Peace and Blessings Family,

As i watch these MSNBC prison documentaries, i see so many Black people working in them ... the overseers of the prisoners (slaves). It's us.

Now, i aint mad at no bodee who has to work and raise their Families, taking whatever job they can get. I understand this part, but can't help but look beyond that, to the historical parallel that is now before us.

They have us watching each other, and reporting to them, about us.

We all know that Black Men are overwhelmingly, disproportionately incarcerated.

I'd love to talk with a Sister or Brother that actually works in one of these maximum security prisons. If you are that person, or knows someone, that may be willing to join us in a class here ... sharing what it's really like inside ... please contact me (http://destee.com/forums/sendmessage.php)!

If you are not willing to get on the mic and talk to us about it, please, just join and share in this thread. We don't have to depend entirely on MSNBC, or any other media outlet, when we are the ones inside, keeping watch over our Sisters and Brothers.

I know yall aren't probably really allowed to talk, tell stuff, so we'll respect that and only go as far as you're able.

:heart:

Destee

Blacks working in prisons is a positive thing. Who else would you want to have mentor our lost young black men. Would you rather have white men do it? I have a step son who is currently in training to become a corrections officer. My former wife is a supervisory corrections officer of almost twenty years, and she is extremely proud of the fact that she does the work that she does, and have helped as many young black men as she has. I work in law enforcement also, and have done a lot for some our young black men. These men are in jail because they, in most instances, are not capable of living in society without being menaces to it. Even with all of the ones we now have in penal system, the black community is not safe, and there are very few examples of law abiding black males to set examples for other young black men to follow, without the incarceration option, the black community would be under marshall law.

The correctional officers job is not to oppress these young men, but to encourage them to learn to read and to learn a skill so that they can become productive and law abiding citizens. Unfortunately, many of these young men don't really want any help, and are hell bent on causing as much disruption to the general peace as possible. Those people are not deserving of any more consideration than they have been given already by the court system.

There are numerous programs available to these young men, to enable them to avoid the traps that landed them in trouble in the first place. There are opportunities for concerned people, like those on this site, to volunteer to help these young men by providing reading lessons to some, religious services, cultural lessons etc. It is mostly the uneducated and illiterate who end up there. Since our people are represented in disproportionate numbers, than it is high time that we do something about it ourselves, and stop seeing this as some kind of enslavement system. If you visit prisons in the mid west i.e., Iowa, Montana, Idaho, Arkansas etc., you will see very few black faces, but you will see the same attitudes and circumstances that bring about these results.

We need to do something about this now, it is our problem, largely the result of neglecting to educate our boys, to monitor their behavior and to give them reasons to be black and proud. Nothing will happen until we stop blaming the white man and start taking responsibility for our communites

Peace and Blessings Family,

As i watch these MSNBC prison documentaries, i see so many Black people working in them ... the overseers of the prisoners (slaves). It's us.

Now, i aint mad at no bodee who has to work and raise their Families, taking whatever job they can get. I understand this part, but can't help but look beyond that, to the historical parallel that is now before us.

They have us watching each other, and reporting to them, about us.

We all know that Black Men are overwhelmingly, disproportionately incarcerated.

I'd love to talk with a Sister or Brother that actually works in one of these maximum security prisons. If you are that person, or knows someone, that may be willing to join us in a class here ... sharing what it's really like inside ... please contact me (http://destee.com/forums/sendmessage.php)!

If you are not willing to get on the mic and talk to us about it, please, just join and share in this thread. We don't have to depend entirely on MSNBC, or any other media outlet, when we are the ones inside, keeping watch over our Sisters and Brothers.

I know yall aren't probably really allowed to talk, tell stuff, so we'll respect that and only go as far as you're able.

:heart:

Destee


Sis DESTEE..........

(Check this out: Legalized Corporate Slavery: A Sick and Twisted Reality)

If YOU love ME, then Love ME right--if not

then....Love what I say-----

http://www.***************/knowledge/justice/?url=Legalized-Corporate-Slavery-A-Sick-Twisted-Reality-11.html

'Cause I'M ALWAY'S

ROARIN.............

HETEPU

Blacks working in prisons is a positive thing. Who else would you want to have mentor our lost young black men. Would you rather have white men do it? I have a step son who is currently in training to become a corrections officer. My former wife is a supervisory corrections officer of almost twenty years, and she is extremely proud of the fact that she does the work that she does, and have helped as many young black men as she has. I work in law enforcement also, and have done a lot for some our young black men. These men are in jail because they, in most instances, are not capable of living in society without being menaces to it. Even with all of the ones we now have in penal system, the black community is not safe, and there are very few examples of law abiding black males to set examples for other young black men to follow, without the incarceration option, the black community would be under Marshall law.

The correctional officers job is not to oppress these young men, but to encourage them to learn to read and to learn a skill so that they can become productive and law abiding citizens. Unfortunately, many of these young men don't really want any help, and are hell bent on causing as much disruption to the general peace as possible. Those people are not deserving of any more consideration than they have been given already by the court system.

There are numerous programs available to these young men, to enable them to avoid the traps that landed them in trouble in the first place. There are opportunities for concerned people, like those on this site, to volunteer to help these young men by providing reading lessons to some, religious services, cultural lessons etc. It is mostly the uneducated and illiterate who end up there. Since our people are represented in disproportionate numbers, than it is high time that we do something about it ourselves, and stop seeing this as some kind of enslavement system. If you visit prisons in the mid west i.e., Iowa, Montana, Idaho, Arkansas etc., you will see very few black faces, but you will see the same attitudes and circumstances that bring about these results.

We need to do something about this now, it is our problem, largely the result of neglecting to educate our boys, to monitor their behavior and to give them reasons to be black and proud. Nothing will happen until we stop blaming the white man and start taking responsibility for our communities



I'M terrified of this entire missive. There isn't a single light-bulb or,
thought behind it.

What's wrong with a proud Afrikan Jegna over-seeing OUR Sons?
Are WE that afraid of SANKOFA? Do WE even know what that means?

If the knowledge is readily available then, why are'nt WE held to this standard?

Opposite of euro-beliefs, Black Men ARE real.

ROARIN..........

It is well known,that correctional facilities don't rehabilitate,so chances of the workers becoming dehumanize themselves could and does happen.

Peace!

DELETED BY AUTHOR

It seems that Black folks just keeping FEELING BAD about all of these situations that impact our community. "FEELINGS" don't change anything! It's "ACTIONS" that change things. If we want things to change, enough of us are going to have to ACT differently and change things.

Seems that so many Black folks keep thinking that our problem is mainly outside of us, whereas the problem is mainly inside of us, as individuals and inside the black community. They couldn't exploit young black men in prison if the young men didn't go into prison in the FIRST place. This is like going into a hungry bear's cave and expecting it not to eat you. No, that bear is going to eat you EVERY time.

These young boys and young men need GROWN BLACK MEN to intervene in their lives or they are going to continue to go into the bear's cave. You can bet money on that and this is why people are pumping their money into prison building, operating, and maintenance businesses and buying shares in those companies. It's one of the most profitable investments.

By now, there could have been at least 5000 big and small groups of Black men that came together and ORGANIZED as a result of all of the men talking here on Destee's--to become the physical on-the-spot intervention that these young males need in a lot of communities across this country. Instead, so many Black men here just continue to TALK and point the finger at the hungry bear!! and complain that the bear is eating young black males as if this comes a shock. :lol: I've noticed that when the men are not pointing the finger at the bear, they usually try to blame Black women for the bear eating the boys.

When are the Black MEN in this country going to STEP UP? Black men need to start pointing the finger AT EACH OTHER and stop giving each other a pass on all of this!! Males control other males. You can't expect the bear not to eat the children and you cannot expect the women to control the males. Check it out. Males control other males in every society or group.

Hmmm......

So, for a Black Man to have been 'framed' is a complete and
total myth?

There are criminals in every 'race,' but the likelyhood of a
Black Man having been falsely imprisoned has never been an
issue?

Obviously if WE go to jail WE must be guilty and subject to being 'eaten.'

Of course the amerikan prison industrial complex cannot be
manipulated or, biased against the Black Community because
of it's perfection.

Maybe I should hurry and forward this information to MUMIA JAMAL
or ASSATA SHAKUR cause somebody needs to wake them up.

Hmmm....

ROARIN......

Number 1 - The Predominant amount of Blacks locked up are someway/somehow relative to Socio-Political Agendas contrived by "you know who..." in this Nation.

Number Two: As I mentioned in my previous post, I stated:

The name of the exact Program/Corporation escapes my Mind at the moment, but there IS Program existing (forgot the name) whereby Prisoners work for $2.15/hr., while the Government is being paid (or paying) $1,000,000+!

I think the name is UNICORPS, but I will do more Research.

KD

There is nothing wrong with unicor, which is a federal prisons program that produces goods, mostly for the government. Inmates are not forced to work in any programs, educational or otherwise. Those that volunteer to participate in something productive are rewarded with freedom once they are released from prison. That is because they have acquired a skill that will enable them to gain employment. While in prison, the government spends about $40,000 per year, per inmate. What is wrong with the inmate paying part of the cost of their incarceration? I pay enough at that rate, and so do you. Crime and incarceration is expensive. Some countiries require families of inmates to pay the cost. Maybe if we did that here, the problem would be solved. I watched the MSNBC series on this, most of the inmates participating in this programs were white and happy they volunteered to do so.

Keep in mind that we are talking about people who have committed the worst kinds of crimes against their own people. Rape, murder, serious assault, robbery of all kinds, drug dealing, failure to pay child support etc. These are not the pillars of the community. I've seen criminal records dating back to age 13 and younger consisting of ten pages or more. Many have already been in jail five and six times, without any attempt at rehabilitation. The prison system will not and cannot help a person who doesn't want it, that is why these programs are voluntary. As many as seventy percent will become career criminals which basically mean that will cycle in and out of jail. Some are not out even a month before they get arrested again.

The government cannot raise these kids, that is the parents responsibility. The government will lock your butt up once you have been given the typical ten chances to straighten up your behavior. Religion and philosophy is not what the government is about. The public outcry is to have these people taken off the streets, and that is why we have law enforcement.

As i watch these MSNBC prison documentaries, i see so many Black people working in them ... the overseers of the prisoners (slaves). It's us.

Now, i aint mad at no bodee who has to work and raise their Families, taking whatever job they can get. I understand this part, but can't help but look beyond that, to the historical parallel that is now before us.

They have us watching each other, and reporting to them, about us.


WTH!! You sound like your talking about innocent kidnapped and physically tormented slaves on a plantation picking cotten, we're talking about convicted criminals, murders, thugs, robbers and druggies. (speaking about 90% guilty in prison, not the 10% innocent) So what 'slave' overseers? I'm sorry but thats backwards spin talk. I could care less about what goes on in prison, because, I'm not there, nor do I associate with people that could land me there from guilt by association. Prison is suppose to be a very ugly place for you to think about BEFORE you commit the crime. I have a cousin in prison for murder, I hope it's rough for him, I hope he hates every day he has to wake up. He took his girlfriends life, an innocent girl, while he was high and on drugs. I love him, but it's not about blaming everyone else, he did it, he killed her so he needs to have freedoms taken from him, he needs to live miserable. He TOOK AN INNOCENT LIFE FOR CHRIST SAKE. I could care less who snitches on him, or who is yelling at him 'times up, hang up the phone'. He's not on vacation, I don't visit him, and won't because, he needs to know pain, on any level because none of it equals the pain her family is living with loosing their beautiful daughter. She was a very, very loving girl, what he did he deserves every bit of misery he gets. I can dish out justice and still love my cousin. Because I believe very much in owning up to your actions, being in charge of YOUR destiny.
So lets stop portraying our "brothas' in prison like poor ole' fiddler from roots.
Before you go there, yes, there are more white folks that should be in prison and are not, but that doesn't mean I need to run out get ignorant and take their place and keep their cell nice and warm for them until the ''whiteman' decides to lock up his cousins.

Ehem.....

Had anyone takin the time to actually click on the article link I
provided in MY first post, you couldv'e seen that the article was
talking expressly about Unicor and it's influences.

There's even a direct line to the president of Unicor (e-mail )
attached, for those courageous enough to contact him to
express your distaste. (pend.)

However, not only Unicor, but there are several other private
entities (Ford motor Co, Nordstrom ect.) along with even the U.S.
Military that are current benefactors of prison 'labor.'

Now for some, this may be alright however, I thought the purpose
of this thread was to show collusion on the part of an already twisted
american ideology and economic system of capitalism that is yet
determined to keep OUR People as 'slaves.'

This IS proof positive.

Again, no one is excusing criminals, they exist
in all 'races,' however the continued crimes of america are still bigger
than the individual, if WE are to judge, then it behooves US to 'judge'
correctly.

And finally I submit that it is the very 'badge' of america, that ought to be on trial. Cause, since when does the pot call the kettle BLACK?



ROARIN..........

[QUOTE=mrron]Blacks working in prisons is a positive thing. Who else would you want to have mentor our lost young black men.

I personally, historically and consciously consider this to be an insult. However, let me slow this down a little. The idea that so many young black men are in prison is not only the result of a well thought out and structured ant-black male plan...but it is a business. The original plan was not for black males initially, it was for black women. This is thoroughly researched and documented in a work by Dr. Charshee McIntyre entitled: "Criminalizing a Race".

1. The accelerated rate and pace of incarcerating and criminalizing our young did not occur until Jimmy Carter's "Global 2000 speech" whereby he outlined to the European world that "They were fast becoming a minority and that by the year 2000 the darker races would begin to out-number them."

2. Prior to this speech, you could not find guns and the proliferation of drugs in our communities. Prior to this there was no such thing as a minor being charged as an adult. Prior to this there was no wall street based prison complex that you could buy stocks in. Prior to this there was no large body of African American officers working in the penal system.

3. The idea that it is a business that "officers and politicians" who have any brains have bought stock in as a viable "money making entity" with privitization and products to boot, also means that no one politically or otherwise is going to be about the business of doing "anything that's going to take money out of their pockets" like finding alternatives for the revolving wheel that now no longer houses "grown men as it once did, but our children".

4.Since it cost more a year to keep a person in prison than for them to go to college, someone is clearly dealing with sound economics with a gauranteed return on their investment.

5. The idea that African American ofiicers are their keepers is no different than the "over-seer on the plantation"...they were black too, and just like the black officers, they had to report to and do the unpleasant chores that master said to do to his own people.

Would you rather have white men do it? I have a step son who is currently in training to become a corrections officer. My former wife is a supervisory corrections officer of almost twenty years, and she is extremely proud of the fact that she does the work that she does, and have helped as many young black men as she has. I work in law enforcement also, and have done a lot for some our young black men.

I did not want to skip over this, for if you have indeed helped any of them then you are a rarity and need to be commended for maintaining some humanity. This however is not the norm. Just as the "over-seer" was trained and conditioned by master on the plantation, so too are the African American officers who come into the system to work. The first thing they are taught is to "seperate themselves from the fact that they are black and the people incarcerated are black. Black does not exist..."they are CRIMINALS, point blank ! Do you want the speech?

"These are the same ones out there breaking into your homes that you work hard to buy. These are the same ones selling drugs to your children as they are going to school. These are the same ones out there robbing and snatching your mothers purses and raping your daughters and wives". This is the "First Phase" of being conditioned and alienated from self and color.

Second Phase: Master has to see if you can kick some black @ss and hopfully impress him with your ability to do your job the way they want it done. In other words, " they want proof that your being black and the person you're about to beat down being black doesn't mean anything to you".


These men are in jail because they, in most instances, are not capable of living in society without being menaces to it. Even with all of the ones we now have in penal system, the black community is not safe, and there are very few examples of law abiding black males to set examples for other young black men to follow, without the incarceration option, the black community would be under marshall law.

I almost convinced myself that you were somewhat "conscious and socially understanding in terms of WHAT IS REALLY GOING ON AND WHY, UP UNTIL I READ THIS PART !! Truth be told: "Their society is a menace to them and they are but pawns caught up in the game, the miseducation, the racism, the structured enviroment they did not create and...oh, I almost forgot, " the idea that when they wake up each day, they can see black doctors, officers, teachers, dentist, business owners and every other productive Black male role model as an example for them in their lives...or did they all move out the communities leaving the babies no other images of inspiration or anything else to see? HHhhmm....I wonder!?


The correctional officers job is not to oppress these young men, but to encourage them to learn to read and to learn a skill so that they can become productive and law abiding citizens. Unfortunately, many of these young men don't really want any help, and are hell bent on causing as much disruption to the general peace as possible. Those people are not deserving of any more consideration than they have been given already by the court system.

What a scathing indictment of our young! The system, the court, the community. Listen...If I had my way, I wouldn't change any of their negative feelings and thoughts or actions, cause truth be told, they have a divine right to feel and think and act the way that they do...I would simply point them to the white community and the white businesses.


There are numerous programs available to these young men, to enable them to avoid the traps that landed them in trouble in the first place. There are opportunities for concerned people, like those on this site, to volunteer to help these young men by providing reading lessons to some, religious services, cultural lessons etc. It is mostly the uneducated and illiterate who end up there. Since our people are represented in disproportionate numbers, than it is high time that we do something about it ourselves, and stop seeing this as some kind of enslavement system. If you visit prisons in the mid west i.e., Iowa, Montana, Idaho, Arkansas etc., you will see very few black faces, but you will see the same attitudes and circumstances that bring about these results.

What would you call it if you learned that their option was to incarcerate us rather than allow us to be free? What would you call it if you learned that "the ratio of black men in prison today is the same ratio that it was in the times of Marcus Garvey"?


We need to do something about this now, it is our problem, largely the result of neglecting to educate our boys, to monitor their behavior and to give them reasons to be black and proud. Nothing will happen until we stop blaming the white man and start taking responsibility for our communites

I don't think we should call it "blaming the white man at all", a more appropiate term would be "hold accountable"...and that's the big big problem right there. We don't hold that white man or his system ACCOUNTABLE FOR WHAT THEY HAVE and ARE PRESENTLY DOING.


Please Wake up brother !!

Keita, I read your comments on my remarks. Not once did you mention cjduhon's reply, which was far more relevant to the issue than anything you had to say. What is your solution to black on black crime, dammit? You tell every body here that. If you don't want these dregs locked up, what do you want done? Should we release them all to your community? I know more about racism than you will ever know, but I don't give them the kind of credit you do, for having the kind of intelligence it would take to control the minds of our people, unless you just think we are mindless puppets. All black people are aware of racism, they hear about it and see it everyday. What is so new about what you are saying? Criminal behavior in most countries is treated far more effectively than it is here. This is a soft system, where seventy percent of the inmates who are released, go out and commit another crime, because life in prison is easier than it is in society.

These people have better medical, dental, eye care, food service, recreation, other options etc., than most working people do, and it's the working people who have to pay for their free ride. Their biggest problem is the gate surrounding the facility. The people they victimize are overwhelmingly black. You visit a black neighborhood, and you have to have three locks on all your doors. There are very few businesses because of the threat of crime, they have virtually shut the black community down. I watched a report today on the news about Philadelphia, a city I work in and live near. The crime rate there is totally out of control, black kids ages 12 and up are beating up school teachers as well as their peers. Is this okay with you? Yeah, I know your answer, it's all orchestrated by the white man, right? That's just a cop out, and gives you an excuse to do nothing.

Some of our people are so Afro centric, that they think everything that goes wrong in the world was aimed at them, and created by the white man, even hurricanes. No one is plotting anything against us except black nationalist who make outrageous accusations about what the white man is doing. You are creating a lot of paranoia with these sentiments you are expressing. No wonder little black boys don't think they have any reason to live and be peaceful. It's all of this foolishness that you are putting in their heads.

Who would you rather have as correctional officers? Prison is becoming a black community, predominantly, in some areas. There are no slave masters, you must have a "slave mentality" to begin with, to even think that way. I don't know any slave masters. If there are more black's in prison, than it makes sense to have more blacks running the place. If you go to Miami, Los Angeles, Houston etc., you will see more hispanic officers. I think people who call their own people slaves actually have an inferiority complex. In their minds, the white man is definitley their superior.

Kind of touchy when I present the facts, huh? Here I was giving up "documentation from slavery on down to the present and you chose to act as if it wasn't real. Wonder why? However, let me clear up something. Please don't buy into the media machine. Since we are only 12 to 13% of the population in this country, it stands to reason that there are more white people in prison than black. Now where do you think they commit their crimes? That's right, where they live...yet you don't hear jack about white on white crime, now do you?

So why the media FOCUS ON OURS??? All people commit crimes where they live and yet we are the only ones being highlighted by the media. Now what's up with that? That was as bad as people complaining that "black people live on welfare when reality states that more whites are on it than ours...yet again the highlight was on us placing a stigma where it didn't belong. I know Philly and Camden quite well and I understand the politics behind both of them. No where else could white people get a black mayor to bomb one of our own neighborhoods as if it was a war zone.

And as for your last statement on the white man's SUPERIORITY? The white man will never be superior to us any day of his existence, which is why I try not to use words like "white supremacy"...it's white domination not superiority. The truth of the matter is that we are so conditioned as a people that we are now imitating them 70 years later. Go back in time and see. They started the gangs, the territory street battles that our young are imitating 70 years later. They started the drive by killings on their own that our young are imitating 70 years later...and they once filled up the prisons that our young are now doing 70 years later. Come to think of it, we didn't even create any ghettos...our people inherited it from them when we migrated to the north from the south.

I know you're glad to have a job and to think that you're providing a viable service and all that, but then again...so did the black over-seers on the plantation.

Our children are not blind or dumb...we have abdicated our responsibility in favor of the dollar bill and living next to our oppressor and like them. They see it too. Then we have reactionaries such as yourself who like the fake doctor only "sees the disease and not the cause" and then incorrectly thinks that addressing the disease will cure it. Everything is Cause and Effect. Our children and our reality is the Direct Effect of a Cause that we as black people in this country try to sweep under a rug.

I'm not a black nationalist, I'm still the same disenfranchised African that was bought to this country via my ancestors...and by force. There's not enough money or jobs to make me forget this or what was actually taken from me (us) historically, culturally, socially, linguistically, spiritually and economically.

I started seeing during the vietnam war when I was drafted in the marines. prior to that I would say I was pretty darn blind and pretty darn Americanized. I think I see very clearly after having lived all over this country and over-seas. I know I see very well. what's interesting about my earlier write up is that I didn't lie not once and I really think that is why you got so emotional...you remember those conditioning and phases too, don't you?
It's nothing new, the military does it too. They are just bolder with theirs cause they'll let you know in a minute that if you have to you must kill your mother if she is a perceived threat to national security...I mean, "white security".

I don't have the exact figures in front of ME
however, (I'M actively searching for them again)

I had recently been sent some information regarding
the prison population of the world-- (someone help a Brother out
if YOU'VE gotten the same figures...) and it was eye-opening
to say the least.

Something like 3% of the worlds population is in jail, out of
the 6.5 billion people on the planet, 64% of these people are
jailed in amerikkka, 87% of these amerikkkan prisoners are BLACK.

If this is not disproportionate, for those whom may believe that
the vast majority of the amerikkkan prison population are whites,

I'VE got nothing else to say.

Again I'M searching for these numbers and when I find them,
I'LL post them here for clarity.

Meantime if YOU need immediate clarification of these 'facts,'
check'm for YOURSELF, they'r there.


ROARIN........

In the meantime......

(Courtesy of ***************)




New Underground Railroad Needed as Black Men Flee the Pursuit of the U.S. Justice System
Date: 02/19/2007
Hunted like runaway slaves, the Black male needs more support than ever from community leaders and leading Black gatekeepers instead of criticism and condemnation. As of December 2005, over 2 million prisoners occupy the U.S. Prison system, the largest incarceration rate in the civilized world, and at least 65% of those are Black males.


According to statistics from the U.S. Department of Justice, 3,145 Black males are sentenced per 100,000 Black men in the United States, compared to 1,244 Hispanic male inmates per 100,000 Hispanic males and 471 white male inmates per 100,000 white males. These numbers are astonishing as well as questioning.


At first conclusion, one would tend to believe that Black male imprisonment is more needed than any other race of males in the U.S., implying Black males are criminal at heart and destine for a life of incarceration. No man is born a criminal and not one is destine for incarceration, except in the unproductive practices of the U.S. justice system.


No more an institute for rehabilitation, the U.S. prison system has repositioned itself as a system of collecting and housing bodies as possessions of the state to be further used by bidding corporate entities for production of cheap product goods and services, in addition to providing rural families with employment.


Black men have become a commodity in this systematic market and little effort to change this system has been attempted by anyone; politicians, activist groups, churches, and especially Black leaders. Instead, Black men have to carefully watch their steps to avoid fitting the national profile for potential incarceration.


During slavery, when Blacks sought to escape the pursuit of the slave masters and catchers, our brave sister, Harriet Tubman, accompanied by others, devised an escape route called the Underground Railroad to assist runaways in their search for freedom. Today, a new Underground Railroad has to be put into place to help Black males avoid being ensnared in the trap set for them by the U.S. justice system.


Anger and despair engulfs many Back males today because of lack of supervision, family structure, guidance, and support from those who should support them most, such as fathers, teachers, neighbors and of course the Back woman. Yes, there is much temptation in the “hoods” but Railroad stations must be put into place by concerned Black community groups, preferably the churches that will divert and transform all the negative energy in Black males into positive energy.


No help or solutions will come from the political system or the justice system because it is those systems that hunt our Black men, so any effort to get attention from those systems would be a waste of time. Innovation in the form creative action from schools, families, and volunteer community groups would do more because it is these institutions that have a better understanding of the Black male than anyone.


Sadly, society and even the Black community itself have become complacent with what is happening to the Black male population and have seemingly given up, believing that Black men are of no use and hopeless. This is untrue, the problem is there are no institutions in this society that have acknowledge the problem and decided to take action to reverse the trend.


When an issue is treated as untreatable, then the issue will of course only get worse, but negative imagery of Black males in the U.S. society has gained a strength that only seems unbreakable, yet is not. Divine intervention is needed to break the yoke of persecution against Black men.


Black leaders must stop depending on politicians and political policies to end the struggle for Black equality and begin taking to the streets erecting Railroad stations that address the problems as needed, with love, power, and a will to defeat this modern day institution of U.S. re-enslavement of Black males.


CR Hamilton



http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/prisons.htm




ROARIN.......

This topic is about blacks working in prisons, not rehashng the history of slavery, or why more whites are not in prison. I really don't care about why there are not more whites in prison, I guess that is their problem, and they can handle it the best way they can. I will say this, I still see businesses florishing in the white community and property values are up. I don't see kids standing on the corner threatening and intimidating law abiding citizens that live in the community. They have massive drug problems, but it's in their house.

We need to be concerned about our community and the reasons that are kids are committing crimes in the first place. That is the problem that is leading to the prison population being what it is. All of this stuff about Unicor is irrelevant. The program is voluntary and is for those inmates who want to do something productive with their lives when they have served their time. The vast majority of people on this site say that they have or have had a relative in prison. Why not talk to them about the prison industrial system. Most prisons don't have the program. Most prisons don't really change inmates because they don't want to be changed. Most started disobeying authority at an early age, and can't be helped. No father around is a major factor. No family structure, no religious teaching, no respect for their own community. Let's face it, these are suppose to be men, who by definition, are suppose to build and protect their community, not destroy it. If all you can see is the white man behind the destruction, then you may as well throw your hands up in the air and give up, because they are not going to come in on a white horse and save us.

All of this research to try to prove what? That there are more black men in prison than their percentage in the population. We already know that, we don't really need details. The fact is they all, for the most part, committed a crime to get there, and that is a big facture.

The fact that I work in law enforcement doesn't influence my way of thinking at all, other than the fact that have have access to more valid information, which many people aren't really interested in, because truth is not on their agenda. The blacks working in prisons where there are black inmates, is far better than having all white faces. If it is not than explain why.

Notwithstanding the fact that most people seem to have not realized this topic is about Blacks working in maximum security prisons, and not general population prisons, there is only one question regarding it: Should no Black people work in prisons period? This question appears to have been toyed with, but not necessarily answered. I know Mrron has asked it a number of times, but with little success in getting a reply. So I challenge any and all to answer this question, because it is the only relevant question respecting the topic at hand.

In any case Destee I'm uncertain as to what your basic point is other than you see it problematical that our people work in prisons. If this is a correct understanding however, what do you propose should be done regarding Blacks working in prisons?

Notwithstanding the fact that most people seem to have not realized this topic is about Blacks working in maximum security prisons, and not general population prisons, there is only one question regarding it: Should no Black people work in prisons period? This question appears to have been toyed with, but not necessarily answered. I know Mrron has asked it a number of times, but with little success in getting a reply. So I challenge any and all to answer this question, because it is the only relevant question respecting the topic at hand.

Brother NeterHeru ... rarely, if ever, will there be only one (relevant) question that comes from a discussion started here. While your question is a good one ... Should no Black people work in prisons period? ... i never asked that, or even thought it, when creating this thread. I'm of the mindset that there will be Black People doing a little of everything, as always.

My query was to those who work in these jobs now. I was petitioning them to share with us, as i'm sure they have insight most don't have. I'd love to be privy to that, to have more information than MSNBC provides. That was my purpose for starting the thread. While the maximum security prisons are the ones featured on MSNBC most often, i'd be interested in listening to any Sister or Brother currently working where our people are incarcerated.

In an effort to answer your (and Brother MrRon's) question ... while i'd love for none of us to work within the system that oppresses us, that would probably mean none of us could work anywhere. That's not realistic.

In my opening post, i clearly said we can't be mad at these Sisters and Brothers for taking care of their families. It was not my intention to attack them, or any such thing. Quite the contrary, i'm welcoming them to join us ... here in the discussions or in a live voice chat session.


In any case Destee I'm uncertain as to what your basic point is other than you see it problematical that our people work in prisons. If this is a correct understanding however, what do you propose should be done regarding Blacks working in prisons?

No Brother, i don't see it as problematic. It's just our reality. It's been our reality for hundreds of years ... Black Folk watching over other Black Folk. It's really more a symptom of our lack of industry, business, economic opportunity, etc., for our people. If Black People could offer other Black People good paying jobs, they'd probably have to get more white people to man their prisons. For that matter, if we could offer each other jobs, fewer of our people would resort to illegal activities (selling drugs).

Nothing should be done about those that work in the prison system. If we are going to do something, i'd much rather we focus our attention on those locked up there ... or headed in that direction (http://destee.com/forums/showpost.php?p=456634&postcount=24).

Again, it is my hope that someone who works in such an environment, will share with us. In the meantime, as you can see, the discussion will go in a variety of different directions. That's okay with me! :)

Much Love and Peace.

:heart:

Destee

O.K. Maybe I missed the point.
However, it's never been automatic for ME
to assume OUR Brothers would voluntarily
engage in traitorous acts towards OUR People.

First off, to 'work' anywhere in amerikan law
enforcement from MY perspective, is a traitorous
act towards OUR People.

Even though I have a Sister who is a police officer
(high ranking at that,) I don't hate Her, I know Her
heart.

(But I also know the hearts of other police officers...and THEY ain't good!)

Still, job-hunting is a conscious act. And as adults,
I believe WE will still be held accountable for the choices
WE make.....no matter How WE plead 'WE were just trying
to survive.'

WE don't have to choose to perpetuate krakka dominion....ever.

Brother MrRon, even though I still would NEVER agree with a lot
YOUR'E saying......if YOU haven't noticed, this is the ROARIN ONES
way of trying to apologize...take it or leave it...YOU'VE made good
points as well.

(Under the circumstances.)


PEACE.

ROARIN.......

We need to be concerned about our community and the reasons that are kids are committing crimes in the first place

I wonder what your answer to this is?

Is it possible they are doing so because they have been "programmed" to do so?

Destee and Roarin, you have sort of put me on the defense, unnecessarily, of course. As a black male myself, I could also end up behind bars, if I committed a crime that landed me there. As such, and as one who knows the conditions that exist there, I would much rather serve my sentence under the guard of someone I feel understands me and my environment. This is not about oppression at all, its about recompense for breaking the law. I wish I had more answers than I do, we all suffer as black people when so many of our men are locked up. These were at one time our cute little boys. At some point and time they were failed by the school system, the community, the family especially the parents, the church, the leadership, the government etc. They, in many cases, ended up being raised on the streets by individuals who didn't have their best interest at heart. This is a big part of the problem. We can't indentify the problem, until we admit that it is us that is causing it. If we continue believing it is the white man doing it to us, it will never be resolved, because that is a lie.

Economics is why most people in this country work in jobs they don't like, white, asian, hispanic or black. I don't hear other groups claiming that they shouldn't work in certain jobs, because they are helping their oppressors. I really don't know what the job satisfaction rate is for corrections officers. I know at least twenty black officers who have worked in prisons for more than fifteen years, they all seem to like it, and I have never heard one say that they felt that they were helping the man keep our people down. Many of these young men credit correctional officers for putting them on the right track while they were in prison. Personally, I took a young man off the street ten years ago after he spent seven years in prison. I taught him how to work as a building contractor, got him a license and forced him to marry his girlfriend. I got him his first house. Now he's living the high life and credits me for putting him on the right track. That is only one person I have helped, there are many many more. Even on my job, I used to get called in to counsel young black men caught smuggling drugs into the country. Many could have been arrested and put in jail, but I would get them released and give them a lecture and advise them to continue their education, training etc., even refer them for jobs or training etc. There are many black Law enforcement officers who do exactly the same thing. There are white one's that do the same thing also. We still understand the need for incarceration, some people are beyond help, period. We are far more than overseers.

Destee and Roarin, you have sort of put me on the defense, unnecessarily, of course.

Brother MrRon ... what did i say (or do) that put you on the defensive?

:heart:

Destee

Destee, you stated that you would prefer that none of us worked for a system that oppresses us. That is what put me on the defense. I am not oppressing anyone. I am sure you have read my responses to this topic. I have worked in law enforcement for twenty years, and I have never had a black peron say to me that I was oppressing them. I am not a corrections officers, but in case you don't know it, most law enforcement officers are like frat brothers, regardless of the agency they work for.

Have you ever been robbed or assaulted? Or had a family member murdered? Would you want law enforcement involved or not? If so, would you rather that person be black or white? If white, why? If black, would that person be working for you or the oppressors system on the oppressors behalf?

Simply put, we need more black law enforcement officers to care for the black community, not less. You've already said that the white man is the oppressor, so why would you prefer that he protects your community? Or would you just rather do without protection, and allow the criminals to just take over?

I just found out that we have another black officer here at my job that came here from corrections, I'll ask if he will make a statement.

MrRon,

As I mentioned...from MY perspective, working in
amerikkkan law enforcement is as a traitorous act for
any of our people.

I can and do, speak only for MYSELF, therefore
(for clarity's sake,) kindly direct your question's
for ME to ME--and I will do MY best to answer.

Again, WE won't agree already on much at all so,
ask what YOU like however be prepared to be
challenged on most every point.


ROARIN........

I have only one question for you Roarin. Why do you bother to live in the United States? There are many other countries that you can migrate to, especially on the continent of Africa.

Oh! by the way. I am in no way a traitor to my people.

Well Bro. MrRon, one of the first lessons a WARRIOR
learns is that HE is required to meet HIS enemy face to face,
to defeat him.

A WARRIOR cannot slay HIS enemy via the telephone.

And in regard to your statement concerning being a traitor,
I never said YOU were, YOU called attention to that.

Now I couldv'e injected an extremely long diatribe here regarding
the u.s. and it's democracy being just an 'ideology,' or just a simple
experiment by psychotic white boy's from an era long since dead,
just like the prospects of their 'experiment' of 'e-pluribus-unum' itself, suffering a slow agonizing death from it's own hands, visible to the unsympathetic rest of the worlds communities, who themselves are simply looking at this failed amerikkan experiment as astonished, but that would probably
just go right over the heads of whom-ever else may have decided to
just stop by and read some of the dialogue being considered here.

So, I won't talk about how the founding of this 'nation' had never
even considered the 'inclusiveness' of any member of the Black Race
as a viable addendum to it's charter even when it was being formulated, therefore,
for any disincluded Black Man to aggressively attach himself to it's decaying credo, is but psychosis in it's final stages and is only fit for exploration by Black Researchers.

(Which someday, will be considered.)

Well, the fact is....BLACK NATIONALISM is a way of Life, but only true
BLACK NATIONALISTS are able to comprehend it's mechcanics and it is
opposite amerikkka. Dig?


HETEPU

ROARIN.........

Destee, you stated that you would prefer that none of us worked for a system that oppresses us. That is what put me on the defense. I am not oppressing anyone. I am sure you have read my responses to this topic. I have worked in law enforcement for twenty years, and I have never had a black peron say to me that I was oppressing them. I am not a corrections officers, but in case you don't know it, most law enforcement officers are like frat brothers, regardless of the agency they work for.

Have you ever been robbed or assaulted? Or had a family member murdered? Would you want law enforcement involved or not? If so, would you rather that person be black or white? If white, why? If black, would that person be working for you or the oppressors system on the oppressors behalf?

Simply put, we need more black law enforcement officers to care for the black community, not less. You've already said that the white man is the oppressor, so why would you prefer that he protects your community? Or would you just rather do without protection, and allow the criminals to just take over?

I just found out that we have another black officer here at my job that came here from corrections, I'll ask if he will make a statement.

Brother MrRon ... i'm not a historian by any stretch of the imagination, so can you tell me, what other people besides us ... Africans in America ... have remained living intimately with the same people that killed, terrorized, tortured, enslaved and oppressed them, once they were given "freedom?"

This is our current situation, and i think it's worth noting.

We all work for a system that has historically oppressed us, and still does to this day.

If my making mention of this fact, puts you on the defensive ... well ... you probably live on the defensive, because it is the truth. Speaking of defensive, i'm sure a lot of Black People, working for white people, feel defensive all the time. It probably contributes to poor health and such, living and working with one's known enemy ... smiling in their face ... hoping they like you ... hoping they'll continue to have favor on you, promote you ... because deep down inside ... you know they hate you.

Your questions don't really speak to why i started this thread, but i'll oblige you ...

Have you ever been robbed or assaulted?

No

Or had a family member murdered?

No

Would you want law enforcement involved or not? If so, would you rather that person be black or white? If white, why? If black, would that person be working for you or the oppressors system on the oppressors behalf?

As noted, none of the above has happened to me, and i hope it never does. At this point, i try to live my life so that i have no involvement with law enforcement. If i had a situation where i needed the police, it would do my heart a world of good, to be able to call on those officers hired by, and working for, a more fair and honest establishment than the current legal system. If they're all i have, and i need someone, i guess i'd hafta call 'em. If the officer is Black, i would probably feel more of a kinship with them, than a white officer ... so yes ... send the Black one please.

Simply put, we need more black law enforcement officers to care for the black community, not less. You've already said that the white man is the oppressor, so why would you prefer that he protects your community? Or would you just rather do without protection, and allow the criminals to just take over?

Brother MrRon ... i think we need our own justice system. I think we need our own everything. I don't really know how to go about making this happen, or if it's even possible, but that is what i'd prefer ... us having our own stuff.

:heart:

Destee

This just seems like another case were we like to close our eyes and not see the truth because it makes us feel better. Its like saying please doesn’t admit this because then we would have to take some responsibility and do something. And we would lose our favorite pass time. What more can we ask the white man to do for us.
You have to be blind not to see that most young black males are not raised correctly with a good male role model.
All you have to do is walk thru a black neighborhood at night compare to going to a white neighborhood and it is easy to see there is more crime. If you wanted to go talk to the people you also would find at least 4 times more black victims.
How can you ignore this?
And not to insult anyone but if you are telling the truth and really cant see the much higher crime rate of our people. Then you are so far at of touch with reality that you have much bigger problems than crime.
If we can’t even see and admit this, which is right in front of our faces, how can we ever solve anything?
Same thing talk to black cops, teachers and anybody else you has worked in a mostly black area and worked in a white area. They also will confirm the much higher crime rate.
Most of the time it is actually safer for me to walk at night thru a white neighborhood compared to a black neighborhood with my own people.
How can you also ignore that a much higher black crime rate is the reason that most blacks try to move away from all black neighborhoods when they can afford to. Houses are cheaper so there would be no reason not to stay if they did not have to face the crime.

DESTEE:

Sister, thank you very much for the clarity and response. You're right in that there is rarely just one relevant question to a discussion, but I guess that was the presumptuousness of my youth coming out--so I withdraw that previous question LOL! Also I apologize for implying you asked that question, for I thought this is what you were asking regarding the thread. Now I see your topic is more of an inquiry rather than statement.

I'm curious respecting this commentary you've made however:

"No Brother, i don't see it as problematic. It's just our reality. It's been our reality for hundreds of years ... Black Folk watching over other Black Folk. It's really more a symptom of our lack of industry, business, economic opportunity, etc., for our people. If Black People could offer other Black People good paying jobs, they'd probably have to get more white people to man their prisons. For that matter, if we could offer each other jobs, fewer of our people would resort to illegal activities (selling drugs)."

From what you're saying it seems implied that it is problematical for our people to watch over each other, as that dynamic appears to echo the "Headman" watching over the "field slaves," in order to report back to "massa" about their behavior. But what I'm curious about is do you see this same issue, which you say is not a problem, but a symptom of it (i.e. "lack of industry, business, economic opportunity, etc.") as dynamically being present or pervasive in say Black countries? That is, would you say this same dynamic, as you explained, equally applies to Jamaica, where more than 90% of the populace is Black and to them it's nothing having "Black Folk watching over other Black Folk."

To them this dynamic is quite normal and natural. In any case, I look forward to your response. Thanks in advance!

DESTEE:

Sister, thank you very much for the clarity and response. You're right in that there is rarely just one relevant question to a discussion, but I guess that was the presumptuousness of my youth coming out--so I withdraw that previous question LOL! Also I apologize for implying you asked that question, for I thought this is what you were asking regarding the thread. Now I see your topic is more of an inquiry rather than statement.

I'm curious respecting this commentary you've made however:

"No Brother, i don't see it as problematic. It's just our reality. It's been our reality for hundreds of years ... Black Folk watching over other Black Folk. It's really more a symptom of our lack of industry, business, economic opportunity, etc., for our people. If Black People could offer other Black People good paying jobs, they'd probably have to get more white people to man their prisons. For that matter, if we could offer each other jobs, fewer of our people would resort to illegal activities (selling drugs)."

From what you're saying it seems implied that it is problematical for our people to watch over each other, as that dynamic appears to echo the "Headman" watching over the "field slaves," in order to report back to "massa" about their behavior. But what I'm curious about is do you see this same issue, which you say is not a problem, but a symptom of it (i.e. "lack of industry, business, economic opportunity, etc.") as dynamically being present or pervasive in say Black countries? That is, would you say this same dynamic, as you explained, equally applies to Jamaica, where more than 90% of the populace is Black and to them it's nothing having "Black Folk watching over other Black Folk."

To them this dynamic is quite normal and natural. In any case, I look forward to your response. Thanks in advance!

Brother NeterHeru ... no need to apologize ... it's all good.

I guess i do imply that it is problematic, Black Folk watching over Black Folk, for white people.

Hmmmm ... let me see how to get out of this ... :wink:

The reason i don't want to focus on it being problematic, is because if we can fix some other things ... more important things ... this will fix itself. If we can begin loving ourselves and each other properly, take off the conditioning that's been put on us, then we'll do each other better. We'll be able to provide jobs for our people, where they may not have to work for white people in any direct way. If we had our own nation and such, with these mindsets, we'd not so quickly mistreat our own. So if we had to incarcerate some for breaking laws, we'd do it justly. There'd be no stories of plungers being inserted in the rectums of Black Men. There'd be no overwhelming mistreatment of us.

I realize that not all of us will comply, and we may still have some ugliness, but i can't believe ... if we would come to ourselves, our right minds ... treat each other properly, with the highest regard and respect ... that it would look anything like what they do to us.

I'm not familiar with the Jamaican prison system, and if those Sisters and Brothers mistreat their own. I surely hope not, but i know evidence abounds, regarding our ugly treatment of each other ... and again ... if this were corrected ... our watching each other in prisons systems, would not have to be the low down ugly thing we've come to know it to be.

Someone said that i have a utopian world view, and i do want and hope for the very best, for my people.

Hope i've answered your question, if not, let me know.

:heart:

Destee

"Have you ever been robbed or assaulted?" Yes.

"Or had a family member murdered?" Yes.

"Would you want law enforcement involved or not?" Yes.

"If so, would you rather that person be black or white?" Certainly I want the person to be Black.

"If black, would that person be working for you or the oppressors system on the oppressors behalf?" Undoubtedly they'd be working for you, since working in this capacity is also working for their self.

All of the above questions are pertinent to our people's survival and prosperity in this country. In fact, the essence of the Integrationist and Civil Rights Movements in America were manifested in our people getting government jobs; these occupations are the tools and mechanisms that control the society we currently reside within.

Indeed, perhaps we ought to ask ourselves would we prefer our 21st century situation to be equal to our situation in 19th century America, where virtually none of us held any government jobs--specifically law enforcement. Still maybe we ought to ask ourselves would David Walker, Martin R. Delaney, and Booker T. Washington all feel or believe that our people's condition in 19th century America--in terms of government jobs--is better than our people's condition in the 21st century.

ROARIN1:

I'm curious brother if you feel your sister is engaging in traitorous acts toward our people, by being a police officer? I am only asking because you said "working in amerikkkan law enforcement is as a traitorous act for any of our people." If you do feel she is betraying our people have you informed her of how you feel and what does she think about it?

Also I know you were addressing Mrron with this point, but it does appear that you are contradicting yourself with the following statement: "I never said YOU were, YOU called attention to that." I'm confused since according to you any of our people working in America's law enforcement is a traitorous act, so how could you not be specifically addressing Mrron, and anyone else for that matter, knowing he is a law enforcement officer?

Additionally how could he call attention to himself being a traitor when you particularized the fact that "any" of our people are engaging in traitorous acts, so long as they work for America's law enforcement? I'd appreciate it if you could clarify precisely what you are saying, because as it shows presently you are either saying all of our people are traitors for working as law enforcement officers in America, or some are not like your sister who you qualify as not hating because you "know her heart."

Yet this latter qualification does not absolve or nullify your contention that she is just as much a traitor as anyone else who is Black and in America's law enforcement. In any case, please clarify thanks.

DESTEE:

WoW! Sister thank you very much for the very timely response, it's certainly appreciated. I completely understand your explanation and it is quite ideal. Also the dynamic you described cannot apply to Black countries since they're working in law enforcement and corrections for themselves, not anyone else and certainly not for white people.

As well, although I have this same ideal in mind, I'm too much of a Capricorn to settle for the ideal (lol), I want the reality. Unfortunately, as I see it, the only way for this ideal to become a reality is if we do precisely what we are doing now: working in governmental capacities to have some input in how American society should be governed. I say unfortunate because there are a lot of sisters and brothers, like you, who feel our people should not have government jobs, because it's too reminiscent of working for overseers on plantations.

Regardless, I can tell you from a purely analytical standpoint, our greatest problem as a people are not the police, but prosecutors. Police work for the government, like prosecutors, but unlike prosecutors police officers are directly at the mercy of prosecutors and not the other way around. So, in short, it would not matter how many of our people were arrested by law enforcement officers, because only prosecutors can determine who does and does not go to jail. And the fact that 98% (actually 97.5%) of all prosecutors are white men is not coincidental and wholly incidental to the disproportionate incarceration of our people.

DESTEE:

WoW! Sister thank you very much for the very timely response, it's certainly appreciated. I completely understand your explanation and it is quite ideal. Also the dynamic you described cannot apply to Black countries since they're working in law enforcement and corrections for themselves, not anyone else and certainly not for white people.

Brother NeterHeru ... you are so very welcome! One correction though, i don't mean to suggest that ugliness or mistreatment, can't or won't be inflicted upon us, by us. It is happening right now as we speak. While this is another something we must overcome, i think we need to get other people out of our mix, so we can more easily deal with each other. But you're right, in that, we would not be doing it for white people ... which would be a major improvement for us.


As well, although I have this same ideal in mind, I'm too much of a Capricorn to settle for the ideal (lol), I want the reality. Unfortunately, as I see it, the only way for this ideal to become a reality is if we do precisely what we are doing now: working in governmental capacities to have some input in how American society should be governed. I say unfortunate because there are a lot of sisters and brothers, like you, who feel our people should not have government jobs, because it's too reminiscent of working for overseers on plantations.

Bless your sweet heart ... i'm a Capricorn too! :love:

I am by no means settling on the ideal, as i face the harsh realities every single day. This does not keep me from striving toward the ideal in my own coming and going, and encouraging others to do the same. I'm confident that we can reach such a place, in a relatively short of amount of time, if we were all trying to do our best toward that end.

Brother NeterHeru ... i'd like to invite you to join us during our online classes (http://destee.com/forums/calendar.php). We hold them right here in the community, in our own voice video chat (http://destee.com/chat). As a matter of fact, you are welcome to host your own class (http://destee.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21729) if you'd like! The reason i mention our classes is because during one of them, Brother OldSoul's class which is held every Wednesday @ 9 pm ET and every Sunday @ 12 pm ET, he taught us about being "response able" ... responsible. Being "response able" means that you must come up with a variety of different responses, for a given situation, and then when presented with the situation, choose carefully the best response. We should not be limited by one way to make our ideals realities. The task is too great for there to be only one way.

Now, i don't know why yall are feeling as though i'm saying our people shouldn't work in government jobs. I've not said that, and i'm not saying that. I'm of the opinion that working for them in any capacity, over working for us, is a problem. I don't care if it's teachers, doctors, or cab drivers. My push is for us to provide all of these services for ourselves. While this is ideal, i'm fully aware of our reality, and that we gotta do what we gotta do. So yes, let's take full advantage of being in these positions. Let's help our people all along the way, in whatever capacities we can. I love Judge Mathis! He is a part of the judicial system, in some entertainment kind of way, and he always keeps it real ... in my opinion ... as he speaks on the injustices of the system. He talks about how the sentences are different for Brothers, than white men. He points this out all the time, and seems sincerely concerned about our people locked up in prisons ... knowing, and saying loudly, that it's not done justly to a national audience. Yes, we can work within the system, using it to our advantage as best we can, pointing out its deficiencies, attempting to level the playing field ... but we must always realize ... we are working for the same government that built their wealth on the backs of our Ancestors, continually refusing to officially acknowledge this, by giving us reparations ... and there's only so much they're really going to let us do, to effect change. So we should simultaneously be trying to figure out a way, to have our own.


Regardless, I can tell you from a purely analytical standpoint, our greatest problem as a people are not the police, but prosecutors. Police work for the government, like prosecutors, but unlike prosecutors police officers are directly at the mercy of prosecutors and not the other way around. So, in short, it would not matter how many of our people were arrested by law enforcement officers, because only prosecutors can determine who does and does not go to jail. And the fact that 98% (actually 97.5%) of all prosecutors are white men is not coincidental and wholly incidental to the disproportionate incarceration of our people.

I don't know Brother, i think it's all tainted. What if someone brought you a plate of food, and the plate is clearly filthy on one half of it, and clean on the other. Would you feel comfortable eating anything off of that plate?

That's kinda how i feel about their stuff ... let them keep it all ... for we will have our own.

:heart:

Destee

DESTEE:

Well thank you again sister, you sure know how to flatter a brother and make him feel completely at ease. You realize it's not true that dark skinned brothers don't blush, since you make me blush all the time ;)

I completely agree with what you said, but would like to qualify my statement regarding police officers. Indeed the system itself is corrupted and as one of my instructors use to say "It's all bad." However, what I pointed out respecting prosecutors is a fact that has been researched quite a bit. I myself am only pointing this out because the master's program that I have recently completed concerned this very issue. Or rather, since my degree is in Criminal Justice, these are some of the issues we have dealt with.

In any case, it surprised me to know that just because a person gets arrested does not mean they'll appear in court, regardless of what they are arrested for. If a prosecutor refuses to press charges against what a police officer arrests an individual for, that person must go free to the chagrin of the arresting officer. Conversely if a person is arrested, and charged with a crime not by an arresting officer, but a public citizen--such as you and me--if the citizen refuses to press charges the prosecutor can actually do it.

That is, say hypothetically speaking there is a domestic dispute involving your mate and a neighbor calls the police. The police arrive at the scene and arrest your mate, whom you had an argument with. You vociferously make your objections clear to this arrest and intervention, which you did not request. Therefore, you refuse to press any kind of charges against your mate--like spousal abuse, assault, restraining or protection order etc. However, prosecutors can--and in this case--would be more than willing to press charges on the government's or state's behalf, since this is who they work for (the end).

Prosecutors do not work for anyone but the government itself and press charges against an individual, in the interest of society at large. And believe it or not all it takes is for a third party to either contact the police, or in some cases charge an individual with a crime, like in the case of sexual harassment. In any case, it's just something we need to look at, especially respecting the fact that prosecutors are the only law enforcement officials within the government who determines which defendant in court gets capital punishment (the death penalty) or not. Again it's no coincidence that brothers and sisters are disproportionately represented in the general population of prisons, death roe inmates, and those who receive capital punishment when prosecutors are 97.5% white male.

I appreciate the offer sister Destee! I feel honored that you think highly enough of me to extend this invitation. However, at the present time I must respectfully decline the offer, due to my previous experience with that pro-Black community I mentioned to you before. In short, and I have explained this to Mrron, I was completely naive and--perhaps even stupid--in thinking that pro-Black people were just as frank, honest, and sincere as I was about helping our people.

Yet I was completely wrong about this perspective, and consequently my frankness, honesty, and sincerity led to my banishment from this particular website. Some people who have been posters on Destee.com are people from that particular community, although I am not aware whether or not they're still active posters on Destee.com.

However, this experience was an epiphany for me dear sister, that there are some of us who are what I have termed "Black Extremists." For some of these individuals threatened to come to my place of work and kill me. I was quite taken aback by such responses, toward being honest and sincere. Thus, I no longer approach these forums from a pro-Black/Black Power perspective, but from the standpoint of maturation: I no longer personalize anything I say, nor do I offer any specific information about myself, which leads those within this particular circle knowing any more of who I am than what I will allow.

I love our people; this is something that I will not deny. Still there are some things respecting our people and being pro-Black and beholding in Black power that I do not love, nor respect, nor trust. There are schisms and fractions that are negative within the latter ideologies, which causes some in those "camps" to force our people into specific categories, for the categorizers' own benefit.

Sun Ship attempted to do this with me during my first time posting within this august forum. However, I refuse to be codified through someone else's categorizations and labeling: I am my own labeler, I tell you what I am and you either accept it or not, I am not what you claim, categorize, or label me to be. Now certainly sister I don't mean "you yourself," I'm just speaking generally.

Still I appreciate the offer, but I want you to please understand that I have to humbly decline the offer, and it is no disrespect to you or this superb website you have created, which in my opinion "tactically aids in our people's liberation." Nonetheless, only those who know me personally, and whom I trust in, can have the pleasure of seeing me, hearing my voice, and intimately knowing me in the capacity that I express myself upon these forums. Nevertheless, again I am deeply moved by your offer, but I do not wish for you to believe, think, or feel for a moment that this is a rejection of what your website is all about--because it is not. It's simply a full realization of my own maturation, respecting who I allow into my own personal space and circle of intimacy.

"Have you ever been robbed or assaulted?" Yes.

"Or had a family member murdered?" Yes.

"Would you want law enforcement involved or not?" Yes.

"If so, would you rather that person be black or white?" Certainly I want the person to be Black.

"If black, would that person be working for you or the oppressors system on the oppressors behalf?" Undoubtedly they'd be working for you, since working in this capacity is also working for their self.

All of the above questions are pertinent to our people's survival and prosperity in this country. In fact, the essence of the Integrationist and Civil Rights Movements in America were manifested in our people getting government jobs; these occupations are the tools and mechanisms that control the society we currently reside within.

Indeed, perhaps we ought to ask ourselves would we prefer our 21st century situation to be equal to our situation in 19th century America, where virtually none of us held any government jobs--specifically law enforcement. Still maybe we ought to ask ourselves would David Walker, Martin R. Delaney, and Booker T. Washington all feel or believe that our people's condition in 19th century America--in terms of government jobs--is better than our people's condition in the 21st century.

ROARIN1:

I'm curious brother if you feel your sister is engaging in traitorous acts toward our people, by being a police officer? I am only asking because you said "working in amerikkkan law enforcement is as a traitorous act for any of our people." If you do feel she is betraying our people have you informed her of how you feel and what does she think about it?

Also I know you were addressing Mrron with this point, but it does appear that you are contradicting yourself with the following statement: "I never said YOU were, YOU called attention to that." I'm confused since according to you any of our people working in America's law enforcement is a traitorous act, so how could you not be specifically addressing Marron, and anyone else for that matter, knowing he is a law enforcement officer?

Additionally how could he call attention to himself being a traitor when you particularized the fact that "any" of our people are engaging in traitorous acts, so long as they work for America's law enforcement? I'd appreciate it if you could clarify precisely what you are saying, because as it shows presently you are either saying all of our people are traitors for working as law enforcement officers in America, or some are not like your sister who you qualify as not hating because you "know her heart."

Yet this latter qualification does not absolve or nullify your contention that she is just as much a traitor as anyone else who is Black and in America's law enforcement. In any case, please clarify thanks.







(Although this would be better answered by Black Psychologists in lectures regarding the deficiencies regarding the european psyche, I'LL answer thus...)


I was addressing Mrron, but since YOU asked. The only contradiction in MY statements may be found in YOUR point of view.

I AM not responsible for others point of view. YOUR degree in law enforcement should have revealed this to YOU.

Regarding the Capt., MY Sister grew up in MY house, exposed to the same Black Nationalism as I, therefore I know HER heart.

MY Sister may wear the 'uniform,' but the uniform does not wear HER.
As I stated earlier, I know other police officers who do allow their uniforms to wear them, or didnt YOU hear ME?

While WE'RE on the subject, that is exactly what prosecutors are.
Police officers, nothing more nothing less.

They are the first 'direct line of defense' between the government and the people they are supposed to serve.

YOUR degree did'nt teach YOU this?

Or are WE (the public,) yet not supposed to be 'above' the allure of their law degrees?

In the military, service members are required to swear out oaths to defend the government from all enemies foreign and domestic.

Police officers are obliged to swear out similar 'oaths' in the same spirit.


Tell ME Neterheru, did they ask YOU if YOU would arrest YOUR own Mother, if she were caught in a crime, as they do many other police candidates as YOU applyied for the 'job?'

What was YOUR answer?

Don't get ME wrong I respect police officers, as long as they know they work for ME. (And not the other way around.)

AMANI

ROARIN.....

RORAIN1:

LOL! Brother they didn't ask me. But your sister took that oath too, and perhaps without realizing it you have a conflict regarding her and her profession. Also this is not about respecting police officers as I personally only know one police officer--who is a childhood friend of mine--which I honestly can claim I feel comfortable around. Other than him there are no police officers I feel comfortable around, but again this is not about that.

You made a generalized statement, which includes your sister, and anyone else who works in America's law enforcement. This statement is unambiguous and vividly clear, therefore no other interpretation of it is possible. You did not even limit the statement to police officers exclusively, and extended it to America's law enforcement. So what does this tell me? This tells me that prior to declaring this statement you thought about it, which is why you qualified it by not simply limiting it to police officers.

For American law enforcement is vast and encompasses many aspects of its society. So by knowing this it appears to me you did not limit your statement to just police officers, due to such a reality. In short you're still contradicting yourself; however what you seem to be saying--at least now--is that not all police officers qualify under that generalized statement made by you.

Still I asked you whether or not she knows you feel this way and what does she think about it (if she knows), which you have yet to answer. Additionally I extend this question to those officers that you personally know who "wear their uniforms" and not the other way around: What do they think about this statement of yours. This is merely a curiosity of my own, because it's puzzling to me that you have such a view yet your sister--an exceedingly close relative--works in the very occupation that you say is a traitorous act for our people to belong in.

Either she is a traitor to her people when she puts on that uniform or not, if not you have to modify that statement or else it will remain a contradiction. Simply put you know her heart but you don't know what she does on the job. That's two different realities brother. Thus knowing a person's heart does not mean you know precisely how they'll act or respond toward every given situation, especially where it concerns policing. So again, I await your answers to these basic questions.

Roarin, you have got to be kidding. I asked you "why do you continue to live in America?" You answered that" you have to confront your enemy to defeat them". That kind of reminds me of the Japanes soldier still roaming around the forrest of the Philipine Islands decades after his country lost the war, because he didn't know it. According to you, you have confronted your enemy and he put all of your soldiers in jail. You have already been defeated by your enemy. So, do you wish to be a prisoner of war or would you prefer to surrender, or quit and join the winning side? The rest of what you said is not worth even another letter stroke on my keyboard.

Destee, it's unfortunate that you still have an affinity for this obscure subject of slavery. You don't know anything about it. How dare you piggyback on the suffering of our ancestors. They helped to build the greatest country on earth. I deal with foreigners everday, who will do anything to come here and take advantage of this economy. Black Nationalism is about nothing but consolation for those who can't compete in this global economy. This is not the US of Slavery. That is history. Let's keep it there.

Neterheru,

Not only are your views skewed, but they are twisted AND demented.
I don't abide well with psychosis, I don't have patience.

Now I AM done with you. Enjoy your world.

MrRon, trust ME, I never 'kid.' But by the time you come out of
that fantasy world you live in, Power will have already passed you by
and your illness'es too, will have increased.

That's a promise.

ROARIN.......

Seems to me Roarin that you have rested your case on a hollow shell. Strong words minus accomplishments mean absolutely nothing. What have you or your group done? Hell, I can promised to be the next president of the United States or grow to be seven feet tall and play center for the Pistons. It ain't going to happen. You told me to expect a challenge, where is it? Blowing in the wind? When I was a kid there was a black man who drove a wagon to pick up junk. Whenever the wagon was empty, it made a lot of noise. You remind me of that wagon.

MrRon,

your contentions have been found by ME, to be full of holes
just like swiss cheese.

Any further diatribe would be no more than mental masterbation,
and I don't indulge.

However I Am 'curious,' (maybe it's that CAT in ME) however, you
and the barbarians that you embrace (the american government,)

have left nothing but a 'legacy' of murder, deceit, sanctioned homosexuality, pedophilia and racism amongst others as a legacy of 'accomplishment.'

What do you know about ANY organization that a MAN like ME may 'frequent,'
or have accomplished?

How are you able to comprehend that which for you and those sympathic
with you, find gleefully incomprehensible?

If I had not found such a contention so amusing, I never would've asked.
But you should maybe consider a career in comedy!

I AM sure (with 'scooter' libby,) you will find yourself in good company!


ROARIN....

Roarin, you are right, I know nothing about a man like you or an organization you might frequent. Why don't you enlighten me and the other's here? I'm sure that our gay friends whould love to hear of your disdain for them, especially since you think racism is so bad, they have the same issues with discrimination.

I'm not a government cheerleader, but I do get respect from the public for what I do. What is it that you do? You mentioned murderers in the context of our government. I arrest murderers, I don't commit them. What do you do? Many of the people in jail, who you don't think should be there, are murderers. Can we bring them to your house? If I were you, I'd quit the discussion to, because you are just rambling on about nothing. Yes, I am a comedian, glad you find me funny. HaHa.

What is it that I do?

I neither condone nor murder 90 year old Black Women who
are understandably terrified of whom may be breaking into
HER House and therefore makes an extremely GALLANT attempt

at defending HERSELF. I neither murder nor condone the murder
of 14 yr old Black Boys, whom had found Themselves incarcerated
in a juvenile facility for the first time for the minor offence of 'joy' riding.

I neither murder nor condone the murders of grooms on the eve of
their weddings.

I neither 'cuff' nor condone the 'cuffing' of 5 yr, old Little Black Girls
in an already racist and biased school system for simply 'crying for
Their Mothers.

The list can go on and on and on, however the only other concern I
Really have for the rest of this evening here is emphatically inform you that WHATEVER I do and
whenever I may do it is NONE of your Business and make no mistake about that.

You say you arrest murderers you don't commit them. I guess some of the more gullible may believe you on certain message boards.

I don't care.

But still, maybe you should talk to some of your boy's cause I don't think they gettin the message.

Btw, respect is EARNED ('least the kind I'M familiar with,) not co-erced.

ROARIN1:

"Not only are your views skewed, but they are twisted AND demented. I don't abide well with psychosis, I don't have patience."

I'll take the above quote as open acknowledgement that you cannot reconcile this contradiction. Thanks for finally answering, even in this particular way.

DESTEE:

Well thank you again sister, you sure know how to flatter a brother and make him feel completely at ease. You realize it's not true that dark skinned brothers don't blush, since you make me blush all the time ;)

I completely agree with what you said, but would like to qualify my statement regarding police officers. Indeed the system itself is corrupted and as one of my instructors use to say "It's all bad." However, what I pointed out respecting prosecutors is a fact that has been researched quite a bit. I myself am only pointing this out because the master's program that I have recently completed concerned this very issue. Or rather, since my degree is in Criminal Justice, these are some of the issues we have dealt with.

In any case, it surprised me to know that just because a person gets arrested does not mean they'll appear in court, regardless of what they are arrested for. If a prosecutor refuses to press charges against what a police officer arrests an individual for, that person must go free to the chagrin of the arresting officer. Conversely if a person is arrested, and charged with a crime not by an arresting officer, but a public citizen--such as you and me--if the citizen refuses to press charges the prosecutor can actually do it.

That is, say hypothetically speaking there is a domestic dispute involving your mate and a neighbor calls the police. The police arrive at the scene and arrest your mate, whom you had an argument with. You vociferously make your objections clear to this arrest and intervention, which you did not request. Therefore, you refuse to press any kind of charges against your mate--like spousal abuse, assault, restraining or protection order etc. However, prosecutors can--and in this case--would be more than willing to press charges on the government's or state's behalf, since this is who they work for (the end).

Prosecutors do not work for anyone but the government itself and press charges against an individual, in the interest of society at large. And believe it or not all it takes is for a third party to either contact the police, or in some cases charge an individual with a crime, like in the case of sexual harassment. In any case, it's just something we need to look at, especially respecting the fact that prosecutors are the only law enforcement officials within the government who determines which defendant in court gets capital punishment (the death penalty) or not. Again it's no coincidence that brothers and sisters are disproportionately represented in the general population of prisons, death roe inmates, and those who receive capital punishment when prosecutors are 97.5% white male.

I appreciate the offer sister Destee! I feel honored that you think highly enough of me to extend this invitation. However, at the present time I must respectfully decline the offer, due to my previous experience with that pro-Black community I mentioned to you before. In short, and I have explained this to Mrron, I was completely naive and--perhaps even stupid--in thinking that pro-Black people were just as frank, honest, and sincere as I was about helping our people.

Yet I was completely wrong about this perspective, and consequently my frankness, honesty, and sincerity led to my banishment from this particular website. Some people who have been posters on Destee.com are people from that particular community, although I am not aware whether or not they're still active posters on Destee.com.

However, this experience was an epiphany for me dear sister, that there are some of us who are what I have termed "Black Extremists." For some of these individuals threatened to come to my place of work and kill me. I was quite taken aback by such responses, toward being honest and sincere. Thus, I no longer approach these forums from a pro-Black/Black Power perspective, but from the standpoint of maturation: I no longer personalize anything I say, nor do I offer any specific information about myself, which leads those within this particular circle knowing any more of who I am than what I will allow.

I love our people; this is something that I will not deny. Still there are some things respecting our people and being pro-Black and beholding in Black power that I do not love, nor respect, nor trust. There are schisms and fractions that are negative within the latter ideologies, which causes some in those "camps" to force our people into specific categories, for the categorizers' own benefit.

Sun Ship attempted to do this with me during my first time posting within this august forum. However, I refuse to be codified through someone else's categorizations and labeling: I am my own labeler, I tell you what I am and you either accept it or not, I am not what you claim, categorize, or label me to be. Now certainly sister I don't mean "you yourself," I'm just speaking generally.

Still I appreciate the offer, but I want you to please understand that I have to humbly decline the offer, and it is no disrespect to you or this superb website you have created, which in my opinion "tactically aids in our people's liberation." Nonetheless, only those who know me personally, and whom I trust in, can have the pleasure of seeing me, hearing my voice, and intimately knowing me in the capacity that I express myself upon these forums. Nevertheless, again I am deeply moved by your offer, but I do not wish for you to believe, think, or feel for a moment that this is a rejection of what your website is all about--because it is not. It's simply a full realization of my own maturation, respecting who I allow into my own personal space and circle of intimacy.


Brother NeterHeru ... i didn't know that 97.5% of prosecutors are white males, though i'm not really surprised, as it seems logical for them to keep a tight reign on that task. Actually, i don't know much about the legal system, except what i see on television, and they've surely not shared any of the information there, that you've shared here. It's really nice to have you with us, allowing us all to become more knowledgeable. I'll be looking forward to more, Mr. Criminal Justice Degree Holder! :love:

See, this is really wonderful! I never went to college, and so i don't have a degree in anything. My daughter is in the process of working on her PhD and it was soooo exciting being an undergraduate student with her. While i wasn't really there, i gained knowledge walking through the process with her, and learning. Now we are in graduate school ... who wooda thunk?!! ... :)

But there's no reason for me to limit myself to her experience and knowledge, as i'm honored that you'd be willing to share yours as well. So please, don't hesitate giving us more!

Thanks too for last night.

Much Love and Peace.

:heart:

Destee

Destee, it's unfortunate that you still have an affinity for this obscure subject of slavery. You don't know anything about it. How dare you piggyback on the suffering of our ancestors. They helped to build the greatest country on earth. I deal with foreigners everday, who will do anything to come here and take advantage of this economy. Black Nationalism is about nothing but consolation for those who can't compete in this global economy. This is not the US of Slavery. That is history. Let's keep it there.

Brother MrRon ... you asked several questions of me, in your previous post, and i responded to them all. In turn, i asked you one, and you didn't even attempt to answer it. Instead, you respond by telling me to forget about slavery, and telling me what i don't know.

Do you tell your boss to forget 911? Cause they are saying never forget. Do you tell them to forget the so called jewish holocaust? Or are you just here, telling me, to forget my people and their pain?

Have you lost your whole mind?

The only reason i responded to you, was because you said i made you defensive. How can i make you anything? I did this by posting on a discussion forum? If so, then there is evidence that the problem is not with me, but with you. If you work for Homeland Security, or whatever, and you get put on the defensive, based on some text on a discussion forum, it's no wonder your military is all in Iraq killing innocent women and children, with no business being there. I guess your President is a little defensive too. Hmmm ... what is this ... massa got a cold, and you get the flu? You're sounding and looking just like them, a little trigger happy.

I'm through talking with you about this, as i won't continue to engage those who refuse to respond in the best of manners.

Last but not least, if you don't want to answer any questions, you should not ask any.

:heart:

Destee

Destee, i don't know what question that you asked that I didn't answer, so please ask me again. I don't have anything to hide from you or anyone else. As to the other statements you made concerning Homeland Security and 911. Let me say this, terrorism still remains a major threat to all of us. The terrorist will kill you because you are American, black or whatever, that is why we are not going to forget 911 for now. There is no threat of enslavement, I don't know of anyone or any organization that is even remotely interested in it. I say forget about it because it is soaking up too much energy, and there is no potential for benefit from all of this whining. I know of Jews still living today who were victims of the holocaust, in fact, I once dated a jewish lady who was born in a concentration camp, you can't forget something that happened in your own lifetime. The Jews aren't acting retarded over the issue, they have still managed to build something for themselves in spite of it. There is still anti Jewish sentiment throughout the world also, so they have need to remember what has already happened in recent history. Too many of our people are wasting their valuable time trying to get paid for our ancestors suffering. Their suffering created a great big economic power that we have every right to share in. I am getting my just due by participating and not complaining. I think that our ancestors could better rest in peace, knowing that we got economic benefit from their labor.

I have nothing to do with Iraq, and I don't support it or this President.

Your use of the term massa only shows that you still have a slave mentality. And that explains a lot of other things.

Destee, i don't know what question that you asked that I didn't answer, so please ask me again. I don't have anything to hide from you or anyone else. As to the other statements you made concerning Homeland Security and 911. Let me say this, terrorism still remains a major threat to all of us. The terrorist will kill you because you are American, black or whatever, that is why we are not going to forget 911 for now. There is no threat of enslavement, I don't know of anyone or any organization that is even remotely interested in it. I say forget about it because it is soaking up too much energy, and there is no potential for benefit from all of this whining. I know of Jews still living today who were victims of the holocaust, in fact, I once dated a jewish lady who was born in a concentration camp, you can't forget something that happened in your own lifetime. The Jews aren't acting retarded over the issue, they have still managed to build something for themselves in spite of it. There is still anti Jewish sentiment throughout the world also, so they have need to remember what has already happened in recent history. Too many of our people are wasting their valuable time trying to get paid for our ancestors suffering. Their suffering created a great big economic power that we have every right to share in. I am getting my just due by participating and not complaining. I think that our ancestors could better rest in peace, knowing that we got economic benefit from their labor.

I have nothing to do with Iraq, and I don't support it or this President.

Your use of the term massa only shows that you still have a slave mentality. And that explains a lot of other things.

Brother MrRon ... i'm glad you're able to glean something helpful from the words i use.

Again, this all started over you feeling defensive.

You obviously still are, and i hope you get over it real soon.

:heart:

Destee

Destee, I went back and found the question you asked and I didn't answer, concerning what people continued to live with the people who enslaved them, after they got their freedom? I wish I knew the answer to that question, but I am no an historian either. In our case, many did leave and went back to Africa, where they weren't really welcome. Some went on to South America and the Caribbean, some left the south and went north. It's very difficult to say why those who left did so, and why the others stayed. I would have to surmise that since most of them were born here, they felt that they were at home. Actually many black soldiers fought in the civil war, and were credited with helping to win it, so they fought for the right to be here also.

As to me, I harbor no bitterness for that dark era. I have no intentions of leaving all of the things I worked hard for (houses, cars, pension, investments, money,family and friends etc.) to go to a place not yet named or established. I see no reason to do so either. I have many great white friends, in fact, my very oldest friend is white and attended college with me at the HBCU I attended. I have many close white friends on the job also, whom I trust to have my back, should the need arise. Yes! I am fully assembulated into this intregrated society. I rarely encountered any hostilities due to my race being what it is. So I don't feel that I am intimately connected with my captures. However, I do know what time it is, and what the adversaties might be under certain circumstances. I hope I've answered your question, in a polite manner. LOL

Truetothecause, I went back and found your question, asking me if I think "these kids are being programmed to commit crimes?" My answer is yes. The programmer is all of us, those who allow violence to exist in their neighborhoods and on the television, in the music they listen too, in the books they read. If a kid is surrounded by violence, then he can be very easily influenced to copy it. If you were eluding to some racist plot by the white race to destroy us or to keep us in line, then my answer is NO! I don't see how they can possible be clever enough to do this without affecting their own children too. Despite what some may think, these white people are not that evil or even that smart. You want to see what is causing all of this criminal behavior, just be more observant of what goes on in the black community. You won't see a lot of outside influences. Lack of parental guidance is where it starts. From there it is all downhill. Put the black family back together and most of the problems will be solved. Blaming outsiders won't solve anything.

Truetothecause, I went back and found your question, asking me if I think "these kids are being programmed to commit crimes?" My answer is yes. The programmer is all of us, those who allow violence to exist in their neighborhoods and on the television, in the music they listen too, in the books they read. If a kid is surrounded by violence, then he can be very easily influenced to copy it. If you were eluding to some racist plot by the white race to destroy us or to keep us in line, then my answer is NO! I don't see how they can possible be clever enough to do this without affecting their own children too. Despite what some may think, these white people are not that evil or even that smart. You want to see what is causing all of this criminal behavior, just be more observant of what goes on in the black community. You won't see a lot of outside influences. Lack of parental guidance is where it starts. From there it is all downhill. Put the black family back together and most of the problems will be solved. Blaming outsiders won't solve anything.

Well....thank you for taking the time to respond to my "wonderings".
I will say up front...I agree that they are being, rather, have been programmed; and I agree that the community and family are now the perpetuators of that programming, however, I disagree that there is NO racist plot or influence.

I know that they have initiated this faulty programming which is now manifested in our families and communities and this knowledge is based in part, on the law of physics which suggest that "stuff flows down". In this hierachal society, where white men (as the founding fathers of this society) are top dogs....holding the majority of decision (legal and political) making positions and enforcement of those decisions (policing and such) which govern our experiences, then I am convinced that it is they who have initiated the "program".

Also...the laws continue to be skewed against us and I imagine you may be able to attest to this fact. It also seems to me, that not only are Afreekan families in need of taking responsibility for their ish....the broader society does as well. There is a game in play here...several...called the "Language Game", "Research Game" and "Teaching Game". A french fellow by the name of F.Lyotard outlined these games well in a book entitled "Post-Modernism..." (can't remember the whole title). There are many other documented accounts of how oppression and the impact of trauma effects folks thinking and behaving which I also know has and continues to negatively impact on our youth via intergenerational processes. I equally suspect that your position is a direct result of that same faulty programming and games the white man has played. So, no...they are not intelligent..just full of fun and games...and..the jokes continue to be on US (Afreekans):bye:

truetothecause, I can't disagree with anything you've said. we are all being programmed to act one way or another. Look at the dummy we have for a president. However, I don't think that is possible to keep such a thing secret. The so called secrets the government has, eventually get out. The other thing is this, if it's possible to program people in the way you suggested, don't you think we would use it against our foreign enemies, and they against us? Got to go now

truetothecause, I can't disagree with anything you've said. we are all being programmed to act one way or another. Look at the dummy we have for a president. However, I don't think that is possible to keep such a thing secret. The so called secrets the government has, eventually get out. The other thing is this, if it's possible to program people in the way you suggested, don't you think we would use it against our foreign enemies, and they against us? Got to go now
agreed...yet..WE as a ppl are not doing the programming...WE are self-destructing as programmed. The programmers don't have good sense cause they are attempting to destroy "their own"....us amerikkkans...haahahaha..oh that's right....WE are not really amerikkkans.....dummies that they really appear to be....biting the hands which fed them...
until we meet again...
:blowkiss:

Destee, I went back and found the question you asked and I didn't answer, concerning what people continued to live with the people who enslaved them, after they got their freedom? I wish I knew the answer to that question, but I am no an historian either. In our case, many did leave and went back to Africa, where they weren't really welcome. Some went on to South America and the Caribbean, some left the south and went north. It's very difficult to say why those who left did so, and why the others stayed. I would have to surmise that since most of them were born here, they felt that they were at home. Actually many black soldiers fought in the civil war, and were credited with helping to win it, so they fought for the right to be here also.

As to me, I harbor no bitterness for that dark era. I have no intentions of leaving all of the things I worked hard for (houses, cars, pension, investments, money,family and friends etc.) to go to a place not yet named or established. I see no reason to do so either. I have many great white friends, in fact, my very oldest friend is white and attended college with me at the HBCU I attended. I have many close white friends on the job also, whom I trust to have my back, should the need arise. Yes! I am fully assembulated into this intregrated society. I rarely encountered any hostilities due to my race being what it is. So I don't feel that I am intimately connected with my captures. However, I do know what time it is, and what the adversaties might be under certain circumstances. I hope I've answered your question, in a polite manner. LOL

Brother MrRon ... thank you for responding to my question.

I'm glad you have lots of white friends that you can live, work, and depend on, and still not be intimately involved.

I'm glad you have houses, cars, pension, investments, money, family and friends etc.

For that is surely what is important ... you ... and not the collective condition (http://destee.com/forums/showpost.php?p=460433&postcount=47) of our people.

As long as you remain in that ivory tower, and never look out across the landscape ... into the fields ... you'll probably be okay.

Stay Blessed.

:heart:

Destee

DESTEE:

Thank you for the compliments once again, but it's quite an accomplishment to go toward a doctorate. So I commend both you and your daughter, but especially you for going back to school. Also I only try to share what I know, based on what I've researched in the program, if it is helpful in someway. I do not mean to give the impression that I am somehow "better" or more "intelligent" than anyone else here, by virtue of having a degree or degrees. And I will try to do the best I can to share with you all the research, which I have done on my own respecting the criminal justice system we're subject too.

DESTEE:

Thank you for the compliments once again, but it's quite an accomplishment to go toward a doctorate. So I commend both you and your daughter, but especially you for going back to school. Also I only try to share what I know, based on what I've researched in the program, if it is helpful in someway. I do not mean to give the impression that I am somehow "better" or more "intelligent" than anyone else here, by virtue of having a degree or degrees. And I will try to do the best I can to share with you all the research, which I have done on my own respecting the criminal justice system we're subject too.

uh oh ... i didn't really go back to college, i lived it through her ... don't want you think'n the wrong thing.

And no ... i did not think for a moment that you were presenting yourself as better or more intelligent ... no, not at all ... though you certainly could be! :weights:

I'm very proud of you Brother. It's a great accomplishment to make it through the maze of traps and snares they have laid for us. You've not only done that, but done it quite successfully thus far, and i am proud of you!

I'm so impressed, i even mentioned you to my daughter ... :blush:

You're intelligent, articulate, kind, reasonable, wise, and a whole bunch of other stuff they'd have us believe our young Black Men can't possibly be. You do us all good, providing hope for the future! :love:

Stay Forever Encouraged.

:heart:

Destee

What is it that I do?

I neither condone nor murder 90 year old Black Women who
are understandably terrified of whom may be breaking into
HER House and therefore makes an extremely GALLANT attempt

at defending HERSELF. I neither murder nor condone the murder
of 14 yr old Black Boys, whom had found Themselves incarcerated
in a juvenile facility for the first time for the minor offence of 'joy' riding.

I neither murder nor condone the murders of grooms on the eve of
their weddings.

I neither 'cuff' nor condone the 'cuffing' of 5 yr, old Little Black Girls
in an already racist and biased school system for simply 'crying for
Their Mothers.

The list can go on and on and on, however the only other concern I
Really have for the rest of this evening here is emphatically inform you that WHATEVER I do and
whenever I may do it is NONE of your Business and make no mistake about that.

You say you arrest murderers you don't commit them. I guess some of the more gullible may believe you on certain message boards.

I don't care.

But still, maybe you should talk to some of your boy's cause I don't think they gettin the message.

Btw, respect is EARNED ('least the kind I'M familiar with,) not co-erced.


the list has again increased...but the 'justice' at the hands of the law is yet destitute.

OUR People are starting to see this and reject it more and more.

ROARIN1:

"Not only are your views skewed, but they are twisted AND demented. I don't abide well with psychosis, I don't have patience."

I'll take the above quote as open acknowledgement that you cannot reconcile this contradiction. Thanks for finally answering, even in this particular way.


Maybe you didnt hear ME.
You know, schizophrenia is manageable.
And you show all the more classic signs.

So, I'LL say this again....'I don't abide well with
psychosis, I don't have patience.'

I have geniune business to attend to...like hmm


ROARIN.......

ROARIN1:

"'I don't abide well with
psychosis, I don't have patience.'

I have geniune business to attend to..."

If the above statements from you were true why then did you respond to my post 2 weeks after the fact? Obviously I had left the issue alone and saw no reason to prolong it; otherwise I would have continued challenging you on what was previously stated. Rather than accusing me of insanity and literally wasting your time with responding in such a fashion, a more productive use of this time--instead of creating an argument where there is none--would be to focus on the "geniune business" you speak of.

I'D just saw it.

In your attempt to disrespect ME, you will not be allowed the opportunity to achieve that and expect to get away with it...scott free.

I ain't cut like that. I mighta let your sarcasm slip by for two weeks but that's not because I'D EVER let you speak to ME like you would...a, let's say fellow cop.

No. The oversight was solely because I wasn't paying you any attention.
'Till I saw your smart remarks. And now I ain't paying you no attention again cause whatever you got to say...definately ain't smart.

So the time has come for you to get to gettin' ignored some more. Believe that.

In the future---save your unintelligible comments for those in your peer group---cause for ME anomalies like you are extinct.

Finito.


ROARIN.........