Black Relationships : ADDRESSING THE MYTH OF FATHERLESS HOMES

Kemetstry

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I disagree your honor! :happens:

:bs: Do I need to call up all the diss posts for fathers day? Or just bad mouthing men period? Don't let me get started



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Queenie

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:bs: Do I need to call up all the diss posts for fathers day? Or just bad mouthing men period? Don't let me get started



.
You and your flag. lol Ya need to torch it!

Bad mouthing men? Are you looking in the mirror? You do it...with your obsession with Mr. "Mookie"! You talk about him all the time. There are Mookies and there are Snookies (female version) in the world, including the Black community and they are very much attracted to each other. People with low expectations tend to get what they expect. But, not everyone is a Mookie or Snookie. The key is to know the difference and never confuse them with their polar opposites--people who take responsibility, commitment and love seriously. You don't need data to tell you that.
 

ogoun

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Jun 14, 2018
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What happened? We have a blood bath around here yesterday afternoon after I checked out? Two complete threads deleted!!!??? Or is it better I don't ask and I don't know? I've been on forums that have deleted individual posts before but complete threads? Don't ever remember that happening.
But then again what were talking about?...........Hand me some that b-12 Queen.
 

ogoun

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Jun 14, 2018
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What? That BM are not perceived as good fathers? Yes. The data otherwise is being ignored



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I think I broached my thoughts on the data and statistics in my first post for this thread and then again later not too many pages back on data/statistics in general. If memory serves (why does that always come up?) anyways if memory serves there's been at least a couple of people in this thread that have pushed back saying those stats are just plain wrong from dint of anecdotal personal experience. Their evidence such as it is is not that much more or less than yours as both come from the personal. In your case the people your familiar and associate with, the orgs. you belong to are all (I'm sure) very loving attentive fathers. You (or your 'club') just happen to come up with a set of self-reenforcing data points (which by the seem to be very careful in where they step) is the only real difference.

On the PR front. Nothing changed there overnight or otherwise in the 70's.
If you think it did, where was all the good coverage in the 60's? I don't remember any good press outside of our own publications.
 

SwagII

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May 26, 2019
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:offtopic1:

Lets get back to the issue



.
I like this discussed topic/issue as it's actually human reality, other words it's full of truth and not based upon all this data, etc. It's about things we can see on a daily basis happening without our many communities,, etc. Every day one can meet a black woman that's raising her kids alone, etc. Yet some of these women are still being played on by some of their baby daddies, etc. This reference is certainly not saying that all black men are dead beat dads, etc. in fact there are many black men that are actually in the lives of their children, etc. Just as many often marry their baby mama's etc. Get a job, and provide for their loved ones, etc. We all refer to this arrangement as , family, etc. Look nobody told any of us that life wasn't going to be tough, etc. Yet, we are living within a very casual sexually promiscuous society whereas black men and women are involved with multiple sexual partners, etc. other words the sexing part becomes all easy as with making babies and moving on, etc. Often I have heard a black man 's claim of fathering up to 24 babies, etc. And this is just within one Community, etc. and it is the truth that as this thread emphasizes, etc. far too black baby daddies are not in the lives of their children, as many often simply walk away from their responsibilities as fathers! Sad, but it is what it is... easing on... later..,
 

Kemetstry

going above and beyond
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Feb 19, 2001
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Detroit
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You and your flag. lol Ya need to torch it!

Bad mouthing men? Are you looking in the mirror? You do it...with your obsession with Mr. "Mookie"! You talk about him all the time. There are Mookies and there are Snookies (female version) in the world, including the Black community and they are very much attracted to each other. People with low expectations tend to get what they expect. But, not everyone is a Mookie or Snookie. The key is to know the difference and never confuse them with their polar opposites--people who take responsibility, commitment and love seriously. You don't need data to tell you that.
Finally, you're the 1st female to give it a name. So, now you must start a "Say no to SNOOKIE!" campaign. :lol:


.
 

Kemetstry

going above and beyond
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Feb 19, 2001
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I think I broached my thoughts on the data and statistics in my first post for this thread and then again later not too many pages back on data/statistics in general. If memory serves (why does that always come up?) anyways if memory serves there's been at least a couple of people in this thread that have pushed back saying those stats are just plain wrong from dint of anecdotal personal experience. Their evidence such as it is is not that much more or less than yours as both come from the personal. In your case the people your familiar and associate with, the orgs. you belong to are all (I'm sure) very loving attentive fathers. You (or your 'club') just happen to come up with a set of self-reenforcing data points (which by the seem to be very careful in where they step) is the only real difference. The data throughout is from several studies over time. Thus, the subject has been peer reviewed and the conclusions not questionable.

On the PR front. Nothing changed there overnight or otherwise in the 70's.
If you think it did, where was all the good coverage in the 60's? I don't remember any good press outside of our own publications.
Thru the 60s, the oow birth rate and associated problems were statistically none existent in the black community. We stayed together and didn't have the family disfunction we do now



.
 

Kemetstry

going above and beyond
PREMIUM MEMBER
Feb 19, 2001
26,781
7,693
Detroit
Occupation
Chemist
I like this discussed topic/issue as it's actually human reality, other words it's full of truth and not based upon all this data, etc. It's about things we can see on a daily basis happening without our many communities,, etc. Every day one can meet a black woman that's raising her kids alone, etc. Yet some of these women are still being played on by some of their baby daddies, etc. This reference is certainly not saying that all black men are dead beat dads, etc. in fact there are many black men that are actually in the lives of their children, etc. Just as many often marry their baby mama's etc. Get a job, and provide for their loved ones, etc. We all refer to this arrangement as , family, etc. Look nobody told any of us that life wasn't going to be tough, etc. Yet, we are living within a very casual sexually promiscuous society whereas black men and women are involved with multiple sexual partners, etc. other words the sexing part becomes all easy as with making babies and moving on, etc. Often I have heard a black man 's claim of fathering up to 24 babies, etc. And this is just within one Community, etc. and it is the truth that as this thread emphasizes, etc. far too black baby daddies are not in the lives of their children, as many often simply walk away from their responsibilities as fathers! Sad, but it is what it is... easing on... later..,

Let me repeat. Those aren't men



.
 

SwagII

Well-Known Member
MEMBER
May 26, 2019
52
141
Addressing The "Black Men Abandon Their Children" myth.

Needless to say, black men are commonly stereotyped as having a strong propensity to abandon their children. The term "abandon" seems to be a preferred term especially by the black female interracial bloggers as well as the so called "black female empowerment" bloggers. The problem is that evidence disputes this stereotype and shows that the source of the stereotype is more so a case of the failure of black men and black women to form stable relationships. In response to President Obama's criticism of black men's alleged absence from their chidlren's lives, this article cites one study disputing the stereotype:

"A month before Obama made this stereotypical and plainly false assertion, Boston University professor Rebekah Levine Coley, in a comprehensive study on the black family, found that black fathers who aren’t in the home are much more likely to sustain regular contact with their children than absentee white fathers, or for that matter, fathers of any other ethnic group. The study is not an obscure study buried in the thick pages of a musty academic journal. It was widely cited in a feature article on Black fathers in the May 19, 2008 issue of Newsweek. There was no excuse then to spout this myth. The facts are totally contrary to Obama’s knock."
Of course, those bloggers insistent on degrading black men will, and and have scoffed at this study citing only their own observations as well as the infamous 70% out-of-wedlock birth rate for African Americans. Basically, to them, every single black child born out-of-wedlock has been abandoned by his or her father. Of course, this would mean that no black couples marry after they have children. This would mean that no unmarried black couples with children cohabitate. This would mean that no black men unmarried to their children's mothers are active fathers.

These bloggers will insist that this statistic as well as their alleged observations of so many little black children who do not know their fathers is proof that black men run away from their responsibilities as fathers. But the reality is that it is not the children that black men run from, it is the mothers of these children that they run from and their absence from their children's lives is a bi-product of not being in the mother's lives and this bi-product is just as prevalent in the lives of non-black men under the same circumstances. Lets look at some research:


"Only a small percentage of nonresident fathers continue to see their child(ren) after a five-year period following divorce (Blankenhorn, 1995; Stewart). This decreased involvement in their child(ren)'s lives by divorced fathers may be the result of constraints experienced by fathers following divorce. Cohen (1998) found that nonresident fathers' involvement in their child(ren)'s lives is subject to an array of constraints, resulting in decreased participation. He reported that "the role of fathering must be squeezed into short meetings under strained and artificial circumstances" (p. 200). If a father chooses to avoid these situations by not seeing his child(ren), the father likely forfeits leisure time with the child(ren)"
As we see, this research keys on men in general and concludes that of all men in general, a small percentage continue to see their children five years after divorce. Clearly, this is not a black male phenomenon. Lets look at more:


"Their findings support differences in fathering activities when controlling for
income, age, education and socioeconomic conditions of wives or co-habitators.
They found that African American fathers are ‘far more likely to monitor and supervise their children’s activities’ (p. 92) and suggest that these men are more strict, cautionary, and authoritarian than European American parents."
And more excerpts from the same website:


"Housaain et al. (1997) found that African American fathers spent more time providing physical care, feeding, and soothing of their infants than European American fathers."
"Comparison of adjusted income means indicate that African-
American fathers reporting more frequently participating in caregiving activities than Latino and European American fathers. In addition, African American
fathers also reported participating in more cognitive activities with their child
than European American and Latino fathers reported. African American and
Latino fathers reported signifi cantly more social skills activities with the focus
child than did European American fathers."
"Race or ethnic differences in reported fathering activities were examined.
As stated earlier, a number of studies have focused on absent fathers in minority
communities and have supported the idea that minority, particularly African
American fathers are not as involved with their children as European American
fathers (Carter, 2001; Hamer, 1997; Lindholm, 1997; Mincy, 2002). The current
study found differences in reported caregiving activities across race and
ethnicity. Toth and Xu (1999) found that African Americans fathers were more likely to supervise and monitor their children’s activities. The findings of this study supports this in that African American fathers reported participating in significantly more hands-on caregiving activities than either Latino or European American fathers. This finding is important because prior studies failed to examine some of the caregiving activities that were included in the measure used in the current study. As a result, African American fathers may be involved in different ways than had been previously reported in that they may participate in more traditional maternal activities. This present study supports the findings of Toth and Xu (1999) that the ‘stereotype of irresponsible and nonsupportive African American fathers is inaccurate and should be rejected’ (p. 92)"
"Both African American and Latino fathers reported higher levels of
participating in social activities than European American fathers. Social activities
are an important concept in early infant development (Parke et al., 2002). This
supports the idea that African American and Latino fathers may participate more in socializing their children especially in such activities as taking their child to
visit extended family and friends. Toth and Xu (1999) found that Latino fathers
reported participating in more activities such as spending time in leisure activities
such as picnics, movies, sports, etc. They report that in contrast to European
American families, African American and Latino fathers ‘tend to reinforce the
norms of family closeness … and monitor and supervise their children more’
(p. 92)."

"It should be noted that there may be an issue with sampling bias within the
sample of African American fathers. Although mothers indicated a father’s
presence in the child’s life, there was some diffi culty in interviewing African
American fathers. One reason for this might be that a higher percentage of these
men were not married or residing with the mother of the child. Researchers
in the current study found it easier to contact and interview fathers who were
residential fathers. As a result, given the higher percentage of African American
fathers not residing with the child, our African American fathers might be slightly
different than the European American and Latino fathers."

"Despite these limitations it is clear that minority fathers are involved with their
children although not always in recognized ways."

So basically, when fathers of similar income who don't reside with their children are compared, African American fathers are more involved with their children. Surprising? I'm sure that this will surprise many based on the media and sell-out driven stereotyping of black men. Many black women will not give credence to these studies because they don't want to accept that their failures to win the hearts of men have a direct impact on their children. Black children reside in single parent households at just under three times the rate of white children and it is this fact, not some imaginary desire of black men to abandon their children, that drives the absent father phenomenon in the black community.

Angela22
skuderjaymes
Ken Taylor
Black Squared





:em0200:
Expanding on that one word "Myth". Btw, apparently such information as been in most cases proven to be faulty, etc. But it has been long out in the general public spear, etc. Point is, where do we go from here, etc. ? Moving on...
 

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