Amunra, I have a question for you, I have known many people
in a relationship, that suffer through verbal and physical abuse.
I have tried to offer intelligent reasoning to them, about
abandoning this futile companionship. Yet still they persist, that
they are in love, even tho they themselves understand the situation they are in and what they need to do to rectify it. They still continue to stay, I find it unbelievable. Can you shed some light on this self destructive phenomenon?


Epiphany :heart:

can I just jump in here and make a comment....

from witnessing this happen to a close family member, I also ask the same question, at least a thousand times....

the social workers I dealt with told me that spousal abuse happens in a cycle...ironically called the honeymoon cycle...

there is the build-up, the physical abuse, the non-communication, the apology and promises from the abuser, the forgiveness, the falling in love again...6 steps...and then it starts all over again...

around 90% of women that have left their abusive spouses will return within a 90 day period of leaving....to suffer more of the same...their reasons are many and varied...

the sad part is, that no matter how hard you try, you cannot help these women until they are ready to help themselves...denial is so much a part of their lives...

it is easy for an outsider to see the problem...the hard part is getting the abused to admit there is a problem..

K

. . . perhaps it stems froma lack of self-esteem or an intense mothering or fathering attitude that belives it can save the problem individual from this behavior. I have seen it as I am sure you have and it just doesn't make any rational sense. Often those who stay in these relationships feel that they deserve this type of treatment or feel that this is the best they will ever do in life, so, they stay. Others stay because they feel that they have no where to go and in many cases, at least on the surface, it does appear that way. Often when one is far removed from friends, family and society, the feeling comes that there is nowhere else to go and this is the formula for desparation which probably will end in tragedy because when aperson feels they have no way out they will stay until there is no way out or they will find a way out that is not in proportion to their need which is usually killing someone.

Also, there are needy individuals who see this form of abuse as attention, as someone who cares becasue they take the time to abuse them. I know that sounds ridiculous, but it happens. Still, even with all the reading, watching and hearing I've done on this topic I have have no idea of why. It still makes no sense to me. It always seemed that if you know that fire burns, then you don't stick your hand in it. If you know that trouble is over here, then we make sure we go over there instead.

Hell, I don't know!


Ra

:)

Kitana, no problem...I welcome all comments. I certainly understand what you mean, although it doesn't help the frustration of watching it happen and listening to them complain, yet after all the long talk and advice, they return.
I have seen it many times , friends, and sis in laws. I came to the conclusion, not to listen, because I felt it was getting me really upset (I have had many a headaches), when they didn't listen and I was enabling them to sound off, only to release the strength they had to make a decision and cool off. So I chose to not indulge them, I didn't turn my back, but I didn't enable them. In time....within years, after looking ragged and worn, they made the decision to leave. But, you are right, until they believe they have had enough, there is not much someone on the outside looking in can do. I thank you for the read and your comments.


Epiphany :heart:

I agree with your theories,
perhaps you can offer an opinion on what type of man has the psyche to
physically abuse a woman, I'd like to hear your comment on that. As far as a man being in this situation, I agree also, I don't know, if I would agree so much with the physical abuse(tho, I believe there is some cases)...I think with men, it is more emotional and verbal abuse. I also have known men like that. Do you think, the reasoning is the same for staying? Thanks Kem, for your read and your opinions. Its greatly appreciated.


Epiphany :heart:

Thanks Amun_Ra, I'm sure, it is a
question, that has many answers,
but not a true understanding, only speculation. I just have always wondered that. What would make a person be so self destructive? I know every living creature should have basic instinct for self preservation.
It just really puzzles me. I appreciate
you offering your opinion. I just wanted to take this moment to tell you, I have really enjoyed your commentaries and your column. Perhaps...you will address the questions I asked Kem also, if you could?...Again thanks.


Epiphany :heart:

maybe the administers of physical abuse are not limited to the male gender, but I'm sure there a lot less numbers of females physically abusing males than vice versa....males are more powerful physically and thats just a fact...but there seem to be a heck of a lot of women who like to verbally abuse their mates, by putting them down and making jokes about aspects of their character..

from my experience with abused women (which is limited), I have heard them often say that they would rather suffer physical abuse than verbal or emotional abuse....because if it's physical, then it's a hit or a punch and then it's over for a while....verbal and emotional abuse never stops....and I think in some ways does more damage...

and I think being a controller and being insecure work hand in hand anyway...they seem to be a controller because they are insecure...and not only does his control means that he wants to make the women completely dependant on him..it also means he can shut her away from the world, friends, family, anyone who can influence her in any way and therefore is not a threat to his control....and I agree he does provide her with material things...so that if she does not do what he wants he can throw it back in her face and make her feel guilty about it....

you chose the right word when you called this type of man insidious, for he is that and much more....and he is also very cunning, manipulative, and sneaky...

many times you will hear professionals explain this type of behaviour with excuses such as....he/she knows no better, this is normal behaviour, it was done to him/her....and it's all a great big cop out....if it happened to you, then you know how much it hurt and you know you should never make another person suffer the same fate...they weren't born this way...they choose to be this way...and their excuses don't mean a **** thing...

K

Originally posted by kemetstry
No Virginia, women have never been sugar and spice and everything niceI hope you don't have a daughter, for this statement alone (to her) could be considered abuse. And if you really feel this way, it could only manifest itself in your behaviour. Wow Kemetstry, if I didn't know better, I'd think you hated women. :confused:

I see we are right back to lumping all of us
the same.....I for one have never been
attracted to controlling men.
I have never been attracted to weak men,
if a man or woman's eyes are open, these type of people
show red flags long before you fall in love with them.
It is a personal preference or they have gotten
themselves into a relationship, that was easier to get into then get out. That preference I'm sure is not shared by " ALL" women.
I think you get the ladies all riled up, when you
keep equating everyone together. That would be like saying all men are chauvinistic, woman-beating pigs and we should gather them all together and stone them.....now tell me....wouldn't that
get you a little bit teed. I think the word you might use is a
feminist. As I said before in every situation there is exceptions
to the rule......For the most part, in a reverse situation a man can walk away, the same for a woman, THO IT MIGHT BE A BIT DIFFICULT IF HE HAS HER BY HER NECK! If he chooses to get into a physical altercation with the woman (I know there are some cases where the woman has kicked the man's butt) I really don't believe she can physically do any damage to the man, unless she uses a weapon on him. I think the arguement on who does the abuse can go on and on, I agree with Kitana, that there is insecurity involved in both types of men, it may be to different extremes. I believe there is also insecurity and low self esteem in both parties involved.....whether it be the abuser or the victim of the abuse.
Both feed off of each other to enable the whole situation to continue.......so I believe each party in some perverse way is
fulfilling a need for the other.....Unlike you Kitana, I have seen
many cases, and Kem most of them have been male on female abuse. I have only experience two in reverse....and the physical attacks were mutual.
Whether it is reverse or not.....it is a toxic relationship that,
if not salvageable should be ended, for the couples sake and if they have kids, the kids sake.......thanks Kitana, Destee, Amun_ra and Kem for sharing your views, appreciate it.


Epiphany :heart:

Kemetstry ... as I think back over your comments in other discussions, you usually find an opportunity to say something negative regarding women in general. Obviously this is your "truth." I feel for anyone who consistently talks negatively about another whole group of individuals. In my opinion, it speaks volumes about them and not the group they're demeaning. Nonetheless, you're entitled to your "truths."

Ephiphany, I apologize for not addressing you in my previous post. Great topic. My son recently told me about a young girl (17) that has a boyfriend (18) who beats on her. When he saw it, he made dude stop. My son said that she was recently kicked out of her mother's home (still in high school) and was living w/an aunt. This young man takes her to work, takes her to school, picks her up from both and constantly abuses her (mentally, verbally and physically). Later that same night, the young lady came to my son's apartment door, looking for her boyfriend. He normally picks her up from work, but this night only his truck was in the parking lot, he was nowhere to be found. She had a co-worker bring her to my son's apartment, thinking he might be there. When my son told her that he wasn't there and asked if she needed a ride home, she said no, that she would go back to the parking lot and wait for him there.

It broke my heart to hear this.

I have never had a man hit me, nor have I ever had to wonder if I had my mother's complete love and support. I can't imagine either, let alone be living both at the same time.

Women being fought by men is nothing new. I imagine feeling dependent has a lot to do with it. I think too that each feeds off the other in some weird way (at least in those instances where it happens continually). I don't know the answer Epiphany, but it breaks my heart to see and hear of such things. I personally would much rather have the mental and verbal abuse, rather than the physical (at least I think, since I have very little experience with any kind).

In closing, I'd like to say to all the mothers and fathers reading this post, let's not set our children up to be abused by anyone.

Don't hate me cause I speak the truth. "....the sun only hurts your eyes because you've been in the darkness so long...."

all I can say to that is...don't leave the house without your shades.....

and stop putting words in my mouth and being sarcastic....I never said "women were all sugar and spice"....but as usual, to win the debate you will resort to your male chauvinistic tactics to make everything I say sound juvenile and silly....

well check out...

http://www.cnn.com/2000/US/05/17/intimate.violence.02/

and....

http://www.actabuse.com/dvstats_2.html#2

and then see if "your truth" really is truth....or is it "truth" only as you see it....

K

Destee, thats ok........I thank you again for stopping back.
Kitana... again, I appreciate you both for your comments.
Thanks Kitana, for the links......I wasn't surprised of the results.

As I read your post, I have a question for you two....
I have three sons and 4 brothers, if I knew my brothers
or sons were beating their women. They would not hear the
end of it from me.....I have stepped up many times, when I
felt my brothers were wrong, I didn't necessarily become
involved in the argument, but if you're wrong...you're wrong
and I gave them my opinion.
Which brings to mind my question, what about the
family members of the abusers who know their
siblings or sons are doing this yet....they do nothing?
Would you interfere if you had an abusive sibling or child?


Epiphany :heart:

Kemetstry....

Kitana. Wrong dear. As a matter of fact there is 30 years of data supporting that women are equally abusive.

your words....not mine....

I said I thought women would be abused more by men than vice versa..and you replied with the words above....

the links I gave show otherwise....and don't twist my words around to support your opinion...

and you may submit all you like...I do not hate men..I happen to be married to one, the mother of two, the daughter of one and the sister to four and have a good relationship with all..

but..... I do LOATHE men who abuse women or children in any form....and it has nothing to do with their gender, just their cowardly actions....

are you familiar with the saying...

"attack is the best defense?"......

K

In an answer to your question...
Would you interfere if you had an abusive sibling or child?....
Yes, I would....both of my sons are adults, and they have been raised to know that under no circumstances would I tolerate them being abusive in any way to their mate or child, or to anyone else for that matter...violence just is not the answer...and it may be a b/w view to have, but I think there is a wrong and a right...abuse is a wrong, so don't do it...it can be that simple...

and if a sibling or their child was being abused... yes I would and have interfered...

my sister has lived with an abusive man for the last ten years...why she stays is beyond me, but she does...when they first got together he started abusing her two daughters, when I became aware of this, I intervened through the proper channels and as a result the two girls came to live with me for a year..
he got off scot free because he had no prior complaints or arrests against him...I took home two broken, traumatised little girls to look after...but they made it through...6 years on though they are still suffering from some of the after affects of having this happen to them....and they have found it very hard to get rid of the anger and hostility toward the abuser and their mother for not stopping him or leaving him....

In my past I have suffered most forms of abuse...and in my life now I am determined to turn it all around and to make sure I raised three children who are able to see the wrong in being abusive...sometimes they fall from grace and so do I ...getting angry and saying things we shouldn't, but that is all over in a few minutes and we do discuss it....

that is why I say that the excuses abusers constantly make, just don't cut it....the only way to stop the cycle is to stop the behaviour...and I know it's not easy, but it's well worth the effort to do it....being abused is not a good feeling, so why would you want to do it to another human being when you know how much it hurt you....

K

We all have one or two skeletons in our
closets we liked to forget they are there.
But it is there we leave it and chalk it up
as experience, not a deficit on intelligience.
Unfortunately, some of us learn and some of us don't
and this is where the problem lies. Its not really
a question of gender, but the problem at hand
be it man or woman.
Everything is not based on gender, but plain and
simple human nature......in every thread involving relationships, you seem to always come back to the battle of the sexes.
Personally, I really don't care who does it, my question is why?The results still has the same impact.
What in a person's psyche cause them to be the abuser
or the abused.....not which gender gets the beating the most.
I think the mutual understanding here is that it happens to both.
so, lets leave it at that......and concentrate on the why?
Everyone that replied came up with valid points, in every
discussion there will be disagreements, but the same
disagreements gets to be a little tiresome.
And the whole purpose of the thread, gets lost in the shuffling.
You know Kem, when you antagonize :nono:, you gonna get some fiery feedback:flame:.......perhaps, you enjoy the fireworks you let off...:bomb:...
Sittin back and crackin up at the display...:jumping: :lol:.........huh!
you sumpin else.......:cool:
Me don't protest.....me reads the nature of the thang! :idea:


Epiphany :heart:

and have tried to step in and would probably do it again bcz WRONG IS WRONG--doesn't matter if it's my brother or child.
I tried to interfere in my lil brother's biz a while back. My sis-n-law wasn't being physically abused, but basically my bro was disrespectful in many ways (ie:dog, hustler,manipulator) although we grew up together and he LEARNED how to treat others with respect..saw models with my mom and pop, etc, etc..so the **** about homelife, neighborhood, role models, examples and all that couldn't be used as an excuse. My sis-n-law was used to her mom sorta being used and she was also a little naive, too.
I tried to talk to him first, being that he's my kin and we've been close in the past,but he wasn't trying to hear it.. so I started getting to know her better. My 3 sisters and I sorta made it our "project" once we realized they were gonna stay together and she was pregnant. It took abt 5 years, but she decided to move on and is doing well. She decided she wanted something better. (Hell!!I'm proud of her and she has my full support)
My brother has found a new "one." (a little younger, little different, but basically the same type.) It's something I have to say I don't really understand--read a lot about abuse, have probably been in at least one emotionally/mentally abusive relationship, but still don't really get the part about staying in it and what can be done. My gut feeling is that it has to do with self-esteem...self worth..sometimes finances...so much that you can't give a person and that they can't/won't accept unless they're ready.
On the other hand, looking at my bro's new wife who ALREADY had several kids and they have new one 2gether, I wonder if I wanna say anything again...it's hard on this side, too....

I believe the blue ribbon for generalisations (against women) is firmly clutched in your hands....

"agitate, agitate, agitate"....disturb or excite, stir up public opinion for or against something....yeah, you sure do agitate well..

but I don't take your agitation to heart Kem....I like to debate an issue and whatever I feel stays here in this room...and my opinion is just that, my opinion....

you know Kem, I think you receive great enjoyment from agitating...kinda reminds me of a big ole cat sittin beside a bowl of cream, just lappin it up and havin fun doin it....

and I won't say anything about your "imagined ones (generalisations) about women," than this...if you read over your well chosen words and others responses to them you will see it is not just me, who has imagined that you are generalising against women....

but then all the same conclusions were drawn by other women...and what do we know?

K

Was not this thread about why people stay in abusive relationships? I sat on the side line reading others view points and waited for the thread to take the usual Kem Detour.....and as predicted, it did. I'm kinda feeling like Ms. Cleo. :laugh:

I think no one really knows or understands why.... except the abused. Especially when some continue to find partners who abuse them. I know I'll never understand. It has to hurt like hell.....I've been accidently poked in the eye before and it hurt like hell.....I can only imagine what a fist with the force of a man's strength behind it feels like in the eye. You would think that all the horrific reports on domestic violence ending in death would help them see how dangerous it is to stay, but only they and God know the answer. The sad part in all of this is, the children who don't have a choice, but to stay and suffer the damaging effects of the violence and the possibility of continuing the abuser or abused cycle.
I agree with others...I wouldn't sit back and allow my family or friends to abuse their mates without some form of intervention.

I have a request.....How about we start a thread on, uhm...lemme see, uhm.....I got it....Dew On A Blade Of Grass. Do you think that topic will take the usual Kem Detour? :laugh:

Madd Sistahly Love :heart:
CCBSKYN

Being that I'm not a.........


manipulative :shades:
argumentative :argue:
patronizing :yawn:
egotistical :yo:
contradictory :rolling:..........person :)


I only have one thing to say..............NO COMMENT! :wink:

Oops......did I say dat....:love:


Epiphany :heart:

Lets see now where were we.......

Oh yes, Why?


Destee Kem, Kitana, Amirah and Coco

You have enlightened the topic,
I guess we can probably get a
better understanding from those who
actually experience this........Coco
I'm with you, I couldn't imagine that
kind of pain inflicted on me either.
I came to the reckoning very young
not to be involve in that kind of
relationship....verbal or otherwise.
I think a lot of people don't realize
that they themselves control how
they are treated in a relationship....
But you can't let one slap, one verbal
attack go, it has to be nipped in the bud.
When you give up the power of self,
you open the door for the abuser
to take control.
They can't do it unless you allow it.


Epiphany :heart:

you'll have to be more specific.....

if we are going to discuss dew on a blade of grass, then we have to take into account....the type of grass....how big the blade of grass is...the weather conditions at the time....and the location of the blade of grass....

these are all important points of information which may affect our response to this topic....:x: :x: :x:

I totally agree...you are only a victim if you allow yourself to be one....

k

why!!
the answer hide under one's soul
men & women both can be abusive

no one is a punching bag !
any man that hit a woman is a cheap
punk! he's no man

any woman who hit a man is a sorry
witch she's no woman
but at all cost we do fight and ****!
why!
well the answer yet told!!
why do the other stay in it
can it be love of heart
or love of emotions
but some do stay some leave
some wait too late before death
set in the reality is it happens and seem like
we yet have a answer to this on going thing!

Now........thats another good question.......


Love??????????

But do I love you
if I do physical and emotional damage to you?


Love: The difinition of this emotion is........


1. A deep TENDER, ineffable(incapable of being describe)
FEELING of AFFECTION and SOLICITUDE (state of care or being
concerned for another) TOWARD ANOTHER PERSON.

2. Beloved (to love, DEARLY LOVED)


love has been described and enacted in may ways
but in this definition, it doesn't refer to any exceptions
of hurting, attacking or provoking violence.


Abuse: The definition is........

1. To use wrongly or improperly, misuse
2. To HURT or INJURE by maltreatment (bad)
3. To assail ( attack VIOLENT BLOWS) contemptuous,
course or INSULTING WORDS.
4. To DECEIVE or trick

Now, I think the facts speak for themselves, it is in total
contradiction of each other........


You can't possibly love someone, with these 4 equations
going on at the same time.......


Just thought I'd do a quick research $RICH$, thanks for
the inspiration and your comment.........


Epiphany :heart:

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Dew On A Blade Of Grass

if we are going to discuss dew on a blade of grass, then we have to take into account....the type of grass....how big the blade of grass is...the weather conditions at the time....and the location of the blade of grass.... :lol:

Let's not forget the statistics ladies! :nono: 2+2 must = 4!
It has been proven that what appears to be dew is actually the inconsiderate, indecent act of WOMEN not taking the time to find a public restroom, and instead, relieving themselves on public grass in the wee hours of the morning! It has very little to do with the weather conditions! Let's not get this twisted!

LOL :lol:

now back to our regularly scheduled program ... :lol:

yall are too funny !!!

I'd definitely say something to my son, brother and the victim, at least once. I've done it before (addressed those that I knew was the victim of abuse). My experience has been that they stay anyway, in spite of anything I have to say about it. I guess they have to get tired of it.

Now that was tooooooo funny, I'm crackin up ova heah.

Inconsiderate, indecent women........tinkling on the grass

Shame on them!


Lets find them and have them
tarred and feathered.....:lol:


:toast: on this one Destee


Epip....:heart:

they do piss out side and i see it too
nothing but butt in the air !!!

shame on them
and there booty
grasshopper bite....:lol:


Epip.......ya research is all good
i agree wit ya 100%:heart:

just glad i was learned to keep
my handz to myself til she get
undressed then look out!!!:D
touchie touchie ....!!

We work well together.:D

Destee......you da funna one. You had me crack'n up :laugh: And I thought...... there was......NOWAY! a woman could be tied to, dew on a blade of grass......and then you come up with away.....I think you've been spending tooooooo much time with Kem.....YOU HAVE BEEN BRAINWASHED!!! Quick! Lets get her in a 12 step deprograming program before we lose her completely. :D


$RICH$, That was funna.... grasshopper bites OUCH! LMBO :laugh:

Madd Sistahly Love :heart:
CCBSKYN

get out your fishin line and reel me in, cause I'm gonna bite....

you are in a state of confusion or is it denial....:confused:

Destee was just reminding us of the statistics, not saying that we women were believers of the equation:rolleyes:

and I'll have to disagree..as you knew I would, about your little faces with the comments beside them...how about we change them to.....

Kem....:martian: ...must be floating around in space if he thinks he is right all the time!!!!

Epiphany..Destee..Coco and Kitana..are sitting back :jumping:
and acting like little :angel: and :lol: at Kems comments....

and we've already given our opinion on the answer to the topic...
really kem, you should pay more attention to what us women have to say..:wink:

:jumping: GET'EM KEM!!!!! GET'EM!!!!:jumping:

***running around with a KEMET FOR PRES banner***

ducking the :uzi: from da women's circle that has grown in da room...

:D

But guess what.... Kem do have a sensitive side....
read his poem, could it be hes, softening a bit....just a little.
makes you say......hmmmmmmm? :confused:


Lol@Kitana......:toast:


Kem.....I'm done, this horse is dead...you lil teddy bear..:love:

One mo gin I appreciate the replies.



Epiphany :heart:

Grasshopper bite.....thats good....:toast:

I bet she melts wit dem touchies too :lol:

The abused remain in the abusive situation because they feel trapped. No amount of wise advise can convince them that there is a way out. For those who have gotten in too deep with someone too deranged, there is in fact almost no way out. Some abusers are deranged enough where they will indeed kill the abused if the abused would leave them. They will do everything they can to track down the abused (making it their life's mission), and take fatal revenge. So that is one sense of feeling trapped. Others simply are desperate. They feel such a strong sense of self-loathing, self-pity or low self-confidence that they feel the abuser is the best mate they can get, or perhaps even the only person near who would want to be with them. They may feel trapped because there are children involved, and they do not know how they would take care of the children without the mate (without the mother or without the father). Some feel trapped by their religion, which prohibits divorce for any reason (or for any reason aside from infidelity).

No one on Earth (male or female) is 100% self-confident, and it is not a tough task to discover another person's weakness or a vulnerable area of their self-esteem and to manipulate that weakness to break them down. This is as easy for women as it is for men. Men have weaknesses as well as women, and women most definitely take advantage of men's weaknesses when they find it necessary.

Although I have never initiated mental or verbal abuse, I personally have shot men straight down with words in response to their attempts at breaking me down. Clearly, they were injured by the mere words and verbal indictments. I have allowed myself to be broken down slightly by a male (once and once only). But past family experiences with domestic violence taught me early on how not to allow any man to break me down. Especially when he is far from perfect himself. I believe it is men and women who have become convinced in the past that they have low worth, who are the ones who find it difficult to get away from or steer clear of abusive relationships. This is why it is so important to teach children their value and to know who they are and what good they are deserving of.

Not to reinstate the debate on the topic, but it is not news that men are abused just as well as are women. They are the nice men that decent women would love to love, but that always wind up in the clutches of manipulating, overly agressive, domineering women. Oftentimes, they are passive or even bashful men who are initially attracted to and in admiration of the woman's assertiveness and uninhibitedness.

A female cousin married such a man, and wound up treating him like sewage, including physically abusing him. She has done everything from giving him various ultimatums, withholding intercourse for extended periods of time, turned him against his mother and sister, etc. An old schoolmate dated a similar guy in college, and she abused him physically and mentally to the point where he finally left her. She even vandalized his car and harassed both him and his mother. He had to take out a restraint order on her. It is easy to say that women are not as strong physically, but women can punch, kick, scratch, spit, bite, strike with objects and do just about everything else demeaning and violent toward men as men can do. Generally speaking, men probably can do the most physical damage, but not all men can bring themselves to physically restrain or disable an out of control woman, and some simply do not have the physical strength to overpower some women. I know men who have custody now of their children because the wife was abusive to both.

Abusers are generally those people, male and female who feel that they have never been given the attention they needed or deserved from adults of the opposite sex. They take their anger toward a particular woman or man out on their mate, and on each new mate with whom they become involved. It is a viscious cycle that can only be checked through stringent rehab of some sort, possibly including hypnotherapy.

I thank you for your comments
and btw, I have read a few of your
comments on other threads and I am impressed by your
candor and honesty.....welcome to the family :wave:
and I look forward to reading more of your wisdom....


Epiphany :heart:

My pleasure, dear Sister. Amani kwako.

Thank you for the welcome, Kemetstry.

honesty & respect is da key
many yet learn this and blame others

Sometimes they stay because that's all they now. We on the outside looking in can easily say girl why don't you leave or you need to just go. We are not in their shoes.

Once a person allows themselves to be dominated by another for years and years, it's hard to go back to be strong and independant. A lot of people male and female are dependant on their abusers. It's comfortable for them to endure than to start over. Yes men are abused too. Mentally,emotionally, and believe it or not physically. Their abusers are master brainwashers. They use fear tactics too in order for them to stay.

Also, I think a lot of folk feel an unwarranted obligation to stay. It's how they were taught growing up, stick through it no matter what (abuse, whatever). Also, they often feel (especially women) that all the time they have spent in the messed up relationship is time they don't want to have wasted by starting over. The thing is, the time was not wasted, it was a learning experience.....if you will allow it to be that.

I've been accused by a couple of exes (who were CONSTANTLY &%@#ing up) of being unwilling to work through difficult times. Both of them have parents who are still married, with the mothers being women who have stuck through years of everything from alcoholism to physical abuse. The husband staying away from home for days at a time. Gambling and drinking the income away. I've also been given that "all relationships have their ups and downs" bs. Well OUR relationship had nothing but DOWNS! Nothing BUT hard times! C-ya!

not all da tyme some just move too fast
some move with no thinking cap and
some do have their share of ups & downs
but understanding & honesty will take care
of it in most case we need to be more aware
of whom we deal wit and give time to know da mate
before u jump into marriage or be wed for a life bond
we have lost touch wit the true reality of da vows
under GOD'S watchful eye.....

Kemetstry-

How about I give YOU another chance at amusing me?

:rolleyes::o