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Black People : African kings and the slave trade in the atlantic.

Discussion in 'Black People Open Forum' started by I-khan, Jan 18, 2006.

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  1.  
    I-khan

    I-khan Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    It is a known fact that many african kings sold their people into slavery.But one thing that is missing are certain questions and facts like:

    1)Since many did sell their own people,how would they replace the current king and how could they keep this up for 400 years without realizing the obvious? (divide and conquer)

    2) It was noted in europe that many enslavers lied about bying their slaves from kings, when they really employed pirates (killers,kidnappers,etc)to capture the vulnerable after dark, or while they were alone in the massive villages they lived in.

    3)Slavery was a byproduct of the true European agenda for Alkebulan which was to completely take over. There were also a number of wars in which millions of Africans were killed, these wars occured before the Boer Wars and the Zulu wars, why dont they mention them?(from what I know it happened in north africa.A little while After the Moorish holocaust)

    4) There were only 20-30 million slaves taken from Alkebulan. Why are the number of dead africans so large and the numbers of slaves so small?

    5) The middle passage is not the only passage like itself. There is another one that is from Europe to Africa. Most of the bodies at the bottom (numbered in the millions just like the Middles Passage)are of a Negroid type and are in shackles and chains.


    6)What happened to the rest of the tribes that were once in the area? The Asante and the Dahomi deny enslaving them. Most people say that they were massacred in a war wit the europeans.


    What do you guys think.
     
  2.  
    I-khan

    I-khan Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    I was reading this: "African captors kidnapped their countrymen and brought them to slave factories on the west coast of Africa. The journey was long and it is estimated that of 20 million slaves, half did not make it to the coast."


    Not to dismiss the fact that many African Kings did sell their own people,but how exactly were they able to keep this up for more than 300 years without facing opposition from others,contiuing tradition,etc. It is said that those who disagreed with the kings (a majority of the population, no matter what tribe) were sold or killed.To say that all West Africans had traded their people would be a fallacy,why, because if all of them did then were did the rest (the people who did not survive,and were unaccounted for)of the
    people come from?(estimated in the tens of millions again).Did you know that slavery in Europe of Africans did not begin with the Trans(sub)-atlantic but with the Sub-Saharan trade.It has been noted (but seldomly talked about) that many Arabs did kidnap Africans after killing the adults, converting the children to Islam,and making them believe that it was their duty to be a slave? Did you know that many Arabs sold these Africans to Europeans long before the Moors invaded Spain and the Industrial Revolution? Some "historians" think that the Industrial Revolution would not have been possible if it wasn't for the Africans whom were enslaved.






    Here is a small chart of the Survivors of the ocean trek.


    Slave exports from Africa

    Period Volume Percent

    1450-1600 367,000 3.1

    1601-1700 1,868,000 16.0

    1701-1800 6,133,000 52.4

    1801-1900 3,330,000 28.5

    Total 11,698,000 100.0


    Okay,now these are estimates into how many were arriving at the shores of the West. It is noted that is it was not for the slave labor,captitalism would not have existed.


    It has been estimated that between thirty and sixty million Africans were subjected to this horrendous triangular trade system and that only one third-if that-of those people survived.(http://www.juneteenth.com/middlep.htm)

    Taken that quote serioulsly.How exactly were the African kings able to acquire so many people over such a long period of time?



    http://www.antislavery.org/breakingthesilence/main/01/index.shtml


    http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstatv.htm



    Lets do the math.

    30-60 million people enslaved over 350 years.(thos whom survived)

    (pick any number between 30 and 60 million,for now I will use 40.)

    Divide 40 million by 375(years) you may get 106,666 people(taken every year).Divide that number (106666) by 365 (days in a year) and you will get 292 people taken(sold or not) a day.


    Finally ,add on that number(292) to the estimated number of Africans being sold, kidnapped, and killed by(400, for example) the Arabs and the slaves already in Europe before Columbus(estimated to be in the 1,000ths), and the people whom were killed or fought to the death against other Africans and Europeans and you will get a 1692.


    Now it seems that more people were killed a year(and/or died as a result of sickness,suicide,etc) than kidnapped, slavery seems to be the byproduct of an attempted genocide of Africans by the Arabs and many Europeans alike.
    One such method of war was divide and conquer which is exactly how the Europeans convinced the African kings to sell some of their people,and help the European traders kill all the rest.


    What do you guys think?
     
  3.  
    I-khan

    I-khan Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    To add on to myself, with all the wars,deaths,etc,how were they able to do it?

    Any ideas?
     
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    I-khan

    I-khan Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    Did you know that the Portuguese were the first to raid an area of Alkebulan in 1441 and they claimed that they kidnapped and murdered Africans? The leaders of these Portugese peoples were Gonsalvas and Tristao.
    Also,their were African slaves in Europe via the Arabs by as early as the 11th century.

    It is noted that african merchants were doing much of the kidnapping.Since that is a fact,how can one say that all of the slaves were sold by kings when many of the people in charge were not Kings in the first place.
     
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    I-khan

    I-khan Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    It has been said by historians who disbelieve the Africans that "African slavery in the original format was equivelant to serfdom(a state that Europeans lived in during the 15th century)". If so,then did the all of the African kings that did(kings,not merchant kidnappers)sell their people to the Euros or Arabs know that those peoples would be catching hell?
     
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    cherryblossom

    cherryblossom Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    I-khan


    [​IMG]
    www.AfricaEconomicAnalysis.org

    Slave trade: a root of contemporary African Crisis

    By Tunde Obadina


    .....

    Africa's underdevelopment was not inevitable
    Would Africans have suffered the same genocide had they tried to end the slave trade? Unlikely. It is doubtful that the human cost of resistance would have been greater than the many millions of Africans killed in slave producing wars as well as those eaten by sharks after being jettisoned during the Atlantic crossings. We cannot know for certain. It seems more likely that Europe would have had to look elsewhere for cheap labour. It was one thing for European nations to use military might to protect their coastal trading posts and subdue disgruntled local chiefs, it would have been an entirely different matter for them to penetrate the interior of the continent and fight the hundreds of war that fed the slave trade.
    The cost of such ventures would have made the price of slaves unattractive to the plantation owners in the Americas. As the historian Philip Curtin noted " If the prices of African-born slaves had not been competitive with those of labour from other sources - native born or European - the slave trade could never have come into existence, no matter what the epidemiological consequences of movement across the Atlantic."
    Had cheap Africans not been available to work the land and mines of the 'New World', white planters and landowners would have sought other sources of cheap labour. They would have made more use of the native population and also turned more to Europe for labour. In the seventeenth and eighteenth centuries large numbers of poor whites were shipped to the 'New World', most involuntarily, to work on plantations, mines and as servants. Some poor whites kidnapped on European streets were sold in the West Indies much in the same way as Africans were. Indentured servants, convicts and deportees from Europe were often treated not much better than black slaves. But as the transatlantic slave trade boomed, the number of whites in forced labour decreased. It was because of the relative cheapness of African slave labour, and therefore the plantation owners' preference for them, that the trade in white labour ended. This gave rise to what Afro-American writer William DuBois described as the replacement of "a caste of condition by a caste of race." Had the costs of black slaves been much dearer, Europe might have become a major source of unfree labour.
    COMPLETE HERE: http://www.africaeconomicanalysis.org/articles/gen/slavehtm.html
     
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    Keita Kenyatta

    Keita Kenyatta Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    First of all, I really hope that you're NOT doing online studying. I haven't read where you mentioned one scholar that said xy or z. Secondly, if you do have a library of the books that you should have, I equally feel that you wouldn't be asking these questions. Third, I have read no place where Afrakan Kings were selling "THEIR OWN" people....meaning, if they were selling their own people from their own nation or tribe, then who would they be King of? Since our people were having internal conflicts and wars, it was indeed the captured of those conflicts that were sold. Equally, once this thing really went into full swing, one tribe would go out and hunt other tribes for that purpose. But don't ever get it confused that they were selling THEIR OWN people. We today look at it like; "they were all black or African people" but our people on the continent don't see it that way. An Ashante don't have jack to do with a Sengalese and a person from the Congo don't have jack to do with a person from Mali and likewise. In their book they are different peoples.

    As long as you keep basing things off of SKIN COLOR you will never get the answers that you need. This is one of the major issues we in the West are having with the history of ancient Kemet...we keep looking at skin color instead of seeing it as they saw and understood it. I advise you to expand your mind on these issues to get the real answers that you need...and by all means, get a library, please!
     
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    RAPTOR

    RAPTOR Well-Known Member MEMBER

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    That tunde fellow reads like they've been trained in a missionary western capitalist paradaigm. A subtle rehashing of europhile-apologist rhetoric.
     
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