Black Entertainment : "Good Times" as Minstrel Show

[cherryblossom]

You have to be kidding me. You at once argue that one can distinguish reality from fiction, but then you argue, when no one else is, that reality is depicted in fiction. Come now.

I want to understand what part of REALITY do you not understand?

Do you understand that a television show isn't reality?

This television show sets out to represent a poor intact Black family and it makes the family replete with morons and self-hatred. Beyond that it also encourages any Mis-Leader it can find: Jesse Jackson, NAACP . . ... It's clearly a propaganda outfit and clearly a negative depiction of Black people, yet you want to call it "Reality?" What in the world?

I saw the clip where Thelma rejects the sorority. The father tells his sons not to ask stupid questions. Thelma rejects the the sorority which can be seen as positive, sure, but because the writers were promoting the NAACP among other outfits.

It's so obvious that I don't see why you defend it.

Token positivity. And it remains situational.

There is no REALITY in fabrications, get that through your head.

Let Booker T. Washington instruct you:

“The study of art that does not result in making the strong less willing to oppress the weak means little.”

Extrapolate for this topic.

It's as much a "reality" as a Black Poor Inner-City Family would be strong, patient, and intelligent. You prefer that the representation is otherwise. You and the Whites whom prefer Black people hold self-hatred. You masquerading weaknesses, impatience and unintelligence as 'reality.' You.

What SUPPORT DO YOU HAVE that the WRITERS of Good Times promoted the NAACP??

Furthermore, this show was set in the 1970s. ---The NAACP, Jesse Jackson and many other VETERANS of the CIVIL RIGHTS ERA were still very active in fighting for, addressing, representing Black issues and needs.


HERE is an April/1974 issue of "THE CRISIS," the official publication of the NAACP:

http://books.google.com/books?id=Jd...ce=gbs_ge_summary_r&cad=0#v=onepage&q&f=false


...And what's really so said is that you have actually CONVINCED yourself of this stuff. (smh)

And, there is a difference between "UN-EDUCATED" and "UN-INTELLIGENT."

These URBAN CHARACTER PARENTS (James & Florida) were UN-EDUCATED but NOT "un-intelligent." ---THEY like so many REAL LIFE BLACK PEOPLE were DOMESTIC WORKERS and LABORERS and were DESCENDANTS of those from the SHARE-CROPPING FIELDS of the South.

Black people like the CHARACTERS of these PARENTS weren't from the "TALENTED TENTH."

And this QUOTE you gave from BOOKER T. WASHINGTON is about EDUCATION IN THE SOUTH...

"Democracy and Education"
Booker T. Washington, Brooklyn, NY, 1896.

...The study of arithmetic that does not result in making someone more honest and self-reliant is defective.

The study of history that does not result in making men conscientious in receiving and counting the ballots of their fellow men is most faulty.

The study of art that does not result in making the strong less willing to oppress the weak means little.

How I wish that from the most humble log cabin schoolhouse in Alabama we could burn it, as it were, into the hearts and heads of all, that usefulness, service to our brother, is the supreme end of education. Putting the thought more directly as it applies to conditions in the South:...

...http://www.emersonkent.com/speeches/democracy_and_education.htm

EXTRAPOLATE THIS TO GOOD TIMES and how YOU see it as "MINSTRELING" >>>


...."You’re trying to drive him into a ghetto and make him the victim of every kind of unjust condition imaginable...... Why, you’re dealing with the wrong man, and you’re dealing with him at the wrong time in the wrong way...."

Malcolm X
http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/45a/461.html

 

[Destee]

Look, I personally know that many members here will try to denounce another member whose views they disagree with by accusing them of being a white person PRETENDING to be Black....I KNOW this because it's been said of ME numerous times by various members here.....even BY YOU as you jumped on the "band wagon" with some of them.

But, I swear, more-and-more, you sound like a white boy.....

Sister Cherry ... making the discussions personal is a violation of the rules.

We must challenge ourselves to remain on topic, and not begin attacking the Member personally.

Please self-moderate in this capacity too ... so i don't have to ... 'cause mine will problee look like abuse.

If you don't like a Member or what they say, and can't contain yourself within the rules, put them on ignore.

Love You!



Destee

 

[Destee]

wow...now i see why brother info be givin it to you...lol

Brother Khasm ... i too have seen Brother Info 'givin it to him' ... but he's riding the edge of violating.

Brother info-moetry ... please stop (half-way) referring to the Member as white ... making the discussions personal.

If i have to moderate these instances ... that i've overlooked thus far ... you're problee gonna feel mistreated.

If you don't like a Member or what they say, and can't contain yourself within the rules, put them on ignore.

Love You!



Destee

 

[Asomfwaa]

But, YOU interpreting REALITY, POVERTY and the SOCIO-POLITICAL/SOCIO-ECONOMIC times of the show as "WEAKNESS, IMPATIENCE, and UN-INTELLIGENT."

You're putting words in my mouth. It's unintelligent when James praises a soup and claims how much he loves it, then asks what's in the soup.

It's unintelligent when Willona, following a stick up, wants to talk about the sales that were going on in the store.

It's impatience when James flips out because Willona goes on that unintelligent tangent.

The weakness, impatience and un-intelligence does not relate to the 'reality,' 'poverty' or 'socio-political/socio-economic' times of the show.

It's not realistic that Willona couldn't stay focused on such a serious topic. It's nothing to do with poverty and it's nothing to do with socio-political/socio-economic times. But it has everything to do with insulting Black people.

Like I said, YOU have NO GRASP of the BLACK EXPERIENCE of REAL-LIFE POOR INNER-CITY BLACKS in the 1970s.

Cherry, I perfectly understand that the situations are realistic. But the situations don't make a Minstrel Show. What makes a minstrel show is when Black people are shown as weak, impatient and unintelligent, a collage of stereotypes.

I understand well that the situations can be imitating life. But that's not what makes a Minstrel Show. Shouting "DYNOMITE" and constantly at odds with one another is.

You will notice that these hijinks were an aspect of Black Sitcoms, not White Sitcoms. You will notice that this was a Minstrel Show if you stopped changing the subject.

Because, frankly, who cares if I don't understand, though I do? What's that have to do with the argument at hand?

 

[Asomfwaa]

And, there is a difference between "UN-EDUCATED" and "UN-INTELLIGENT."

Duh, but I already highlighted in the episode what made James portrayed as unintelligent. I could have highlighted any episode and the same patterns would emerge. He'd always say something dumb. But as you say, not because he 'was unintelligent' but because that is how Black people are portrayed.

Can you link James praises of the soup and admission of ignorance immediately after with poverty, socio-economics, and lack of education? Can't you admit that it's a show of un-intelligence instead of, yourself, going through these hundreds of diversions?

For you're missing the point. The point is that "Good Times" is a Minstrel Show. You're touching on 100 different subjects.

Your first post contained:

So, NO, GOOD TIMES was not ALL some "minstrel show," some Black tomfoolery and shuckin' & jivin....like J.J. and his, "DY-NO-MITE!"---The WHITE WRITERS wanted to concentrate on J.J. and have that character epitomize Black STEREOTYPES.

But, in spite of all that, this show also addressed some of the issues relevant to and IN the Black inner city.

This is only a mis-understanding of Minstrel Shows. A Minstrel Show can address issues relevant to the Black experience. But "some" Minstrel Show is a Minstrel Show. "J.J." alone wasn't the Minstrel. Thelma, Florida, Michael, James, Willona, Bookman were Minstrels too.

You have a full cast of Minstrels yet you don't think it's a Minstrel Show because you're not understanding what a Minstrel Show is. It doesn't matter what issues were addressed. The whole cast were Minstrels. That's enough said.