Peace and Blessings Family,

It seems that Ani is central to this work, so i thought i'd ask the question.

Who is Ani?

Can anyone give us some links or information surrounding this question?

Thanks a Bunch!

:heart:

Destee

All the different sections of the papyrus were not originally written for Ani, for his name has been added in several places' by a later hand.

Sister River ... i see Ani is a man. Okay. Thanks. :D

The papyrus of Ani is undated, and no facts are given in it concerning the life of Ani, whereby it would be possible to fix its exact place in the series of the illustrated papyri of the Theban period to which it belongs.

I also see that there is not much written about his life, but he did have a wife. Okay. :D

Cancel my questions, let me keep reading (http://destee.com/forums/showthread.php?t=44565). :book: :read:

:heart:

Destee

PEACE:

The biggest mistake people make within Kemetian Theology, is to presume that a name that is read or discovered, constitutes a historical person.

This is not correct.

Ani is a Kemetic word that means "I am". Thus, ANI as mentioned in the Pert is a recitation meant to be spoken by whomever reads the texts.

As you read the text, you see the spiritual adventure that ANI undertakes; communing with, and eventually becoming the God(ess)s that he and his wife THUTHU (which means "wisdom") meet on their travels into the realm of the spirit.

HOTEPET

PEACE:

The biggest mistake people make within Kemetian Theology, is to presume that a name that is read or discovered, constitutes a historical person.

This is not correct.

Ani is a Kemetic word that means "I am". Thus, ANI as mentioned in the Pert is a recitation meant to be spoken by whomever reads the texts.

As you read the text, you see the spiritual adventure that ANI undertakes; communing with, and eventually becoming the God(ess)s that he and his wife THUTHU (which means "wisdom") meet on their travels into the realm of the spirit.

HOTEPET

Do you have any links to support the above?

Ani clearly seems to be a person, with a wife, tomb, and book of the dead for their journey.

What evidence do you have to support they were not a person?

:heart:

Destee

Sure.

We see here: http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/egipto/egypt_bookdead/bodead-13-papyrus-ani.htm

That it states:

"All the different sections of the papyrus were not originally written for Ani, for his name has been added in several places' by a later hand."

Also, many times in the Pert, Ani's name is mentioned in the second person (or third person, when "Ani" is supposed to be talking).

Further, the mythological metaphores of ATR's are commonly known to create a "commoner" who seeks to correspond to/with the Divine, for the purpose of becoming one of them.

HOTEP

Sure.

We see here: http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/egipto/egypt_bookdead/bodead-13-papyrus-ani.htm

That it states:

"All the different sections of the papyrus were not originally written for Ani, for his name has been added in several places' by a later hand."

Also, many times in the Pert, Ani's name is mentioned in the second person (or third person, when "Ani" is supposed to be talking).

Further, the mythological metaphores of ATR's are commonly known to create a "commoner" who seeks to correspond to/with the Divine, for the purpose of becoming one of them.

HOTEP

I read that same quote here (http://destee.com/forums/showthread.php?t=44565), but none of the above looks like evidence to me, that Ani was not a person.

I appreciate your effort though, and will keep in mind what you've shared, as i continue to study.

:heart:

Destee

To add-on further:

To understand aspects of the Pert, is to also understand aspects of daily Kemetic life.

For "Ani" to have been a historical person, to have written this tremendously invaluable text, would have meant that his life would have been well-documented, according to Kemetic tradition.

This has always been the case with Kemet's exceptional scribes, the likes of

PTAH-HOTEP http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ptah-hotep

Ptahhotep, sometimes known as Ptahhotpe or Ptah-Hotep, is the name of a 24th century BC vizier and philosopher. He was vizier to Djedkare Isesi in the Fifth dynasty of Egypt. He is known as the (supposed) author of a series of wise sayings known as The Maxims of Ptahhotep, assembled ca. 2350 BC. A manuscript copy, the Prisse Papyrus, is on display at the Louvre. They are intended as advice and instructions from a father to his son.

His tomb is located in a mastaba in North Saqqara.

He had a son named Ankhu, also a vizier[1].

AMENEMOPE http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amenemope

Amenemope (ca. 1100 BC) was a "wise man" who lived in Egypt. He lived in Akhim, which was located on the east side of the upper delta of the Nile. His discourses resembled that of a father telling his son how to live the good life. Although his discourses are unique, they share common themes with other wisdom literature of other cultures surrounding Egypt (Babylonian, and Hebrew, i.e., Proverbs and Ecclesiastes).

The same can be said for other Kemetic writers, such as KHONSU-HOTEP....However nothing concrete is found about ANI.

Also, within the pages of the PERT, ANI's name is transliterated with the deities that "he" then becomes.

OSIRUS-ANI (or ANUK AUSAR; "I am the living Lord" ), THOTH-ANI (ANUT TEHUTI; "I am the embodiment of wisdom"), etc.

Thus, ANI becomes that which the name has always implied; the embodiment of the Divine.

PEACE

This has also been my understanding of Ani. All his adventures take place in the after world. It would be interesting to exxplore how this man could write down the events that took place after his death.

As I said in "Book of Journeys" the value of the book is not a question of historicity but analogy and representation.

I thought the papyrus of ani was so named because it was found in a tomb for him? If he was not a scribe who lived in 12th century BCE why would a tomb have been built for him?

PEACE KEMETKIND:

I thought the papyrus of ani was so named because it was found in a tomb for him? If he was not a scribe who lived in 12th century BCE why would a tomb have been built for him?

To your knowledge, where is this tomb?

PEACE

PEACE KEMETKIND:



To your knowledge, where is this tomb?

PEACE

Brother Samurai, I have no knowledge of a tomb of Ani; I am a novice in this area (admittedly).

The majority of internet references I find mentioning Ani refer to him as a scribe who lived in a specific time period (there is some deviation of +/- 150 years).

Most of the references to the "book of the dead" indicate multiple versions are found in different tombs with customizations added for the deceased who commissioned their own scroll before it was buried with them and/or inscribed on tombs.

One site mentions the papyrus of Ani was a "scroll placed in the tomb of Ani"...

http://www.bardo.org/ani/explain.html

Granted the site provides no references, so I'm sure one versed in this area can ascertain its credibility.

Another site, one that does provide references, gives a explanation of the scroll's origin, but it also implies Ani was a real person who lived during a certain time period and had a hometown from which Budge purchased the scroll...

In any event, it's apparent to me supporting and contextual texts are sorely needed to have any shot of getting a thorough understanding of this text....

PEACE Samurai

Excerpt from http://www.deathreference.com/Da-Em/Egyptian-Book-of-the-Dead.html

The Book of the Dead assumed many forms. It occurs primarily on papyri, but it is found as well on tomb walls, coffins, scarabs, funerary stelae, and other objects. Perhaps the best-known Book is the famous papyrus that was inscribed for a certain Ani, "the Accounts-Scribe of the Divine Offerings of all the Gods," and his wife Tutu. This profusely and beautifully illustrated scroll was made during the early Ramesside period (c. 1300 B.C.E.) in Ani's home town, the southern religious capital at Thebes, modern Luxor.

It was purchased there by its curator, E. A. Wallis Budge, in 1888 for the British Museum where it is displayed today.

Extending more than seventy-five feet, it is one of the best examples of the Book papyri of the New Kingdom and Ramesside periods.

Ironically, for all its splendor, this scroll was actually a template papyrus roughly akin to a modern preprinted lease or standard will, with Ani's name and titles being inserted into the appropriate blank spaces at the last minute. Ani, or his survivors, purchased what was deemed appropriate (and what they could afford) from a funerary workshop for his safe journey into the next world; then the sheets with those relevant spells were pasted together to form the final product.

In any event, it's apparent to me supporting and contextual texts are sorely needed to have any shot of getting a thorough understanding of this text....

PEACE Samurai




This is the one aspect that I wanted to address.

This is extremely significant, and relevant to our goals here.

I maintain that EVERYTHING, without exception, as it pertains to Kemetic Theology, as a cosmological esoteric system, must be taken in the metaphorical, parabolic sense.

To look for a "reality" (a corporeal one, at least) in this theology will prove to only further our lack of understanding of it.

And that has been the issue for the "New World" (circa the past 2000 years).....While the masses look for "concrete truths", the Masters ascend with the arcane esoterum that they covet from the uninitiated.

Taking the Pert again for instance: While people perplex themselves over the "life" of Ani, you'll notice that no where in the Pert are there any real allusions to any historical persons, places, events, etc. Any towns, events, etc that are mentioned, are done so in happenstance.

This holds true for virtually any system that incorporates a cosmological mythos within it:

Numerous towns, locations and events are mentioned all over Greek mythology--No one doubts that "Mount Olympus" exists, but no one (from the lay commoner, to the astute scholar) is trying to climb it, in order to find Zeus, Hercules, and the rest of the Greek Gods sitting upon it.

And this is the trick: While the white world knows and knew instinctively that the mythology of Greece, Rome, Norse, and related places are just that--myths, this same white world takes the rest of the world on a scavenger hunt for Abraham, Moses, Jesus, and Ani.

In the meantime, the stories all work in precisely the same way: mythologies with loose connections to the mundane world, but only bear true relevance to the Spirit world.

To look for Ani, not only takes you away from the focus of the Pert (it's not about who Ani was--if he was anyone at all--but rather who he becomes), but also will take you on a pointless path of attempting to fit a square peg in a round hole.

The so-called European scholars did this themselves, and they have in turn sent us upon this same journey.

BUDGE himself states in his book GODS OF THE EGYPTIANS, VOLUME ONE, that the Egyptians were "half Negro Savages", who on one end created constructs of mathematical precision, but also dabbled in the foolishness of meaningless and contradictory gods.

PEACE

To add-on further:

To understand aspects of the Pert, is to also understand aspects of daily Kemetic life.

For "Ani" to have been a historical person, to have written this tremendously invaluable text, would have meant that his life would have been well-documented, according to Kemetic tradition.

This has always been the case with Kemet's exceptional scribes, the likes of

PTAH-HOTEP http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ptah-hotep

Ptahhotep, sometimes known as Ptahhotpe or Ptah-Hotep, is the name of a 24th century BC vizier and philosopher. He was vizier to Djedkare Isesi in the Fifth dynasty of Egypt. He is known as the (supposed) author of a series of wise sayings known as The Maxims of Ptahhotep, assembled ca. 2350 BC. A manuscript copy, the Prisse Papyrus, is on display at the Louvre. They are intended as advice and instructions from a father to his son.

His tomb is located in a mastaba in North Saqqara.

He had a son named Ankhu, also a vizier[1].

AMENEMOPE http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amenemope

Amenemope (ca. 1100 BC) was a "wise man" who lived in Egypt. He lived in Akhim, which was located on the east side of the upper delta of the Nile. His discourses resembled that of a father telling his son how to live the good life. Although his discourses are unique, they share common themes with other wisdom literature of other cultures surrounding Egypt (Babylonian, and Hebrew, i.e., Proverbs and Ecclesiastes).

The same can be said for other Kemetic writers, such as KHONSU-HOTEP....However nothing concrete is found about ANI.

Also, within the pages of the PERT, ANI's name is transliterated with the deities that "he" then becomes.

OSIRUS-ANI (or ANUK AUSAR; "I am the living Lord" ), THOTH-ANI (ANUT TEHUTI; "I am the embodiment of wisdom"), etc.

Thus, ANI becomes that which the name has always implied; the embodiment of the Divine.

PEACE

Brother SAMURAI ... who is to say his life was not well documented? Perhaps that documentation was not found and presented to us, by the same white men who "found" and presented the rest to us. It seems you are making an argument against Ani's actual existense, based on the availability of documentation on other scribes. That's not very persuasive. Lots of things could have happened to the documentation, including it being intentionally kept from us.


To your knowledge, where is this tomb?

Are you saying that the tomb is not real either?

:heart:

Destee

This is the one aspect that I wanted to address.

This is extremely significant, and relevant to our goals here.

I maintain that EVERYTHING, without exception, as it pertains to Kemetic Theology, as a cosmological esoteric system, must be taken in the metaphorical, parabolic sense.

To look for a "reality" (a corporeal one, at least) in this theology will prove to only further our lack of understanding of it.

And that has been the issue for the "New World" (circa the past 2000 years).....While the masses look for "concrete truths", the Masters ascend with the arcane esoterum that they covet from the uninitiated.

Taking the Pert again for instance: While people perplex themselves over the "life" of Ani, you'll notice that no where in the Pert are there any real allusions to any historical persons, places, events, etc. Any towns, events, etc that are mentioned, are done so in happenstance.

This holds true for virtually any system that incorporates a cosmological mythos within it:

Numerous towns, locations and events are mentioned all over Greek mythology--No one doubts that "Mount Olympus" exists, but no one (from the lay commoner, to the astute scholar) is trying to climb it, in order to find Zeus, Hercules, and the rest of the Greek Gods sitting upon it.

And this is the trick: While the white world knows and knew instinctively that the mythology of Greece, Rome, Norse, and related places are just that--myths, this same white world takes the rest of the world on a scavenger hunt for Abraham, Moses, Jesus, and Ani.

In the meantime, the stories all work in precisely the same way: mythologies with loose connections to the mundane world, but only bear true relevance to the Spirit world.

To look for Ani, not only takes you away from the focus of the Pert (it's not about who Ani was--if he was anyone at all--but rather who he becomes), but also will take you on a pointless path of attempting to fit a square peg in a round hole.

The so-called European scholars did this themselves, and they have in turn sent us upon this same journey.

BUDGE himself states in his book GODS OF THE EGYPTIANS, VOLUME ONE, that the Egyptians were "half Negro Savages", who on one end created constructs of mathematical precision, but also dabbled in the foolishness of meaningless and contradictory gods.

PEACE


Samurai, if everything is supposed to be metaphorical and parabolic, then isn't the meaning of these texts contingent solely upon one's interpretation of them (i.e. what metaphors and parables are being drawn from the text)?

If no factual or historical events are present in the backdrop, then is the issue kemetian proponents have with the later judaic religions is that the latter literally believe in their myths, while the kemetians believe their myths are only metaphor?

At first glance it certainly seems there are as many similarities in their evolution as differences.

Just a few questions...

PEACE

Brother SAMURAI ... who is to say his life was not well documented? Perhaps that documentation was not found and presented to us, by the same white men who "found" and presented the rest to us. It seems you are making an argument against Ani's actual existense, based on the availability of documentation on other scribes. That's not very persuasive. Lots of things could have happened to the documentation, including it being intentionally kept from us.

Not at all. That's not the sole basis for my perspective.....It's only one aspect of it.

The other aspect, as previously stated, consists of the conext in which the PERT itself is written.

Besides, what would be the point or motive, of any person (white or black) with holding Ani's exsistence, and the whereabouts of the evidence of such? Especially when they had done so for virtually any and all other Kemetic personalities during ancient times?

Are you saying that the tomb is not real either?

:heart:

Destee

Actually, I'm saying that the tomb had never been found for this person. Also, the tomb(s) that had the Pert buried in them have never been attributed to being a tomb(s) for Ani.

HOTEP

who on one end created constructs of mathematical precision

I maintain that EVERYTHING, without exception, as it pertains to Kemetic Theology, as a cosmological esoteric system, must be taken in the metaphorical, parabolic sense.

To look for a "reality" (a corporeal one, at least) in this theology will prove to only further our lack of understanding of it.

To mention the precision of our Ancestors, while at the same time suggesting that some of the most important (?) information they left us is not precise ... is kinda hard to swallow.

But i'm listening.

:heart:

Destee

Samurai, if everything is supposed to be metaphorical and parabolic, then isn't the meaning of these texts contingent solely upon one's interpretation of them (i.e. what metaphors and parables are being drawn from the text)?

This is where an understanding of the cosmology comes in.

The cosmology can indeed be tailored to fit the individual, but also works on a Universal level as well.

I've made my best attempt not to mention Metu Neter and/or Sheta'ut Neter here, in attempts to keep the study separate from that of the Pert....But that proves difficult, especially when the answer to your Q (a very significant Q, might I add), comes from these systems.


If no factual or historical events are present in the backdrop, then is the issue kemetian proponents have with the later judaic religions is that the latter literally believe in their myths, while the kemetians believe their myths are only metaphor?

Yes, and this is the summation of the issue with religion as a whole.

At first glance it certainly seems there are as many similarities in their evolution as differences.

True indeed!! You will find that since the "God(s)" of the Abrahamic legacies all evolved from their cosmological predecessors:

Islam = Sabean/Arabian/Nubian Theology (ALLAH was one of 360 Gods in their system)

Judaism = Phoenician/Summerian/Canaanite Theologies (EL, ADONAI, SHADDAI, etc were gleaned from these various systems.)

The only differences, were that the esoteric predecssors' theologies were whittled down into an exoteric form.

This same premise is found in Hindu, African, Native American and Aborigine spiritual systems--in fact, it's ALWAYS the commonality.

To look for GALUNTAI (the Cherokee equivolent to AUSAR/OSIRUS) or the Tricktster (Universal Native American equivolent to SET or the Devil) in some historical context is to totally miss the point of what both these characters represent.

The same for SHANGO, KIRSHNA, and even ANI.

It would even behoove us to adopt a more metaphorical approach to looking at the Abrahamic religions.

People are so convinced that the Israelites came from "JACOB".........There is not a single shred of evidence that proves a person named "JACOB" ever exsisted during that time.....In the meantime, the meaning of the word "YAQOV" ("JACOB" in Hebrew) means "he who lies, or supplants through force".

Is this not precisely what the children of "JACOB" did, in the story?

This is no different than ZEUS sending down lightning from Mount Olympus, for the various reasons that he did: a metaphorical tale used to describe mundane events, all for the purpose of imparting the lesson or moral.

This is something that the Honorable Elijah Muhammad tried to impart about his NOI.....Whenever he mentions the Biblical Prophets, he has NEVER done so in a historical context, but only as they and the stories they appear in relate to the world at present, and the Black man's place within it.

This is why the lesson of the Savior born of a Virgin (originally appearing in the Pert, long before it did in the Bibl) continues to be missed.

While Sheta'ut Neter teaches that the story relates to a cosmic event, Metu Neter shows that the story speaks of a far more personal undertaking: the Will (born of a virgin) saves the world (mind/spirit) from sin (the body, or the lower Self).

If you wish to find a picture of SET (the Devil), you need only to look in the mirror.

HOTEP

To mention the precision of our Ancestors, while at the same time suggesting that some of the most important (?) information they left us is not precise ... is kinda hard to swallow.

But i'm listening.

:heart:

Destee

Oh, I totally agree with you.....But bear in mind, that was a WHITE man talking. All the more reason why we should not approach this aspect of Theology with that frame of mind.

In reality, there is no contradiction whatsoever.

The science behind Cosmology, is that it can brilliantly use spiritual language to describe a scientific phenomena.

The white man is amazed and baffled at how our ancestors built the Pyramids....Yet, they can find no tools of any relevant sort, to prove exactly how they did it.

All they can find, is a bunch of scrolls, talking about how "the Gods" helped them do it.....And because the White man is so stupid, and incapable of thinking on an abtract level, he inteprets these "Gods" as some being from Outer Space.

I've spoken on how language facilitates intellect in other threads. This is something that we REALLY should give close focus to.

For example: We all recognize the Japanese one of (if not) THE most technologically advanced societies in the world at present.

However, most people might be baffled at how their language consists of virtually NO technical words.

Take for instance: their word or AIRPLANE translates to mean "GIANT BIRD".

Their word for Television translates to mean "MAGIC WINDOW".

Take a second to think about how these words create a certain image in your mind...... Think about how organic and fluid "MAGIC WINDOW" is, verses how artificial, and rigid "TELEVISION" is.

Most people of a Western mindset would see this as a primitive way of thinking on the part of the Japanese. However, in reality it reflects a balanced mental perception between the realms of nature and industry.

The Kemetians operated from the same mindset. In fact, I am an adherant to the notion that the Kemetians taught this science to the Japanese, and to Asia proper.

HOTEP

I followed most of your post, but a couple points I wanted to get clarification on.

In general I understand that much of religious texts is obviously metaphorical, but there is always some backdrop of historicity, otherwise credibility of the systems becomes an issue.

For example, you mentioned Elijah muhammed and his rendition of the biblical prophets as metaphorical....not so for the prophet muhammed, or "master" W.D. Farad.

My understanding is NOI believe both these men were actual people who walked the earth. My understanding is they believe Jesus was an actual human being who by virtue of his complete submission to the will of God, was also a perfect example of a muslim.

So while I agree that those things metaphorical should be taken as such, and Ani's existence may be one of them, I do not yet see that historicity or fact has a diminished role in the full understanding of belief systems.



If you wish to find a picture of SET (the Devil), you need only to look in the mirror.


Can you elaborate on this for me? I want to be sure I understand fully what you are saying here.

PEACE

I followed most of your post, but a couple points I wanted to get clarification on.

In general I understand that much of religious texts is obviously metaphorical, but there is always some backdrop of historicity, otherwise credibility of the systems becomes an issue.

How so?

For example, you mentioned Elijah muhammed and his rendition of the biblical prophets as metaphorical....not so for the prophet muhammed, or "master" W.D. Farad.

My understanding is NOI believe both these men were actual people who walked the earth. My understanding is they believe Jesus was an actual human being who by virtue of his complete submission to the will of God, was also a perfect example of a muslim.

Regarding the 3 people you mentioned (FARAD, MUHAMMAD, and JESUS)

The first is indeed explicitly referenced in a totally historical perspective.

The second, while indeed referenced in the same frame as above, is also allegorized, to such a degree that the metaphorical MUHAMMAD hardly resembles the Historical Prophet Muhammad.

For instance: In the Muslim Lessons #1 the 10th Degree states:

10. Why did Muhammad and any Muslim murder the
devil? What is the Duty of each Muslim in regards to
four devils? What Reward does a Muslim receive by
presenting the four devils at one time?

Answer: Because he is One Hundred Percent wicked
and will not keep and obey the Laws of Islam.

His ways and actions are like a snake of the
grafted type.

So Muhammad learned that he could not
reform the devils, so they had to be murdered.

All Muslims will murder the devil they know he is a
snake and, also, if he be allowed to live, he would
sting someone else.

Each Muslim is required to bring four devils.

And by bringing and presenting four at one
time, his Reward is a button to wear on the lapel of
his coat.

Also, a free transportation in the Holy City
(Mecca) to see Brother Muhammad.

So then, Muslims during ANCIENT TIMES, wore "buttons" on the lapels of the coats? Their coats had "lapels" on them?

Wait, they wore "Coats"???? :confused:

Also, no Muslim would have seen "Brother Muhammad" in Mecca, because the bulk of Prophet Muhammads Islamic Ministry took place in MEDINA, not MECCA.

And this is just in the Lessons. Elijah's other books (Message To The Black Man, Theology Of Time, and others) are rife with these sort of allusions with Hidden Meanings.

~EDIT~
However, when one considers the meaning of the name "MUHAMMAD" (One worthy of praise), and the meaning of the word "MECCA" (paradise), then we can put that lesson in a different context:

Something to the effect of "The Muslim's reward is to enter Paradise, where he will receive Praise for his efforts".

Regarding Jesus, the allegories are to the point of making a historical Jesus virtually non-exsistent, within NOI doctrine.

This is the merit of having both a historical and a metaphorical view of one's doctrine(s): to be able to discern not only which aspects are being addressed at any particular time, but also discerning which are relevant to the initiate/believer.

This is especially important, considering that Elijah Muhammad was at one time a MASON himself, who had ventured to Egypt and Arabia for his own studies. Much of Elijah's doctrine reads like Masonic rituals.

~END OF EDIT~

So while I agree that those things metaphorical should be taken as such, and Ani's existence may be one of them, I do not yet see that historicity or fact has a diminished role in the full understanding of belief systems.

Please understand, I'm not implying that historical academics should be done away with.....Only that you are going to find that the "history" does not always jibe with the metaphor.

For instance, there are numerous discussions right now in the Spiritual section of this site, about "Moses being Ankhen-Aten"......However, based on my most recent post there, that does not jibe with what the Bible says, nor does the actual history about these personas either.

So any spiritual relevance of those stories then becomes contingent upon the accuracy of history.....When then, if it is irrefutably proven that "Moses" did not exsist in historical form?

Think about what this would do to the exoteric systems of the Abrahamic religions.

I'm asserting that all of this is done with explicit motive; anything remotely esoteric in terms of spirituality, is automatically slapped with all sorts of labels; ranging from the softer end of "mythology, polytheism, etc", to the more harsh labels such as "devil worship, witchcraft, occult", etc.

All from the rigid, unlearnt view of esoteric theology.

And, all of this is the inference that I spoke of in times past, in discussions between you and I, when I stated that I'm not interested in "beliefs".

Can you elaborate on this for me? I want to be sure I understand fully what you are saying here.

PEACE

Hopefully I'm creating a more panoramic view for you.....Feel free to ask more Q's as you see fit.

HOTEP

Please see the edits in the previous post.

PEACE

If you wish to find a picture of SET (the Devil), you need only to look in the mirror.

You aren't calling Brother Kemetkind the devil ... are you? :eeek:

:heart:

Destee

Brother SAMURIA ... why does it seem like room for interpretation must be allowed when studying this text, yet you hold the Bible / Christianity to very rigid confines, regarding what is written therein?

If the same were applied to the Bible / Christianity, then couldn't what appears to be a lie within it, not really be a lie?

How do you justify these differences? Or am i just not seeing clearly?

:heart:

Destee

You aren't calling Brother Kemetkind the devil ... are you? :eeek:

:heart:

Destee

Haha, no.....Perhaps that didn't come out right.

I meant that according Kemetic theology, the origin of Evil lies within humanity.

Evil does not come into the physical realm, until an action on the part of a person is committed to bring it into exsistence.

That is also why many of us see the White Man as the Devil, because he is the embodiment of Evil in this realm.

Also, the Pert makes a brief reference to the White man, refering to him as TAMAHU AFSETU ("wicked white one").

As stated, the Pert is not without any historical or mundane reference; it's just that those references do not serves as the basis for it's intended message.

Also, the mentioning of the White man in this respect, also refutes the notion that is being pushed in the Spiritual section, that the Kemetians had no contact with white people until the coming of the Romans much later.

But I digress.....

Brother SAMURIA ... why does it seem like room for interpretation must be allowed when studying this text, yet you hold the Bible / Christianity to very rigid confines, regarding what is written therein?

If the same were applied to the Bible / Christianity, then couldn't what appears to be a lie within it, not really be a lie?

How do you justify these differences?

All very good points/questions.....

Therein lies the difference between the esoteric and exoteric....These 2 premises cannot be overlooked, when examining anything of a religious/spiritual nature.

While Kemetian theology is based almost totally on the abstract, the doctrine(s) of Abrahamic theology begins to dissolve once the historical aspect is subtracted, let alone questioned.

Starting from the very beginning: if Adam and Eve weren't actually 2 historical people, what then becomes of the doctrine of the Original Sin?

If there was never a Moses in Egypt, what then becomes of the notion of the Jews being "chosen by God"?

If there were no such person as Jesus Christ, what then becomes of the idea of "Salvation"?

No one would have originally sinned, and therefore no group would have been specially chosen, and thus no one would need salvation in the first place.

One chink in the mortar anywhere in the wall of the doctrine creates a cataclysmic demolition.

Thus, it's not my "rigid confines" (very good usage of terminology), but rather their own.

They (the proprogators of these systems) painted themselves into a corner with pen that they created the systems with.

On contrast, Cosmological, esoteric theologies do not work that way. Either I am AUSAR (Osirus), or I'm not. Either AUSET (Isis) controls nature, or she doesn't.

PEACE

Haha, no.....Perhaps that didn't come out right.

I meant that according Kemetic theology, the origin of Evil lies within humanity.

Evil does not come into the physical realm, until an action on the part of a person is committed to bring it into exsistence.

That is also why many of us see the White Man as the Devil, because he is the embodiment of Evil in this realm.


So let me get this straight, when you yourself look in the mirror, do you see a picture of SET (the devil)?

Therein lies the difference between the esoteric and exoteric....These 2 premises cannot be overlooked, when examining anything of a religious/spiritual nature.

While Kemetian theology is based almost totally on the abstract, the doctrine(s) of Abrahamic theology begins to dissolve once the historical aspect is subtracted, let alone questioned.

Aren't you painting with much TOO broad a brush by implying all Abrahamic theologists interpret the entirety of the bible/torah as literal truths?

Are there not a myraid of abrahamic groups that deal with the mythology within their belief, and in fact groups of (even) christians that do not believe the bible is a literal historical document?

I think more accurately we can say that some things are considered allegorical, others literal, and over time, the understanding of which stories constitute historical fact or allegory is subject to change.

The thing most striking to me about kemetian theology is it's constantly evolving, morphing nature, with myth/allegory woven in with historical backdrop...it is much more similar to Abrahamic tradition than I imagined.

Oh, I totally agree with you.....But bear in mind, that was a WHITE man talking. All the more reason why we should not approach this aspect of Theology with that frame of mind.

In reality, there is no contradiction whatsoever.

The science behind Cosmology, is that it can brilliantly use spiritual language to describe a scientific phenomena.

The white man is amazed and baffled at how our ancestors built the Pyramids....Yet, they can find no tools of any relevant sort, to prove exactly how they did it.

All they can find, is a bunch of scrolls, talking about how "the Gods" helped them do it.....And because the White man is so stupid, and incapable of thinking on an abtract level, he inteprets these "Gods" as some being from Outer Space.

I've spoken on how language facilitates intellect in other threads. This is something that we REALLY should give close focus to.

For example: We all recognize the Japanese one of (if not) THE most technologically advanced societies in the world at present.

However, most people might be baffled at how their language consists of virtually NO technical words.

Take for instance: their word or AIRPLANE translates to mean "GIANT BIRD".

Their word for Television translates to mean "MAGIC WINDOW".

Take a second to think about how these words create a certain image in your mind...... Think about how organic and fluid "MAGIC WINDOW" is, verses how artificial, and rigid "TELEVISION" is.

Most people of a Western mindset would see this as a primitive way of thinking on the part of the Japanese. However, in reality it reflects a balanced mental perception between the realms of nature and industry.

The Kemetians operated from the same mindset. In fact, I am an adherant to the notion that the Kemetians taught this science to the Japanese, and to Asia proper.

HOTEP


Quote:

"The Kemetians operated from the same mindset. In fact, I am an adherent to the notion that the Kemetians taught this science to the Japanese, and to Asia proper."

This is something that the Hon. Elijah Muhammad taught, that my mother also believed. For this reason a lot of "Black Muslims" (at least the Elders) had a high regard for the Japanese who, it has been found, erected underwater pyramid-like structures (temples and/or tombs).

I also agree that much of which has been taken as literal is not only metaphorical, but symbological.

For example, it is stated that Ani was to have lived "millions of years". Ani was also declared to be "Maa Kheru".

Ani thus was a "model" scribe who epitomized immortality as one who was found to be sinless in the "Company of the Gods". This is to say that "Ani" was an attribute (i.e. Osiris Ani) of "man" in the perfected state.

Depending upon what version of Budge's book one is reading I suggest thoroughly reading his notes. For example, on page 353, in the section "Hymn to Osiris" he clearly states that , "An, or Ani was an ancient form of the Sun-god or Moon-god who is said to be the president of the Company of the Gods.

This is to say that "Ani" was the principle form of the "Neteru", or what also is referred as "Ennead" (Company of the Gods).


Peace...

The thing most striking to me about kemetian theology is it's constantly evolving, morphing nature, with myth/allegory woven in with historical backdrop...it is much more similar to Abrahamic tradition than I imagined.

Brother Kemetkind ... i agree with the above, it's almost disappointing.

I was all ready to sink my teeth into some hard and fast facts, truth, and instead it seems to be much like Christianity, in that we have to have faith and believe that what we are being told, is the truth. I thought we'd actually be able to connect some dots.

But it's all still so new to me ... kinda hard to grasp ... so i'm reserving my final opinion for the end of the lesson.

:heart:

Destee

i think both sides are right that ani was a real person and also that its metaphorical.
my understanding is that the book of the dead was (is) a formula for the dead to take with them in the afterlife. so any person who could afford to buy it, put their name on it and was buried with it.

The best one they found so far happens to have anis name on it, but i think there are others in other tombs with other peoples names.

The mataphorical part i think applies because this formula is relevent even today. so anyone can put their name in the place of ani and have the book apply to them. so basically its meant to be read in the first person. one who reads it and identifies with it, it applies to him and his name takes the place of anis name.
thats my understading. i'm readint it now and i'll post what i think about the first part as soon as i finish it.

Thanks everybody for your thoughts and contributions...keep them coming. this is going to be quite a trip!

So let me get this straight, when you yourself look in the mirror, do you see a picture of SET (the devil)?


If that's the persona (NETERU) that I've chosen to take on, then yes.

Perhaps I'm not totally clarifying this perspective.

The Devil is not some red-skinned creature with a pitchfork.

Nor is God floating on a cloud in "Heaven" somewhere.

These energies (Go{o}d and {D}evil) dwell within the Universe, but only take conscious form, if and when they dwell within Man.

Personally, I strive to elevate my highest Chakra, which is where AUSAR and TEHUTI dwell.

ANUK AUSAR, and ANUT TEHUTI ("I am {the embodiment of} these Deities, respectively).

PEACE

Aren't you painting with much TOO broad a brush by implying all Abrahamic theologists interpret the entirety of the bible/torah as literal truths?

Actually, I'm not doing it at all.

I have no problem looking at these doctrines in an abstract form. Which is what I've always done.

However, aside from QABALAH, GNOSTICISM, and SUFISM, the greater and widely accepted aspects of these doctrines won't allow for such an abstract view of them?

Try going to a Christian church of any sort, a Jewish Synagogue, and a Muslim Mosque, and tell both the clergy and the believers that Adam, Moses, Jesus, Abraham, David, and various other Biblical characters were not actually historical characters, and watch how quickly they escort you off-premises.

Are there not a myraid of abrahamic groups that deal with the mythology within their belief, and in fact groups of (even) christians that do not believe the bible is a literal historical document?

Outside of the 3 that I have mentioned above (none of which are widely accepted by their exoteric counterparts), can you name any of these "myriad" groups?

I think more accurately we can say that some things are considered allegorical, others literal, and over time, the understanding of which stories constitute historical fact or allegory is subject to change.

All the more reason not to look for "historical fact" within religion.

Would you not agree, that "historical fact" and "subject to change" are mutually oxy-moronic notions?

The thing most striking to me about kemetian theology is it's constantly evolving, morphing nature, with myth/allegory woven in with historical backdrop...it is much more similar to Abrahamic tradition than I imagined.

Agreed, with the difference being, none that accept Kemetic Theology overly concern ourselves with the history, as it does not affect our spiritual ascension one way or another.

HOTEP

Brother Kemetkind ... i agree with the above, it's almost disappointing.

I was all ready to sink my teeth into some hard and fast facts, truth, and instead it seems to be much like Christianity, in that we have to have faith and believe that what we are being told, is the truth. I thought we'd actually be able to connect some dots.

But it's all still so new to me ... kinda hard to grasp ... so i'm reserving my final opinion for the end of the lesson.

:heart:

Destee

Not true in the slightest.

There is no "belief" whatsoever involved in this theology. Nor is there anything to have "faith" in. Both of those are words that you will find equally absent, within both the Pert, and Kemetic Theology proper.

Moreover, the "facts" that you are looking for, have nothing to do with history. To "connect the dots" in trying to link history with spirituality is to defeat the purpose of either.

Again, I point to the esoteric value of of this system (and others like it), which is completely internal versus the exoteric approach that we have been constantly taught by our "intellectual oppressors". for the past 2000 years.

I cannot stress enough, that we must look at this system (and others like it) with renewed eyes. We must be prepared to drop the obsolete exoteric view, and seek to adopt the esoteric one.


PEACE

Quote:

"The Kemetians operated from the same mindset. In fact, I am an adherent to the notion that the Kemetians taught this science to the Japanese, and to Asia proper."

This is something that the Hon. Elijah Muhammad taught, that my mother also believed. For this reason a lot of "Black Muslims" (at least the Elders) had a high regard for the Japanese who, it has been found, erected underwater pyramid-like structures (temples and/or tombs).

I also agree that much of which has been taken as literal is not only metaphorical, but symbological.

For example, it is stated that Ani was to have lived "millions of years". Ani was also declared to be "Maa Kheru".

Ani thus was a "model" scribe who epitomized immortality as one who was found to be sinless in the "Company of the Gods". This is to say that "Ani" was an attribute (i.e. Osiris Ani) of "man" in the perfected state.

Depending upon what version of Budge's book one is reading I suggest thoroughly reading his notes. For example, on page 353, in the section "Hymn to Osiris" he clearly states that , "An, or Ani was an ancient form of the Sun-god or Moon-god who is said to be the president of the Company of the Gods.

This is to say that "Ani" was the principle form of the "Neteru", or what also is referred as "Ennead" (Company of the Gods).


Peace...

Very excellently stated.

HOTEP

Peace and Blessings Family,

It seems that Ani is central to this work, so i thought i'd ask the question.

Who is Ani?

Can anyone give us some links or information surrounding this question?

Thanks a Bunch!

:heart:

Destee
Ani was simply one of the first tombs the book was found.

Ani was simply one of the first tombs the book was found.

Ani is a tomb? :confused:

Ani is a tomb? :confused:
Ani being the name of the person who’s tomb it was.

Hotep

http://www.africa.upenn.edu/Books/Papyrus_Ani.html

Ase`

Not true in the slightest.

There is no "belief" whatsoever involved in this theology. Nor is there anything to have "faith" in. Both of those are words that you will find equally absent, within both the Pert, and Kemetic Theology proper.

Moreover, the "facts" that you are looking for, have nothing to do with history. To "connect the dots" in trying to link history with spirituality is to defeat the purpose of either.

Again, I point to the esoteric value of of this system (and others like it), which is completely internal versus the exoteric approach that we have been constantly taught by our "intellectual oppressors". for the past 2000 years.

I cannot stress enough, that we must look at this system (and others like it) with renewed eyes. We must be prepared to drop the obsolete exoteric view, and seek to adopt the esoteric one.


PEACE


i belive that is kind of hard to introduce any new comers to the book of coming fourth by day and night with out an introduction to the neteru . An overstanding of the physical and spritual must be overstood first. everything in life has a double and dual use in both realms. The book of the dead simply can be any one's journey to divinity through the spiritual realm. one must understand that existence goes way beyond the flesh and into the developmental stages of existence. Our ancestors assigned human attributes to these different stages to make the un seen , seen. However they are a reality that can only be unlocked by listening and paying attention to mother neteru. one must obey the laws of mother neteru and not harm her as well. This is a spiritual journey that takes most indivduals a life time to master . with years and years of study connectration and most important a pure heart because you cannot fool your own heart it knows how u reacted to your energy in motion. this is why the heart is weighed in judgement. Ani just happened to be the scribe which whom the document was prepared for to accompany him on his very important journey and provide evidence for the divine to accept him based upon his actions while in the flesh. that is my very humble overstanding of the book coming fourth by day and night at this time. It is very important that u decide how the material will shape your life and undertaking to be sure u have not affended any of the repesentatives of the neteru and your ancestors(most importantly) during your existence in the flesh. an most importantly each aspect of the neteru is diffent attributes found in the hu man all coming to gether to shape the whole. just like nature or the neteru every system is dependant on the parts and they must all be looked at and monitored. That is where the term holistic derived from looking at the entire picutre and all of the components from ra to shu to tefnut to osiris to set to hours to khepra .without all of them providing there purpose the other could not exisit and the entire system would be dysfunctional. That is what cosmonology " the order of things " is about . I leave u in peace

Peace and Blessings Family,

It seems that Ani is central to this work, so i thought i'd ask the question.

Who is Ani?

Can anyone give us some links or information surrounding this question?

Thanks a Bunch!

:heart:

Destee
Destee:

Ani is not the writer of the Egyptian Book of the Dead; Ani was simply one of the first tombs that contained an Egyptian Book of the Dead. Why they call it the Book of Ani I have no idea. Several Egyptian Books of the Dead exist and they are all different and were composed by a Kemet Priest for the person that hired the Priest to write and scribe the book. Thus each Egyptian Book of the Dead is selectively written for the person that hired the Priest.

Egyptian Books of the Dead are basically Spells, Hymns and Wisdom text that are selected by the person who is preparing for their death. The Spells and Hymns are selected by the person wanting the book to be placed in their casket or tomb along with their body. I suspect the most popular Egyptian Book of the Dead is that found in the tomb of Ani.

Egyptian Books of the Dead are simply selected passages and verses from Coffin Text and Pyramid Text that are collages of words from also selected bits and peaces of stories about the gods.

i belive that is kind of hard to introduce any new comers to the book of coming fourth by day and night with out an introduction to the neteru . An overstanding of the physical and spritual must be overstood first. everything in life has a double and dual use in both realms. The book of the dead simply can be any one's journey to divinity through the spiritual realm. one must understand that existence goes way beyond the flesh and into the developmental stages of existence. Our ancestors assigned human attributes to these different stages to make the un seen , seen. However they are a reality that can only be unlocked by listening and paying attention to mother neteru. one must obey the laws of mother neteru and not harm her as well. This is a spiritual journey that takes most indivduals a life time to master . with years and years of study connectration and most important a pure heart because you cannot fool your own heart it knows how u reacted to your energy in motion. this is why the heart is weighed in judgement. Ani just happened to be the scribe which whom the document was prepared for to accompany him on his very important journey and provide evidence for the divine to accept him based upon his actions while in the flesh. that is my very humble overstanding of the book coming fourth by day and night at this time. It is very important that u decide how the material will shape your life and undertaking to be sure u have not affended any of the repesentatives of the neteru and your ancestors(most importantly) during your existence in the flesh. an most importantly each aspect of the neteru is diffent attributes found in the hu man all coming to gether to shape the whole. just like nature or the neteru every system is dependant on the parts and they must all be looked at and monitored. That is where the term holistic derived from looking at the entire picutre and all of the components from ra to shu to tefnut to osiris to set to hours to khepra .without all of them providing there purpose the other could not exisit and the entire system would be dysfunctional. That is what cosmonology " the order of things " is about . I leave u in peace

True indeed, to all points.

HOTEPU

Hotep

http://www.africa.upenn.edu/Books/Papyrus_Ani.html

Ase`

This is an awesome point, that you have provided..

Let us examine further:

Behold, the Osiris Ani, the scribe of the holy offerings of all the gods, saith: Homage to thee, O thou who hast come as Khepera, Khepera the creator of the gods, Thou art seated on thy throne, thou risest up in the sky, illumining thy mother [Nut], thou art seated on thy throne as the king of the gods.

Here, AUSAR (Osirus) and ANI are the same person. In the KEMETIC, the term is ANUK-AUSAR, which simply means "I AM AUSAR".

May Ra give glory, and power, and thruth-speaking, and the appearance as a living soul so that he may gaze upon Heru-khuti, to the KA of the Osiris the Scribe Ani, who speaketh truth before Osiris

"KA" means "SPIRIT". Thus, the spirit of the initiate who takes on the HEQA ("mantra") of becoming one with AUSAR, speaks the truth in doing so.

This is a common ritual within our HESP (gatherings).

Hail, O ye who give cakes and ale to perfect souls in the House of Osiris, give ye cakes and ale twice each day (in the morning and in the evening) to the soul of the Osiris Ani, whose word is true before the gods, the Lords of Abydos, and whose word is true with you. Hail, O ye who open up the way, who act as guides to the roads [in the Other World] to perfect souls in the House of Osiris, open ye up for him the way, and act ye as guides to the roads to the soul of the Osiris, the scribe, the registrary of all the offerings made to the gods, Ani, [whose word is true] with you.

Here, no distinction is being made between AUSAR (which is the goal) and ANI (which is the path).

Here, the goal is to establish one's divinity (The Black Man as god is an age-old concept).

As you can see, this all speaks to the esoteric nature of becoming one with God. AUSAR is the "Lord of the Underworld" or the DUAT, which represents the intuitive, All-Seeing subconscious Self, unfettered by feelings and ideas that attach us to the physical world.

HOTEP

Peace and Blessings Family,

I found this simple description (http://www.geocities.com/titania_le_fey/lesser.html) surrounding Ani ... that i thought worthy of sharing.

There are Egyptian Gods, called Neteru. Some are well known, and some are lesser known. Ani was a lesser known.

Because each town had its own local dieties there are many Neteru who there is little known about. These gods and goddesses had special places among the common folk of the Egyptian community and deserve praise just as much as the most widely known of thier brethern.

According to the "Book of the Dead" ie "The Book of Coming Forth by Day" Ani is the soul of a mortal. He is a lord of festivals and the new moon.

:heart:

Destee

Peace and Blessings Family,

I found this simple description (http://www.geocities.com/titania_le_fey/lesser.html) surrounding Ani ... that i thought worthy of sharing.

There are Egyptian Gods, called Neteru. Some are well known, and some are lesser known. Ani was a lesser known.

Because each town had its own local dieties there are many Neteru who there is little known about. These gods and goddesses had special places among the common folk of the Egyptian community and deserve praise just as much as the most widely known of thier brethern.

According to the "Book of the Dead" ie "The Book of Coming Forth by Day" Ani is the soul of a mortal. He is a lord of festivals and the new moon.

:heart:

Destee

So Sister Destee:

Might I ask what your take on ANI is now? What does "the soul of a mortal" mean to/for you?

This is more or less what I was attempting to convey earlier. ANI is the representation of any person, any human being, man or woman, who seeks spiritual elevation.

HOTEP

Peace and Blessings Family,

It seems that Ani is central to this work, so i thought i'd ask the question.

Who is Ani?

Can anyone give us some links or information surrounding this question?

Thanks a Bunch!

:heart:

Destee


I hope I am not too late on this thread, I have been very busy lately. Anyhow, "Ani" was simply a neter, or divine aspect of the One Supreme Being (God), just as considered of the Aten, Tehuti, Amen, Ra, and many others. Any usage of a neter can be translated as God, for a neter is simply a particular aspect of God. For instance the famous Kemetic King Tut's real name by birth was TwtAnkhAten and he later changed it to TwtAnkhAmen. However, the name TwtAnkhAten literally means "The Living Image of God", or for the bastardizing Hebrew/Israelite sect that formed afterwards, "The Living Image of the Lord", where "aten" was often used to mean "the lord".

When it comes to "ani", this word simply means "I am". This is where the Biblical god gets the phrase "I am that I am" in Exodus 3:14. The neter of Ani represents the everlasting aspect of God, which is why Kemetic texts wrote often "I am (Ani) that I am (ani)".

This thread was very very intriguing!
Great read

(ShemsiEnTehuti) - When it comes to "ani", this word simply means "I am". This is where the Biblical god gets the phrase "I am that I am" in Exodus 3:14. The neter of Ani represents the everlasting aspect of God, which is why Kemetic texts wrote often "I am (Ani) that I am (ani)".

i am that i am == nuk pu nuk
there is another way to say that, which i need to look up.
where can i find this usage of "ani"? i do not know this usage of "ani" that you are referencing.
ani is written as a man and not as a neter, based on what i've seen in muata ashby's translations.

(Destee) - It seems that Ani is central to this work, so i thought i'd ask the question.

Who is Ani?

according to cheik anta diop, african origins of civilization pg. 207:
after the collapse of the old kingdom, due to revolt, everyone had access to to an "osirian death".
thus, there is no reason to think ani would have been someone "special" who would have been recorded history. instead, it seems that ani had enough money to pay for (and the character to merit) an "osirian" death.

additionally, whether or not "ani" is his real name, or an assumed spiritual name is unknown. a google search suggests that there are copies of the pert em heru personalized for "nes-min" (http://www.geocities.com/ankhenmut/Nesminfinal.htm), kha (http://www.museolibroantico.com/en.tennessee.html), nebseni (http://www.touregypt.net/bod123.htm), and also one for nu (http://altreligion.about.com/library/texts/bl_wisdomegyptians27.htm).

"nu", "kha" certainly sound more like assumed names; but these texts were made for individual people.

ani's papyrus is simply one of the best preserved.

(kemetkind) - Samurai, if everything is supposed to be metaphorical and parabolic, then isn't the meaning of these texts contingent solely upon one's interpretation of them (i.e. what metaphors and parables are being drawn from the text)?

a) in terms of interpretting the pert em heru, it's message covers alot of topics.

it provides directions on rituals and prayers/spells that should be performed over the body of the deceased. as emanuel goodman has pointed out, everything has a double and exists in both the physical & spiritual realms. thus, these are spells & prayers that the ka of "ani" can perform; or these spells can be performed on his behalf.

alot of these rituals/spells are intended to make the transition smooth.
this here is where the character of a person comes into play. you need people, family...etc to perform rituals for you...etc. your character must be pure in their estimation for certain rituals to be performed.

b) there is an element of teaching that dears with a "monistic" point of view. acknowledging that everything is a manifestation of ra (the creator)...etc. here is where a person needs to study the lessons, internalize them and realize them to help gain some form of enlightenment. as emanuel goodman pointed out, listen to mother neteru, become intune with mother neteru. the pert em heru by itself is giving us the philosophical aspect; but not the daily rituals and practices to help awaken that realization within us. which is why the metu neter books teach some meditation, divination & visualization exercises; the earth center teaches a set of rituals and practices; and muata ashby teaches his own practices based on "egyptian yoga"...etc.

c) ani is ausar...
i've always interpretted this as a reference to reincarnation; as ausar, auset & heru are regarded as the ancestors for mankind; or atleast the ancestors for the civilizers of mankind. in this sense, to merge with ausar is to become one with one's ancestors. one is one's ancestors.
there are other ways to interpret that however...

(kemetkind) - Samurai, if everything is supposed to be metaphorical and parabolic, then isn't the meaning of these texts contingent solely upon one's interpretation of them (i.e. what metaphors and parables are being drawn from the text)?

a) in terms of interpretting the pert em heru, it's message covers alot of topics.

it provides directions on rituals and prayers/spells that should be performed over the body of the deceased. as emanuel goodman has pointed out, everything has a double and exists in both the physical & spiritual realms. thus, these are spells & prayers that the ka of "ani" can perform; or these spells can be performed on his behalf.

alot of these rituals/spells are intended to make the transition smooth.
this here is where the character of a person comes into play. you need people, family...etc to perform rituals for you...etc. your character must be pure in their estimation for certain rituals to be performed.

b) there is an element of teaching that dears with a "monistic" point of view. acknowledging that everything is a manifestation of ra (the creator)...etc. here is where a person needs to study the lessons, internalize them and realize them to help gain some form of enlightenment. as emanuel goodman pointed out, listen to mother neteru, become intune with mother neteru. the pert em heru by itself is giving us the philosophical aspect; but not the daily rituals and practices to help awaken that realization within us. which is why the metu neter books teach some meditation, divination & visualization exercises; the earth center teaches a set of rituals and practices; and muata ashby teaches his own practices based on "egyptian yoga"...etc.

c) ani is ausar...
i've always interpretted this as a reference to reincarnation; as ausar, auset & heru are regarded as the ancestors for mankind; or atleast the ancestors for the civilizers of mankind. in this sense, to merge with ausar is to become one with one's ancestors. one is one's ancestors.
there are other ways to interpret that however...

This is Self-Ex-planetary....

This is where an understanding of the cosmology comes in.

The cosmology can indeed be tailored to fit the individual, but also works on a Universal level as well.

I've made my best attempt not to mention Metu Neter and/or Sheta'ut Neter here, in attempts to keep the study separate from that of the Pert....But that proves difficult, especially when the answer to your Q (a very significant Q, might I add), comes from these systems.




Yes, and this is the summation of the issue with religion as a whole.



True indeed!! You will find that since the "God(s)" of the Abrahamic legacies all evolved from their cosmological predecessors:

Islam = Sabean/Arabian/Nubian Theology (ALLAH was one of 360 Gods in their system)

Judaism = Phoenician/Summerian/Canaanite Theologies (EL, ADONAI, SHADDAI, etc were gleaned from these various systems.)

The only differences, were that the esoteric predecssors' theologies were whittled down into an exoteric form.

This same premise is found in Hindu, African, Native American and Aborigine spiritual systems--in fact, it's ALWAYS the commonality.

To look for GALUNTAI (the Cherokee equivolent to AUSAR/OSIRUS) or the Tricktster (Universal Native American equivolent to SET or the Devil) in some historical context is to totally miss the point of what both these characters represent.

The same for SHANGO, KIRSHNA, and even ANI.

It would even behoove us to adopt a more metaphorical approach to looking at the Abrahamic religions.

People are so convinced that the Israelites came from "JACOB".........There is not a single shred of evidence that proves a person named "JACOB" ever exsisted during that time.....In the meantime, the meaning of the word "YAQOV" ("JACOB" in Hebrew) means "he who lies, or supplants through force".

Is this not precisely what the children of "JACOB" did, in the story?

This is no different than ZEUS sending down lightning from Mount Olympus, for the various reasons that he did: a metaphorical tale used to describe mundane events, all for the purpose of imparting the lesson or moral.

This is something that the Honorable Elijah Muhammad tried to impart about his NOI.....Whenever he mentions the Biblical Prophets, he has NEVER done so in a historical context, but only as they and the stories they appear in relate to the world at present, and the Black man's place within it.

This is why the lesson of the Savior born of a Virgin (originally appearing in the Pert, long before it did in the Bibl) continues to be missed.

While Sheta'ut Neter teaches that the story relates to a cosmic event, Metu Neter shows that the story speaks of a far more personal undertaking: the Will (born of a virgin) saves the world (mind/spirit) from sin (the body, or the lower Self).

If you wish to find a picture of SET (the Devil), you need only to look in the mirror.

HOTEP

Interesting .. . This quote right here ... I wish this brotha could have explain it in more detail ...

"...the meaning of the word "YAQOV" ("JACOB" in Hebrew) means "he who lies, or supplants through force".

Peace and Blessings

This is Self-Ex-planetary....

This is how we used to get down! Oh how i miss them booth dear omo! What a great time we had coming to gather at that time. I could not what to get back to topics to learn from the gods! hotep thanx for digging this back up i will go back through it for food! hotep

Destee:

Ani is not the writer of the Egyptian Book of the Dead; Ani was simply one of the first tombs that contained an Egyptian Book of the Dead. Why they call it the Book of Ani I have no idea. Several Egyptian Books of the Dead exist and they are all different and were composed by a Kemet Priest for the person that hired the Priest to write and scribe the book. Thus each Egyptian Book of the Dead is selectively written for the person that hired the Priest.

Egyptian Books of the Dead are basically Spells, Hymns and Wisdom text that are selected by the person who is preparing for their death. The Spells and Hymns are selected by the person wanting the book to be placed in their casket or tomb along with their body. I suspect the most popular Egyptian Book of the Dead is that found in the tomb of Ani.

Egyptian Books of the Dead are simply selected passages and verses from Coffin Text and Pyramid Text that are collages of words from also selected bits and peaces of stories about the gods.

Brother Music Producer ... Thank You for the above! :love:

Oh My Goodness ... i see i never responded to this, but reading it again this morning, was so good! Thank You!

I absolutely love this community, its ability to hold on to the knowledge, allowing us to read and re-read the information within! I've even found that with the passing of time, it grows even more divine! Thank you for lending yourself to this effort.

Much Much Love and Peace!

:heart:

Destee