to what extent do the flaws of the messenger reflect on the message?

i have seen that my spiritual leader has some flaws. i find no flaws in the message.
can a perfect message be carried by a flawed messenger?

always supersedes the flawed messenger

so to answer your question

the perfect message can be brought by a flawed messenger

one of the hardest things i've had to do was try to filter out

the extras and/or embellishments of a "messenger"

seeing and hearing the "true" message takes time and patience

and the ability to decipher thru the BS

peace James great work with obama

now what's next

i know you like to look on the bright side

though this election seems to me to be heading for picking the white

candidate or the black candidate

your thoughts?

to what extent do the flaws of the messenger reflect on the message?

i have seen that my spiritual leader has some flaws. i find no flaws in the message.
can a perfect message be carried by a flawed messenger?

is not in a book, but inside each and every human being, because that is where GOD dwells.

to what extent do the flaws of the messenger reflect on the message?

i have seen that my spiritual leader has some flaws. i find no flaws in the message.
can a perfect message be carried by a flawed messenger?

Absolutely a "good" message can be carried by a flawed messenger. I was ask you to challenge the message in order to decide how good it really is.

I have never heard of a PERFECT message, but I am open to one if you believe you have one.

A messenger is just to expand your knowledge in the right direction, the flaws of the messenger have nothing to do with the knowledge you've gained.

depend on what your perception of flaw'd is?

is not in a book, but inside each and every human being, because that is where GOD dwells.

I agree 100%, if im gonna have a spritual leader i would tell him/her, "preach what you live, dont live what you preach." In other words dont tell me a fairy of some pie in the sky bs about the way things should be according to some book, tell me your experience and how its worked for you. Most people especially christian leaders dont believe in or live the crap that they preach, which is why they are always getting caught red handed.

depend on what your perception of flaw'd is?

it seems that black people often gather around a charismatic leader. the problem is that some times the charismatic leader does not posses a lot of insight into their own behavior.

we get these cults of personality.

this may be great for the leader, but it does not secure the group for long term survival. what happens when the leader dies? if they have not built a strong foundation but based everything in the organization on the leader always being there to run everything, when the leader is no longer there the group falls apart.

the flaw i see in black groups and black governments is that there is no continuity. one cat decides he is it for life.
there is no one set up to take over. in africa, it seems that every time they want a new leader, they have to go to a civil war.
no one will transfer or even share power. we end up fighting war after war after war. this is why the african countries cannot get ahead. they keep killing each other.

there are few black groups that exist from one generation to the next. we just do not know how to transfer leadership.
this is the flaw in the charismatic black leader.

I agree 100%, if im gonna have a spritual leader i would tell him/her, "preach what you live, dont live what you preach." In other words dont tell me a fairy of some pie in the sky bs about the way things should be according to some book, tell me your experience and how its worked for you. Most people especially christian leaders dont believe in or live the crap that they preach, which is why they are always getting caught red handed.

:SuN006: A spiritual leader is just another form of a proxy. I don't need that nonsense when I can counsel directly with GOD.:skate:

to what extent do the flaws of the messenger reflect on the message?

i have seen that my spiritual leader has some flaws. i find no flaws in the message.
can a perfect message be carried by a flawed messenger?

some times the charismatic leader does not posses a lot of insight into their own behavior.
Yes…and because they don’t, one may do well to do the WORK suggested by DSS…

one of the hardest things i've had to do was try to filter out

the extras and/or embellishments of a "messenger"

seeing and hearing the "true" message takes time and patience

and the ability to decipher thru the BS

In addition, I sense it would be good to recognize as SiS. Fine states…
but inside each and every human being,
Now, I do make the connections our Elder Osiris teaches in terms of US being “Divine beings” as opposed to “human” beings. KNOWING this (for myself) helps me overstand and place in perspective the fact that any “messenger” of Afreekan Descent has been covered with a bunch of B.S. and are not able to function as the Divine BE~ings they are. Therefore, we have the shyutation you speak of here…
one cat decides he is it for life.

I also hold the same position as Brother (?) A007 in that….
the flaws of the messenger have nothing to do with the knowledge you've gained.
While WE may be covered up with a lot of B.S. (which I also refer to as “white out”), WE still carry the seed of Divinity in our DNA, at the center of our Dark Being…our core. Because of this…our Creator KNOWS Us ..even when we don’t KNOW SELF.
That Creative Energy “speaks” to me, “reveals” to me, those things I need to see…about me. When I see me, I see thee. When I connect with a “leader”, charismatic or not, I am connecting with that message that further reveals me to me, reconnects me to me and /or which fits with the purpose of me being here….now…

I take it and then work to DO as SiS Each1 suggest is helpful for her….
preach what you live, dont live what you preach
tell me your experience and how its worked for you.

This is the work of my RE~covery program. To share YOUR experiences, strengths and plans. Allow others to listen and take what it is they need at the time. Not TELL them what they SHOULD be thinking, how they SHOULD be doing etc…based on MY/YOUR ish.
My stuff is mine..people are FREE to “take what they like and leave or store the rest”.
That is the Work of recovery and the practice of members who attend meetings the 12 step way. This is the foundation for the ‘success’ of 12 steps programs. It takes away the need for or tendency towards JUDGEMENT of another and allows the person sharing to take responsibility for their own ish.

I listen to people, proclaimed messengers or not, and…
I recognize us ALL as “messengers” with a “perfect” message….

With an ear towards how it relates to me BE~ing the best possible me.
I sense if more people thought and behaved in such a way, well…..in the end,
We’d be DO~ing this…
I can counsel directly with GOD.
The Creator or Neter is US

Thanks for Sharing this topic!

M.E.
:hearts2:

it seems that black people often gather around a charismatic leader. the problem is that some times the charismatic leader does not posses a lot of insight into their own behavior.

we get these cults of personality.

this may be great for the leader, but it does not secure the group for long term survival. what happens when the leader dies? if they have not built a strong foundation but based everything in the organization on the leader always being there to run everything, when the leader is no longer there the group falls apart.

the flaw i see in black groups and black governments is that there is no continuity. one cat decides he is it for life.
there is no one set up to take over. in africa, it seems that every time they want a new leader, they have to go to a civil war.
no one will transfer or even share power. we end up fighting war after war after war. this is why the african countries cannot get ahead. they keep killing each other.

there are few black groups that exist from one generation to the next. we just do not know how to transfer leadership.
this is the flaw in the charismatic black leader.

definately co-sign on this right here Br. J....

this is real talk...

everything that glitters ain't always gold....

people do go for whateva look good..

my friends do it all the time... all u need is some bling bling and a nice pair of sneakers and u in like flint.......

leaders IMO should be seasoned and flexable.... u have to deal with many personalities... but in the days of old that was the purpose of the Pharoahs to designate the next leader and to teach them how...

how to be just, fair, balanced .......

when one is dedicated to the people it's one thing.. and when they dedicated to their own agenda it's another........ unfortunately, we moving toward the latter, which is evident by simply just looking around and admitting what is important to us.......

but how can we change this perception?????

This was a good post and it made me think about myself. Why? Because basically I can relate to it. I deliver truth to people everyday and basically people have a real problem separating "what I say from me as a person". A hungry person does not care the least how they get the food...they want and need the food. If I throw it on their front porch...deliver it on a plate or bring it all wrapped in plastic wrap with napkins...the hungry person does not care and nor should they. It's the same with medicine. A sick person does not care how they get the cure they simply want it.

Now I bring this up for a reason. Very often I say what I have to say the way I want to say it...and many people have a real issue with that. I'm not politically correct. I could care less how someone feels about it or doesn't feel about it....cause in my book all those are "control issues". In other words, "why I got to say it like that?"...or "why do I have to be so raw?"...or "have I thought about how other people are receiving what I say?".

Honestly....yes I have considered all those issues. My response? I've often wondered why "truth, like medicine is the only thing you have to sugar coat before someone will accept it?" Since I've come to learn that you can never please all the people no matter what or how you deliver a message, I guess the only person I should be concerned about is myself and how I feel when delivering a message.

In reality I don't feel anything. What it is is what it is. To me it makes no difference if I say manure...do do, a number two or sh--. It's all the same thing so there's no need to try and disguise it as if it's something different, and no matter how it's delivered your nose lets you know what it is.

The bottom line is that I learned long ago to look past the messenger. What can a wino or drug addict teach me? If nothing else, why I shouldn't be a wino or drug addict. Am I supposed to not listen to them because they are a wino or drug addict? Would the message be better received by me if someone in a two piece suit said it to me?...and I guess this is what blows my mind about our people...because psychologically, emotionally and physically we always shoot the messenger when in reality it was never about the messenger but the message.

I've often wondered why "truth, like medicine is the only thing you have to sugar coat before someone will accept it?"

much medicine is actually highly toxic poison and will kill your butte quick and in a hurry if not taken properly:nono:

Reality says that there is no such thing as a poison or a medicine. It is all a matter of the degree in which one of them is used. The right amount of what we consider to be a poison suddenly becomes a medicine and the wrong amount of what we consider to be a medicine suddenly becomes a poison. This is equally why "knowledge" is not for everyone. Money is equally a tool. One rich man uses his money to build structures to enhance and uplift the human while another uses his to build weapons to destroy the same. One man uses his knowledge to enhance and uplift while another with the same knowledge uses his to corrupt and destroy the same.

This is the point where people with the balance, knowledge and power need to be judge, jury and executioner!!