Black People : Afrocentricity and the Robbing of Native American Cultures

Discussion in 'Black People Open Forum' started by Hildegard von Krone, Dec 29, 2011.

  1. Hildegard von Krone

    Hildegard von Krone Banned MEMBER

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    After reading a post about made here about native indians being african (or african influenced), I wanted to share this with you all:

    Robbing Native American Cultures: Van Sertima's Afrocentricity and the Olmecs.

    http://www.unl.edu/rhames/courses/current/vansertima.pdf

    The closing statement reads as follows:

    "For the most part, the Afrocentrists and other cultural nationalist have heartly endorsed Van Sertima's thesis despite its obvious weaknesses in methodology and evidence. Althought they have called for an Afrocentric history that is accurate and well-intentioned, they seem to be more concerned with the need to raise the "self-esteem" of African-Americans, regardless of the impact on other groups. By endorsing Van Sertima's writtings, the Afrocentrists and cultural nationalists have accepted a hegemonic and racialist view of pre-Columbian America that is completely lacking in historical accuracy. They have also accepted a theory and a methodological approach that grossly distort the historical record at the expense of Native Americans. Despite vehement protestations to the contrary, Van Sertima has, in effect, trampled on the self-respect or self-esteem of Native Americans by minimizing ther role as actors in their own history, denigrating their cultures and usurping their contributions to the development of world civilizations."
     
  2. Zim

    Zim Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    I like how you started out here as an innocent white girl from argentina who wanted to spread love and now all of a sudden you have become a race relations expert. Blatant troll if you ask me. Didn't take long for that condescending demeanor to ooze out of your mouth.
     
  3. Hildegard von Krone

    Hildegard von Krone Banned MEMBER

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    Did I said I was an expert? No...but reading so many lies and attempts to steal other cultures I could not remain innocent anymore to these offensive claims. You have nothing to add, you see? You only came to attack me and call me names like most people here have done already, and why? because I dont agree with certain things here or because im white? I wish I had never posted my picture or say I was from Argentina, because now I realize it was a mistake on my part, as people here seem to judge other based on what they look like or where they came from...
     
  4. Omowale Jabali

    Omowale Jabali The Cosmic Journeyman PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I am in the library working on a paper entitled the cultural heritage of the amentiu. As someone with African and native American heritage I am sure that the last of my life journey will be affirming this dual legacy and I will not waste time splitting hairs anymore with interlopers bent on launching their weapons of mass detraction but I will stay focused on sharpening my own steel.
     
  5. Zim

    Zim Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    All I'm saying is you are a fraud. Have you yourself read Ivan Van Sertimas works? If not , why are you so eager to denounce them? That seems pretty racist to me - you yourself haven't read them yet you ravenously searched the internet and pasted anything you thought would disprove his theories. I'm not judging you - I'm just convinced that you have an agenda and your posting here isn't as innocent as you make out. You turned into an expert on topics you claim no knowledge of over night. Pretty suspicious behavior if you ask me.
     
  6. Hildegard von Krone

    Hildegard von Krone Banned MEMBER

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    I didnt even knew this Ivan Van Sertimas until today after I researched more because of a extremely rude comment made by a member here! I havent read his work, but the people in that link did. You would know if you had cared to open the link...
     
  7. blackisbeautiful

    blackisbeautiful Banned MEMBER

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    We need to take pride in cultures where the people look like us. Afrocentrics should concentrate on the greatness of Nubia, Kush and other nations where there is no question what race the people are.
     
  8. Omowale Jabali

    Omowale Jabali The Cosmic Journeyman PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Much has become known about the explorer Columbus through the strenuous efforts of native people eager to tell their story. Five hundred years after he washed up on the shores of San Salvador, it has become clear that Columbus stumbled upon not only Indians, but Muslims as well. Muslims began traveling to the Caribbean six centuries before European contact was made (over 1,100 years ago). Columbus and early Spanish and Portuguese explorers were able to voyage across the Atlantic (a distance of 1,500 miles) due to Muslim geographical and navigational information and maps made by Muslim traders, in particular Al-Masudis drawings (d. 957 CE). Vasco da Gama consulted with Ahmad Ibn Majid on the African Western coast before setting out into the Atlantic. Ibn Majid was the worlds expert on navigation in the Indian Ocean, the Persian Gulf, the Red Sea, the Sea of Southern China and the waters around the West Indies.As early as 889 CE, a Muslim navigator, Kashkhash ibn Saeed ibn Aswad, from Cordoba Spain, crossed the Atlantic and returned with wonderful treasures. In February 999 CE, Ibn Farukh landed in Gando (Great Canary Islands), visited King Guanariga, and continued westwards where he saw and named two islands, Capraria and Pluitana, he arrived back in Spain in May.

    The famous Arab Geographer Al Sharif al-Idrisi (1097-1155) wrote in The Geography of Al-Idrisi: A group of seafarers (from North Africa) sailed into the sea of Darkness and Fog (The Atlantic Ocean) from Lisbon (Portugal) in order to discover what was in it, and to what extent were its limits�. They finally reached an island that had people and cultivation. On the fourth day a translator came speaking the Arabic language!

    When Mansa Musa the world-renowned Mandinka monarch of the West African Islamic Empire of Mali, was enroute to Makkah on his famous Hajj in 1324, he informed the scholars of Cairo that his brother, King Abubakari II, had undertaken two expeditions into the Atlantic Ocean. When the king did not return to Timbuktoo from the second voyage of 1311, Mansa Musa became ruler of the Empire.The Mandinkas used the closest land base to West Africa, Brazil, as the center for their exploration of the Americas. They traveled along rivers through the dense jungles of South America into North America.

    In a document written in 1754 a Spanish banderista (land pirate) wrote of well laid-out cities in and around Minas Geraes in the interior of Brazil with suburb stone and mortar buildings, obelisks and statues. The jungle has reclaimed many of these Mandinka cities, but the early Spanish explorers saw a large number of them. The Muslims left a legacy of writing among the natives of the area, especially on the Koaty Islands of Lake Titicaca, where the ideograms are identical to the Mandinka script.Even as far as the Pacific Ocean coast of South America, near Ylo, Mandinka Muslim writings have been found and translated: man - To pursue worship, to mature and become matter without life. Man pursues a cavernous place -(i.e. the grave).Anthropologists have proven that the Mandinkas under Mansa Musa's instructions explored many parts of North America via the Mississippi and other river systems.

    http://blacksahaba.blogspot.com/2009/01/black-muslims-in-america-6-centuries.html
     
  9. Omowale Jabali

    Omowale Jabali The Cosmic Journeyman PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Native Americans and Islam

    Contents


    Introduction

    There are numerous accounts of Muslims who were integrated within Native Indian tribes pre Columbus, of Turkic, Moorish and African Muslims leaving colonies to live amongst the Native Indians. There are also historical letters and colonial advertisements describing the threat to the colonies of African Muslim Slaves fleeing and integrating with the Native American Indians. There is also the case of Mahomet Weyonomonof the Mohegan tribe, who arrived in Britain in 1736 CE (1148 AH) [1]century to discuss the land grabs by the British.
    [​IMG]

    Main article: Muslims First Journey To America

    • in the 12th century Al-Idrisi reported in Nuzhat Al-Mushtaq Fi Ikhtiraq Al-Afaq (Excursion of the Longing One in Crossing Horizons), that a group of eight Muslim sailors from North Africa sailed west of Lisbon. After sailing west for more than 31 days, they landed on what must have been an island in the Caribbean. The intrepid explorers were initially imprisoned by Indians but were later released when a translator appeared who spoke Arabic [2]
    • 1310 CE (709 AH) Sultan Abu Bakari of the Mandinka kingdom of Mali sent two different fleets of ships, totalling 2,400 ships, sailing west from Africa. The fleets never returned to Africa.
    There are also numerous reports of 'black skinned' Indians. For example in Honduras Columbus reported seeing Black skinned Indians. Giles Cauvet's 'Les Berberes de l'Amerique' reported that a pre-Columbian tribe in Honduras was know as the Almamys a corruption of the Mandinka word for the Arabic Imam.
    American Treaties and laws with American Muslims


    Several colonial advertisements made direct reference to the integration of African Americans into the Native American communities. For example ..ran off with his Indian wife... had kin among the Indians .. part Indian and speaks their language good. [3]
    In South Carolina, colonists became so concerned about the possible threat posed by the mixed African and Indian population that was arising as runaway Africans escaped to the Indians that they passed a new law in 1725 CE (1137 AH). This law stipulated a fine of 200 pounds on anyone who even brought a slave to the frontier regions of the colony. In 1751 CE (1164 AH) the colony of South Carolina found it necessary to issue another law, warning that having Africans in proximity to Indians was deemed detrimental to the security of the colony.
    In 1726 CE (1138 AH) the British governor of colonial New York exacted a promise from the Iroquois Indians to return all runaway slaves who had joined up with them. This same promise was extracted from the Huron Indians in 1764 CE (1177 AH) and from the Delaware Indians in 1765 CE (1178 AH). Despite their promises, no escaped slaves were ever returned by these tribes, who continued to provide a safe and secure home for escaped slaves.
    And finally a census was undertaken of the Cherokee in 1835 CE (1250 AH) where fully 10% were of African descent [4]
    http://muslimwiki.com/mw/index.php/Native_Americans_and_Islam

    Cultural dress

    [​IMG]
    Turbaned cherokee
    In the old books on Cherokee clothing up until the time of 1832, you will see the men wearing turbans and the women wearing long head coverings​

    History of Islam In America
     
  10. Omowale Jabali

    Omowale Jabali The Cosmic Journeyman PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Numerous evidence suggests that Muslims from Spain and West Africa arrived to the Americas at least five centuries before Columbus. It is recorded, for example, that in the mid-tenth century, during the rule of the Ummayyed Caliph Abdul-Rahman III (929-961 CE), Muslims of African origin sailed westward from the Spanish port of DELBA (Palos) into the "Ocean of darkness and fog". They returned after a long absence with much booty from a "strange and curious land". It is evident that people of Muslim origin are known to have accompanied Columbus and subsequent Spanish explorers to the New World.

    The last Muslim stronghold in Spain, Granada, fell to the Christians in 1492 CE, just before the Spanish inquisition was launched. To escape persecution, many non-Christians fled or embraced Catholicism. At least two documents imply the presence of Muslims in Spanish America before 1550 CE. Despite the fact that a decree issued in 1539 CE by Charles V, king of Spain, forbade the grandsons of Muslims who had been burned at the stake to migrate to the West Indies. This decree was ratified in 1543 CE, and an order for the expulsion of all Muslims from overseas Spanish territories was subsequently published. Many references on the Muslim arrival to Americas are available. They are summarized in the following:

    http://www.mediamonitors.net/youssefmroueh1.html#fn07
     
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