : Our Black Party Black People Politics 0
C Black People : There Is No Victory For Black Afrikan People Black People Open Forum 0
Don Fletcher Black Poetry : Black Black Poetry - Get Your Flow On! 0
Clyde C Coger Jr Black Short Stories : New book reveals Malcolm X secretly met the KKK to discuss setting up a ‘separate state’ for Black Americans Short Stories - Authors - Writing 27
Similar threads


















































Destee Chat

Latest profile posts

Destee wrote on pdiane's profile.
Welcome Home Sister! :love:
pdiane wrote on panafrica's profile.
Hey Destee, thank you for still being here! You are loved!
pdiane wrote on panafrica's profile.
I'm Black on Destee, I feel at home! It's been a while! Soooo in 2004 I married my Senegalese Husband, when I first went to Senegal, I loved, it! The people were hospitable and my husband's family was very kind! Well I've been there many times now, have taken African Americans, well over 150 and it has been an amazing experience!
Free as free can be
Follow @EmptyWo76031418 on twitter.
Thanks.
Top