Black People : Are we REALLY listening to Fuller and Welsing?

Discussion in 'Black People Open Forum' started by Blaklioness, Sep 5, 2006.

  1. Blaklioness

    Blaklioness Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    The color ideologies put forth by Dr. Frances Welsing and Mr. Neely Fuller have made many of us think about the nature of white supremacy. As Black people, we are often left not only analyzing white supremacy but pondering our own mindsets about color politics. We learn that white supremacy occurs in ALL areas of people activity....including sex---that is CONSENSUAL sex. We often equate plantation rape with white supremacy, but is it possible, in current times, for a white or other nonblack person to be intimately involved in a mutually consensual relationship with a black person and STILL be racist? Is this a facet of the Welsing-Fuller theory we ignore in dealing with whites and/or other nonblacks? We've had many discussions about the nature of selling out on the part of black people, but are we understanding the nature of how plantation ghosts continue to haunt us so that such behavior is perpetuated? Further, if we understand this, can we make the connection between how nonblacks (especially whites) who 'befriend' or mate with blacks, may actually be encouraging the perpetuation of these ghosts towards their own benefit? What role would the offspring of such relationships play in upholding these ghosts?

    Lots to think about......new for some---old for others....but your thoughts are appreciated nonetheless.
     
  2. Ikoro

    Ikoro Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    (First of, Sister Blacklioness, I would like to express my -deep- gratitude for bringing this topic to the forums, and also thank my ancestors for guiding me to it.

    I have seen (and turned a few pages in) Brother Fullers book, and was in awe of- and in total agreeance with its powerful content. I was, however, at the time, reading Brother Amos' Blueprint To Black Power, so I put it on hold.

    I have just started reading Sister Cress' Isis Papers (very inspiring read, can't put it down!), and have been aching to bring some of my views to my peoples attention, specifically here on Destee. It is -so- important for us to have a place where we can air our thoughts.

    For as you express here, there is indeed a great deal of things that need to be brought to attention!

    I'm rambling *embarrassed* Getting to the point... ->)


    For years now, I have been in opposition to interracial dating (this strikes people as strange, seeing that I am the product of one).

    Some say I am racist (toward whites), other say I am narrowminded, and a few do agree.

    It is in my conviction that (as good as) all relationships between a white and a non-white person, no matter if the white is the aggressor or the relationship consentual, is in some way racist (on the part of the white, of course, but not disputing that some blacks are in it for the "white meat", which is destructive for the blak psyche).

    I do not think that the world has come long enough, or addressed certain issues enough to start pretending that the relationship between whites and non-whites is relaxed enough to start creating bonds of love or physical intimacy (naturally, this happens because of peoples ignorance on the subject and of the subconscious implications).

    Not addressing the issue of plantation ghosts (not familiar with the terminology, though I can clearly understand its meaning), I will say that any nonblack person approaching a person of Afrikan heritage, is not approaching that person as a -person-, but as an object of lust/desire or curiosity.

    Cress Welsing would have it that they do so as melanin-orphanes (albinos), trying to have relations with their lost heritage/parents.

    Some (Brother Afrika and perhaps Brother Fuller?) would say that this is the white man exerting his rule over the black man and so on.

    Regardless of which doctrine you follow, I think is safe to deduce and conclude the following:

    Any nonblack person approaching a black person approaches him/her on grounds that are unjustifiable in terms of having children or simply having intimate relations.

    This makes sense when considering the implications for the black person (subconscious) and his people as a whole, and looking at the disgusting reasons (whatever they may be - for, know that, they are not natural/ma'at-centered) for the white person in doing so.

    So to answer shortly: YES. A white woman aggressing against a black man is doing so (not neccessarily out of hatred and jealousy, as Cress would have it) out of curiousity, a fond amusement, "oooh, a black man [enter myth about length of phallus]", or "I like black men" and so on.

    Never/rarely will you hear a nonblack person say "I appreciate him/her for his intellect, and for the pride he/her has in his heritage.". There will -allways- be somekind of childish motivation behind the approach. Be it having a "thing" for blacks in general, just exploring the myth or being "turned on" by the characteristics that most of us have (strongwilled, responsible, hardworking, we raise our kids right, selfrespect etc).

    Not only that, but dating a white person is no different that praying to the White Jesus (no offense to those who do so) as a black person. How can you have such strong relations to those who look EXACTLY like your, your ancestors and your childrens oppressors? Regardless of whether one chooses to recognize it, the subconscious implications are, if not fatal, dramatically negative.

    Also, the white person dating the black is just a mockery of our struggle. What would our ancestors think? Can you imagine? Not that they fully oppose it, but a non-healthy relationship (as described above) is not something to be proud of... Some black men simply have a crush on the white race (and the white man on the black woman), and childishly act out on it instead of really addressing it.

    Almost all interracial relationships to date have been racist, or (from the nonblack persons side) unwholistically (unjustifiably) inspired.

    That was a little long, wasn't it? My bad... Just getting the hang of this "speaking my mind" thing =\

    Was that on point?

    ~Iroko
     
  3. Moorfius

    Moorfius Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Any Thinking African will internalize these Facts and Truth*

    Hotep

    If we hear what our elders are telling us and heed the guidance, rescerch, wisdom, right-knowledge and Spirituality...we will begin to wake up and know who we are. The youth today do not have to think that they are in a totaly hopeles situation ware no one knows the real reasons for our present state of pitiful, pathetic, spiritual death under the system of white superimacy today. The first step twards absolute African Spiritual and total liberation is to "Know the Truth". The truth is with us today and will stay with us forever as we return to the company of our "Divine so-called African Ancistors" ware "We" belong. We must read, study, research, meditate, ponder over the "True" messages our "Elders" are giving us today and most of all..."Internilize" and make it a key part in our thinking, actions and responce to the system of white superimacy and watch it as it "Dies" out of "Existance" for ever eternally. This is our day and time to wake up and "Know Your Black African Self"

    Ase`

    Note: Every thing that goes wrong in the system of white superimacy...is the "Fault" of the "Owners" of that system...Dr.Neely Fuller. The white persons biggist "Fear" is the "Fear" of "Genitic" "Anialation"...Dr. Francis C. Welsing.
     
  4. Destee

    Destee destee.com STAFF

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    Yes Sister Blak ... i do believe that a white person can be in a relationship with a Black person and still be racist.


    I don't believe i've ignored that facet, but i suppose some could.


    What you refer to as "plantation ghosts" i describe as "weapons of mass destruction" and yes, they continue to haunt us as we continue to manifest the behavior that comes as a direct result of it.


    Yes, i think it is a perpetuation of the weapons of mass destruction, for us to marry and mate with those outside of our race.


    It's interesting that Brother Ikori posted above me, and he says that he is the offspring of such a relationship, yet he is here building with us. I realize you feel that he is an enemy of Black people, simply because of the union that created him, but i don't believe that is absolutely, necessarily true. The offspring of such unions have a choice, and can choose to empower Black people or empower white people (or any people for that matter).


    Sister Blak ... i appreciate you starting this thread, though i had hoped the intial post and title would reflect your truths and feelings as expressed during chat tonight (last night). I do believe, that if you had shared the same sentiments in your initial post, that you shared in chat, Brother Ikoro would probably not be expressing deep gratitude to you for posting this thread, as you no doubt would have made it very clear, that in your opinion, he (and all those like him) are the enemy of Black People.

    Nonetheless, i believe you when you say you have a plan, and will eventually say the things you said in chat. I just wish you had done it in the first post and title, so it doesn't get lost in the thick of the discussion.

    Much Love and Peace.

    :heart:

    Destee
     
  5. spicybrown

    spicybrown Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Peace Ikoro...

    Thank you ?Brother? Ikoro for your input. You are a shining example, and you pave the way in debunking the myth that ALL biracials are confused fence straddlers, who are set out to destroy the Black community :toast:




    My sentiments. exactly, Ikoro. In the above passages, you have expounded in full, and uphold the crux of my stance of a chat debate (turned ugly) in which I engaged a few hours ago; over what/who can be considered Black, and where their(bi/multiracial) loyalty lies. Those who were there know what I am talking about. I see you mentioned that you have two parents of different races. Thank you for shedding a light on that which has been so "difficult" to bring TO light...from a biracial's POV.

    Quick question: Do you ID as Black; "mixed"; or, "nonBlack/other"?
     
  6. Ikoro

    Ikoro Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Thank you -so much- Sister Destee and Spicybrown, for your votes of confidence and your respect. I am a brother... *smile*

    I actually did not realize that Sister Blacklioness was of the oppinion she was.

    I never knew reading a simple thread on the net could hurt this much...

    But I know that a lot of of those I choose to call my people are against my existence.

    FYI, sister Spicybrown, I don't appreciate the label black (although I understand it). I would rather replace it with Afrikan (heritage). I ID preferably as mixed or Afrikan without any qualms. I am sure that if you have any questions or such regarding this or something else, we can discuss it privately. But thank you for your respect.

    Seriously... The pain just lingers in my every breath. Makes me want to shed a few tears. I feel a poem comming on.

    ~Ikoro
     
  7. kemetkind

    kemetkind Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Interesting. Why only mixed and Afrikan? Why not white?

    I believe it was posed in another thread that biracials will refer to themselves as black sometimes, sometimes mixed, but they never claim "white."

    Is it because biracials that are white enough to claim white don't bother with claiming biracial?

    As it relates to this topic, I've thought about these things quite a bit in the past few months.

    Practically speaking, it makes no more sense (IMO) to assume biracials are enemies than to assume all black folks are allies.

    We really don't have the time to waste getting so caught up in differences (classism, colorism, religiosity, "knowledge" elitism, etc., etc.).

    In the big scheme of things, these issues are digressions.
     
  8. Destee

    Destee destee.com STAFF

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    Brother Kemetkind ... please don't think i'm stalk'n you all over the community ... but here i am again ... :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:

    :heart:

    Destee
     
  9. Destee

    Destee destee.com STAFF

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    Sister Blak ... do Dr. Welsing and Mr. Fuller say that the offspring of Black/non-Black unions ... mulatto, biracial, mixed, etc., folk ... are the enemy of Black people?

    :heart:

    Destee
     
  10. spicybrown

    spicybrown Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Brother Kemetkind asked Ikoro:





    Maybe they don't WANT to embrace their whiteness. Well, I thought the issue with biracials was their loyalty to the Black cause. Why are you wondering why he is not embracing his white side? Sounds like an attempt to fix that which is not broken. You can skim through the Brother's posts and see that he is conscious, and CHOOSES to embrace his Blackness. I mean, evidence:he is giving a portion of his time to post and be with THIS BLACK community. The thing is; a biracial is going to gravitate to whichever culture/race they feel welcomed into. And I suspect SOME of them shun their Blackness because they feel 'uninvited' by those 'purists' who GLOSS over their dominant Blackness, and see biracials through tunnel vision. White/enemy.


    I do applaud your closing statements to the Brother though:

     
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