This guy hits the nail on the head.:smash:

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One of the most miscalculated assumptions is that when a person receives a college degree, whether undergraduate or graduate, that individual is now educated. It is true that individual is qualified to apply for various positions or professions where a particular degree is required. However, if one were to evaluate being educated by the first requirement passed down from the ancient Nile Valley temples in northeast Afrika, the educational center for the world during its golden era, most would not be considered educated. In ancient Kemet (Egypt), on the portals of several temples was the saying "Know Thyself." The Greeks attributed this statement to the philosopher Socrates, without ever mentioning that Socrates was trained in Afrika, in the same temples previously mentioned.

If the principle of Know Thyself alone was applied to today's college graduates, most would be considered illiterate, especially those of Afrikan descent. It is not difficult to find one of the culprits in this matter. William Bennett, who served as Secretary of Education under President Ronald Reagan represents one example of many. He tried to lay the foundation when he attempted to sway higher education towards a "classical and Jewish-Christian heritage, the facts of American and European history, the political organization of Western societies, the great works of Western art and literature and the major achievements of the scientific disciplines." Under this operative, no non-Western or non-European history or culture was of any educational value. In other words, people of color were persona non grata under this educational dictate.

The unfortunate factor is, education has primarily been conducted this way, and under the philosophical premise in which Bennett aspired, and many like him, the greatest falsehoods, distortions and omissions concerning the history and culture of Afrikan people have been committed. Students of color who receive degrees under this cloak of academic ineptitude are bound to eventually reach a stage where they are struggling to "find themselves," because they basically do not know who they are. This can cause great internal turmoil, even after reaching financial comfort. The mental and intellectual void can cause one to be an eternal slave to a system, culture or values that does not have their interest at heart and do not even like them as a people. It can cause some people of Afrikan descent to believe in a Bennett-like premise so thoroughly they willingly betray their own people and expect to be rewarded for it.

This includes embracing the values, customs, habits and looks of those holding them down. It is analogous to a Black person in the segregated South no longer being told to enter the back door, sit on the back of the bus or see themselves as inferior, for they will do these things voluntarily. They will consistently label themselves as 'minority,' though people of color represent 9/10ths of the world's population. When a person of Afrikan descent is never exposed that his/her ancient ancestors were the actual creators of civilization, built on the sciences they created, the advanced mathematics they brought to the world, the systems of technology they utilized, created the science of medicine for healing, the art of writing, even the educational system which they obtained their degrees, is just the beginning of mental deterioration and intellectual incompetence.

This is further implemented when they are not even exposed to their recent ancestors who were part of the planning and built the capital in Washington D.C., allowed everyone to have light by creating the first light bulb filament, including the first stand alone clock, performed the first heart surgery, created refrigeration to preserve food, along with too many other creations to mention here. Even today, in this present time, such great figures as Dr. Gabriel A. Oyibo, a physicist, of the University of Bridgeport in Connecticut, who has worked out problems in the Unified Field Theory, which eluded Dr. Albert Einstein, the so-called genius, and solved the most difficult turbulence problems in aeronautics, or the late Dr. Ernest E. Just of Howard University, who introduced the world to the most intense research conducted in the field of biology, genetic engineering, and the innovation of DNA, are not being hailed for the magnificent contributions they have made to the world.

In light of all this, parents of Afrikan descent can prevent this mental slavery of the next generation by making sure their children are exposed to the subjects previously mentioned, having literature in the home addressing their history and culture, including relevant videos and DVDs, making sure they are aware of Afrikan world scholars and their works, monitoring television usage, taking their children to events that expose them to their own culture, being actively involved in their children's education, insisting the curriculum include their history, but at the same time not relying on public or private education to provide quality information related to Afrikan world history and culture. That should be done in the home, after school or weekend educational programs. The dinner table is a perfect venue for these discussions. Slavery was the worst and longest evil system ever perpetuated on any group of people. But today, an educated slave is as dangerous as the slave masters of old. One must always be aware that any effort to correct the situation will be vigorously fought and opposed.

Total liberation has not yet occurred, but with a collective consciousness, it is obtainable. It starts with the present reader. Kwaku Person-Lynn is the author of On My Journey Now - The Narrative And Works Of Dr. John Henrik Clarke, The Knowledge Revolutionary

One of the most miscalculated assumptions is that when a person receives a college degree, whether undergraduate or graduate, that individual is now educated.
So true...

Perhaps a better term for most of our people with degrees would be INDOCTRINATED or CREDENTIALED.

Unlike the degreed Black people of earlier generations, most Black youth today seem to come out these universities no more "intelligent" or sophisticated than they were when they went in.
Atleast the ones I've ran into.

Unless they have very high degrees that DEMAND it's recipient have a high amount of intelligence, most of them act and talk no different than the most common among us....and that's a real shame.

Education....TRUE education....is suppose to make one not only smarter and more successful but a better individual all around.

What most of our people receive in these universities is not education but just "credentials"....walking papers that allow them a better shot at the restricted pool of opportunities that really should be available to the public in general.

true,

not all college grads but so many. look at the fools hating afrikans in the media...cosby,these blk republicans ect. college should be free, like it is in other countries.

great info on these modern scientists.

peace

welcome to destee.

Modern education is a fallacy.A fallacy that tells you if you believe and remember this or that (usually made of someone elses knowledge and overstanding not your own) then you are "smart", "gifted", etc. The truth is is that people are born smart and/or gifted,but rarely get the oppurtunity to express oneself to the fullest since the mainstream education(and society) eludes, disregards, and discredits anything not to their liking.Intelligience cannot be measured by modern methods,modern methods require memory which is why you study in order to remember your teachings.

True knowledgecomes from knowing oneself,obviously. The main mistake most "Educated Slaves" make is believing (not knowing,which is very different)that there surroundings,religious beliefs,political affilitation, etc, define their character,which is not true.After beginning myself ,I realized that all people of the sun (people of color) today need to do heavy research into their ancestry and re-evaluate themselves according to their blood culture which may have been stripped(or at least in our case)from them before they were born.

Thank you for welcoming me.

This is my thought on the role of education. I'm thinking about writing a book with short essays of my thoughts and opinions.



My thoughts on education and it’s role in the black community.

We hear about the statics and they all point to the samething. Whether it’s a discussion panel on one of the major news network..Our a group of Blacks in any social gathering it is a subject that is bound to come up. One of the most talked about topics in the black community is the subject of education..We talk about education so much in terms of it having some unique ability to change our lot in this world. I heard it all the time growing up. Go to school get good grades. Make something of yourself , go to college so you can get a good job and be professional..This is something we have all been told sometime in our life by our parents and family. Know on the surface this may seem to be good advice black people. I mean we should aspire to be more and going to school and earning good marks is something we all should want to achieve. But what black people generations over have not taken to any consideration is how should we define what education means to us as a people. We have completely forgotten that education is not some neutral activity that is just for the young. The word education itself has a history to it and that history is unique to a people history and culture.The way they educate themselves flows from the very way their lives have been shaped by their history. This means that the educational experience that a people give to their young is based on how they want to project themselves in this world..A group creates a cirrculum that is based on how their history has evolve them into who they are and what they want to achieve…A group studies how they develop and begin to produce a cirriculum that will maximize their intellectual possibilities.

I think one of the greatest inhibitors in the Africans life is this belief in a myth that we are all the same as whites. That the only difference we have with them is the color of our skin. This is a myth and the continued belief in this has caused major problems in the African psychology. I think Africans hold on to this foolish notion because we have been made to believe that we suffer the way we do because of our differences. So we feel when someone starts pointing out differences their pointing out our defiances. We immediately become defensive because of our feelings of inferiority. But what we have to come to grips with people is the fact that we have suffered because of the pathology of a group of crazy people who in their pursuit to dominate and rule the world have commited major crimes to humanity and has created all types of schisms and myths to justify their own insanity.

Know what does all of this have to do with education in the African world?
First we have to recognize that there is no such thing as equal education. Equal education to Africans in it’s reference to white folks means domination when it is all said and done. Equal education are the same education for Africans in America and the world over is completely irrelevant it means absolutely nothing. I mean just think about it for a second let’s look at the words for example “what does equal education mean to a people, "why can’t you give your children a superior education”? What good is it going to do for a child whose family has been displaced by another family. The family in power has taken all of the childs family possessions and has used them to make profits and become wealthy and powerful. The family in power has not only taking the possession of the childs family they also use the human resources of that child family as well to help maintain their dominance over them. Know if you look at that family situation in order for them to get back what was taking from them the way they must be socialize and educated must be radical. So would it make sense that this family would allow their children to receive the same education of the children of the family that robs them and exploit them. That would not make any sense politically unless that family was not serious at taking back what is theirs. That family must have been made to feel that they do not have what it would take to retrieve what is rightfully theirs. They must believe that their continued survival relays on the family who has robbed them of everything. They must believe that technological they could not compete with the other family and would be wiped out if they truly tried to confront them. So the dominated family just complain enough to get the family in power to be nice and compassionate to them..They try to appeal to their conscoiusceness and make them feel guilty about what they have done to them. But if the family was truly serious about developing the real power it would take to defeat their opponent..The way they educated their chidren would reflect that seriousness..

Is any of this starting to hit home black folks we will continue to be exploited as long as we continue to leave the definition of what it means to be educated to whites. Our continued survival on this earth is not guaranteed people..We cannot continue to live as if things will always remain the way they are today..I hear to many black people talking about how things have gotten better for the races.. Of course if you look at the social situation today compared to 1950 no one in their right mind would suggest that rational was wrong..But remember black folks to have and effective system of domination one must recognize that in order to maintain your dominance with the least resistance one must evolve and change with the times..Remember the saying “The more things change the more they remain the same.” Yes socially things have certainly changed but only in it’s outwardly appearance.

HA!

EXCELLENT STUFF I-KHAN!!

HA! Just excellent!

ROARIN.....

As a matter of fact,

MY Very First post on this forum

(right here)

http://destee.com/forums/showthread.php?t=37080

Was in regards to the Greatness of Prof. Gabriel Oyibo.

It seems here, what YOU have called attention to

are just SOME of the ramifications involved with the

Great Doctors work! Imagine when the dynamics of

the "sciences" THEMSELVES begin to come into play.

A DARK DAY for OUR Enemies FOR SURE.

HETEPU

ROARIN.......

EDIT:

Prof. Oyibo's Personal web-page is

www.geocities.com/ingala1

However, something seems to have happened to it again.

I'LL research this further, (if it's still not working,)

to find again the correct one.

Till then

ROARIN......

Very thought-provoking thread and welcome to Destee brother Ikahn.

I think with respect to education both ikahn and ceo are on point - we must define our own curriculums which produce sufficient knowledge of self for our own children.

In fact some scholars have posed our only hope lies in our ability to do this for our next generation of children...since most of the indoctrination has been so thorough for our adults.

However, there are a couple things I respectfully disagree witih.

One is this persistent use of the word "Slave" in a derogatory reference for black people. It's old, and more importantly, reflects a deep-seated self-hatred.

On the surface it reflects a militancy and a "concious" mind-set, but look deeper...

If you are an African American your most recent ancestors were most likely slaves...to continue to dishonor them with this rhetoric is dishonoring your own self. In fact those who do it while in the same breath proclaiming "know thyself" are missing this self-contradiction.

Secondly, while it is important for us to educate our children in a concious curriculum, enabling them for future action supporting our people, that DOES NOT mean IN ANY SHAPE FORM OR FASHION we shouldn't be DEMANDING they succeed in the existing educational institutions available to them.

BOTH are absolutely required, not one or the other.

Though the truths about their ancient origins are not, the critical disciplines of math/logic, science and technology are race neutral.

Though it is changing somewhat due to 9-11 and the decline of the U.S. world standing, in the past 50 years many of the brightest minds from the world over have come here to receive advanced education in these fields.

Now more are returning with this knowledge to their home countries. The term euros have for this is "brain drain."

We are taking several steps backwards if we manage to dupe ourselves into believing we shouldn't be REQUIRING our children to take advantage of these educational opportunities. We should emulate other ethnic groups who have mastered these disciplines using western resources before applying their knowledge to the benefit of their own.

Our failure to apply the scientific disciplines to our own benefit will accelerate our decline as we would fall further behind on the national and world stage. It is a little known fact that black minds are SIGNIFICANTLY involved in many of the technological and scientific advancements of western science and technology...we cannot afford to go the other direction on that.

It is a fallacy to believe:

Some blacks with degrees aren't truly educated --> thus blacks shouldn't seek degrees but should instead define their own education.

One approach would be to teach our young and grade school children AT HOME a foundation curriculum that positively orients their world outlook and self-knowledge....while still encouraging them to achieve AT SCHOOL.

Again, this is a very positive discussion thread and I am impressed at the way both of you brothers are thinking strategically.

Is any of this starting to hit home black folks we will continue to be exploited as long as we continue to leave the definition of what it means to be educated to whites. Our continued survival on this earth is not guaranteed people..We cannot continue to live as if things will always remain the way they are today..I hear to many black people talking about how things have gotten better for the races.. Of course if you look at the social situation today compared to 1950 no one in their right mind would suggest that rational was wrong..But remember black folks to have and effective system of domination one must recognize that in order to maintain your dominance with the least resistance one must evolve and change with the times..Remember the saying “The more things change the more they remain the same.” Yes socially things have certainly changed but only in it’s outwardly appearance.


I agree completely.

Some blacks with degrees aren't truly educated --> thus blacks shouldn't seek degrees but should instead define their own education.


EXACTLY!!!

It is a fallacy to believe:

Some blacks with degrees aren't truly educated --> thus blacks shouldn't seek degrees but should instead define their own education.

It is not a matter of seeking a degree but requiring a degree. By that I mean that degrees can help greatly in your payment and how you go along with the capitalist structure in this world while not defining yourself with the degree, only seeing it as a steping stone to knowledge of self and furthering the path to positivity of your people.


One is this persistent use of the word "Slave" in a derogatory reference for black people. It's old, and more importantly, reflects a deep-seated self-hatred.

On the surface it reflects a militancy and a "concious" mind-set, but look deeper...

If you are an African American your most recent ancestors were most likely slaves...to continue to dishonor them with this rhetoric is dishonoring your own self. In fact those who do it while in the same breath proclaiming "know thyself" are missing this self-contradiction.

I see what you mean, but since I am not the author of the writing I can only interpret. By "slave" I thinks he means somebody who has no mind of their own and defines themselves by what others will or will not say and do.It is similiar to how cops treat police dogs.

Police dogs are traind hard.They are the toughest, smartest ,kindest,and fastest.But having all of that does not take away the fact that they are no more than a utensil for someone else and may have no knowledge of what to do when a "criminal" shows up except for what the cop (master, or teacher, with no knowledge exceptfor of what someone else told them)
tells them to do.

I do not think it was meant to be(just intrepreting)degrading, but to highlight that the "educated" peoples are nothing more than dogs on a intellectual leash, that can set themselves free at any time but does not realize they have the oppurtunity or are even on the leash.

It all deals with how you measure "intelligeince" and "knowledge".

[quote=kemetkind]Very thought-provoking thread and welcome to Destee brother Ikahn.

I think with respect to education both ikahn and ceo are on point - we must define our own curriculums which produce sufficient knowledge of self for our own children.


Secondly, while it is important for us to educate our children in a concious curriculum, enabling them for future action supporting our people, that DOES NOT mean IN ANY SHAPE FORM OR FASHION we shouldn't be DEMANDING they succeed in the existing educational institutions available to them.

BOTH are absolutely required, not one or the other.

Though the truths about their ancient origins are not, the critical disciplines of math/logic, science and technology are race neutral.

Thank you brother Kemit for those kind remarks. Althrough I respect and agree with some of the things you have written. I must respectfully disagree with some of your remarks.

Your right the situation we are in know as a people does require us to succeed in our present educational institutions. But that does not mean we should blindly look at these institutions as the best are only source of any creditiable academic endeavour. Our goal as a people must be to gradually whine ourselves from the dependency of relying on there systems of education to prepare our children for the future.

I want to look at a couple of things you said.

Though the truths about their ancient origins are not, the critical disciplines of math/logic, science and technology are race neutral. [/color]

This statement could not be farther from the truth. The first thing I want to respond to is the fact that all education is political and when someone tells you that it isn't. They are doing one of the most political things.
You have to ask yourself this math for what, science for who? Why does a people need this type of knowledge and why should it be made a great deal about in any society. One of the biggest tricks whites play on us in schools is the trick of teaching a subject particular math and science in away to make it appear race neutral. Simply because they don't say this is a European science or math class. Does not mean we should foolishly believe that it is race neutral. This type of game when it is played does not allow the African when he enters his or her science class. To see the connection of the two they just go in class and soak up all of the info and assume that they are getting the same knowledge of the european classmate. But when it is all said and done the info will lead the European student in a direction where they will continue to use their science and technology to dominant and rule. While the African students will be lead in another direction his or her knowledge will not and cannot be used to uplift and support his people. The knowledge they gain will only be used by the very same people who educated him. The African will only become a good worker, who can only use his knowledge to support and maintain those who are dominant over him and his people.

I'll give you and example the African will go into a class and a european child will go into that same class. The subject for today will be the old rat in the cage experiment. In the experiment the two children will see what happens to a subject when you dictate are control the social consequences of the rat. By controlling the rat with the reward and punishment scenario. You all know the experiment so I'm not going to go threw all the details. So afther it is all said and done the African child could have a better knowledge of what was going on in the experiment. In fact the African child could have a more scientific mind then the european child. Yet even under that scenario the African child has still not been educated in away that he could use his knowledge to uplift his people. "Why you ask?"

Because unlike the european in the class the African has been taught in away he thinks is race neutral. So he automatically identifies himself with the experimentor who is the teacher as well as his classmate. He sees them and they are both men so naturally he identifies with them. You see this type of thinking is another handicap for the African because we will brag about this type of education. We would look at this scenario and bubble over with pride that this African boy is smart, he even knows sceince better than the european child. But look closely ladies and gentlemen if you really look at the situation of African people all over this world who should we really be identifying ourselves with in this experiment. We should not be identifying with the teacher and the european child. "Why?" Because we are that rat in that experiment people. That's exactly what's going on to Africans all over this world. But we have been made to believe a lie that these subjects are race neutral. So know we can't make the proper connections between the two.

We have all kinds of African doctors, scienctist, and engineers but yet none of these people can effectively deal with, our solve the problems we have as a people. Yet you see other people making all kinds of advancements in science and technolgy. They are using there knowledge to help bring there people into the 21st century. We have fail to make the connection between the two race and technology. And this failure is not by accident but I will get into that later. My point is this math and technology does not come from people just having scientific minds and by people who just know math. Those types of people have to be supported by a people way of thinking. Before you can have any type of scienctific research going on within a group of people. That people must have the political infrastructure as while as the economic institutions to support it. I mean how else our you going to be able to afford the resources you need in any order for scientific research to take place. You have to be able as a people to support that why of thinking. Because the scientist themselves need labs and tools to study and go about there work.

So we are not going to produce African science and technology until Africans are in a position where they can afford to pay for this type knowledge. For us to really benefit from having that type of knowledge the African must produce first the political and economic infrastructure that can pay for and support that way of thinking. And in order for the African to truly benefit from that knowledge not only does he have to be a position to support it. It must also be taught to us in away that represents our true history. Which is based on our reality. So that our scientists, and engineers and doctors will base there thoughts and attitudes on using their gifts and knowledge to solve our problems.

Thank you brother Kemit for those kind remarks. Althrough I respect and agree with some of the things you have written. I must respectfully disagree with some of your remarks.

Your right the situation we are in know as a people does require us to succeed in our present educational institutions. But that does not mean we should blindly look at these institutions as the best are only source of any creditiable academic endeavour.


No sir brother, "blindly" looking at institutions as the "best or only" source of academic endeavor is not something I have advocated.

However, diminishing the importance of formalized education serves us no good.

Until you can show me a people anywhere on this planet achieving anything without it - I'm not able to see any merit in that approach. We may just have to agree to disagree on that.



Our goal as a people must be to gradually whine ourselves from the dependency of relying on there systems of education to prepare our children for the future.

I agree with this in part. We cannot rely on western education to teach our children about their own history or provide them with knowledge of self. In the short-term though, we would be "throwing the baby out with the bath water" if we went beyond that and encouraged our children not to seek formalized education.




I want to look at a couple of things you said.

Though the truths about their ancient origins are not, the critical disciplines of math/logic, science and technology are race neutral. [/color]

This statement could not be farther from the truth. The first thing I want to respond to is the fact that all education is political and when someone tells you that it isn't. They are doing one of the most political things.
You have to ask yourself this math for what, science for who? Why does a people need this type of knowledge and why should it be made a great deal about in any society. One of the biggest tricks whites play on us in schools is the trick of teaching a subject particular math and science in away to make it appear race neutral. Simply because they don't say this is a European science or math class. Does not mean we should foolishly believe that it is race neutral.


I'm not following you here. Does 3x=15 solve differently if you're black than if you're white? Who has been "tricked" here if you believe it does?

Now if you are saying black children inherently learn differently and progress more rapidly when taught by black educators....I've no argument there. But that's involves HOW the subject matter is taught - not WHAT. The WHAT is the race-neutral part. Some groups in the last 50 years have made SERIOUS cultural commitments to its mastery- chinese, indians, etc., while we're going the other direction, running around calling the kids who achieve in school sell-outs.

The only thing I see political about science and math is public schools putting the weakest, most unqualified teachers in those subjects.



We have all kinds of African doctors, scienctist, and engineers but yet none of these people can effectively deal with, our solve the problems we have as a people. Yet you see other people making all kinds of advancements in science and technolgy. They are using there knowledge to help bring there people into the 21st century. We have fail to make the connection between the two race and technology. And this failure is not by accident but I will get into that later. My point is this math and technology does not come from people just having scientific minds and by people who just know math. Those types of people have to be supported by a people way of thinking. Before you can have any type of scienctific research going on within a group of people. That people must have the political infrastructure as while as the economic institutions to support it. I mean how else our you going to be able to afford the resources you need in any order for scientific research to take place. You have to be able as a people to support that why of thinking. Because the scientist themselves need labs and tools to study and go about there work.

So we are not going to produce African science and technology until Africans are in a position where they can afford to pay for this type knowledge. For us to really benefit from having that type of knowledge the African must produce first the political and economic infrastructure that can pay for and support that way of thinking. And in order for the African to truly benefit from that knowledge not only does he have to be a position to support it. It must also be taught to us in away that represents our true history. Which is based on our reality. So that our scientists, and engineers and doctors will base there thoughts and attitudes on using their gifts and knowledge to solve our problems.

This is a solid argument and the end goal is on point, but I don't agree with the routes you propose to get there.

You say we must build a political and economic infrastructure before we could expect any black scientists and engineers to bring value.

Who is going to supply this economic base you speak of? Where is the money coming from? Do the uneducated and unskilled Africans have the means OR the motivation to build these institutions FIRST, before we begin training up our scientists?

Also, you're making broad generalizatons that aren't accurate. When you say,

We have all kinds of African doctors, scienctist, and engineers but yet none of these people can effectively deal with, our solve the problems we have as a people. Yet you see other people making all kinds of advancements in science and technolgy.


you're missing that these black folk ARE making all kinds of advancements in science and technology right here! Go do some research on the thought leaders in any of those disciplines - you'll find BLACK folk right there!

There is tremendous talent and skill in the Black community and we're fully capable of dealing with our problems. Don't get it twisted there is a segment of our community that is STR8 UP taking care of business. There is a group of kids coming up that are STR8 UP protected and watched and nourished and pushed and WILL be our leaders of tomorrow.

So the question is how do we grow that group, expand it for all economic classes. Simply calling educated black folks slaves and saying education is the white man's tool is not the answer.

If it was the folks adhering to that strategy would have something to show for it.