I believe the selection process among African Americans is poor, and our relationships suffer as a result. Immediate gratification is a large part of American (European) culture, and African Americans have adopted this mentality to our detriment. Immediate gratification is evident in the careers we choose and the investments we make. However the most damaging example of immediate gratification within our communtity, is the criteria many of us choose to selection of mates. Many in our community are selecting mates based on superficial aspects (money, clothes, etc), instead of quality of character. It is common in our community to ignore/overlook the family background & personal history of potential mates, as if this information is not vitale to determining whether to be with someone.

When people turn away from the culture of their ancestors, it leads to destructive/detrimental behavior. The African American communty & the state of the black family is a classic example of this. We come from a land, where family was the most important aspect of life. We currently live in a land where family is not considered to be important. The two can not mix, and as we adopt more European view on family & relationships...the disturbing numbers which plague our community (60% divorce rate, 70% of children born out of wedlock, etc) will continue to increase. The only was to reverse this downward trend is to return to the culture of our ancestors. Specifically we need to adopt an African Selection Process:

There are many subtle differences between wedding ceremonies and traditions between the various African countries and cultures. One universal theme however, that one will find in most African wedding traditions is the total inclusion of family. Africans in general believe that a marriage is the joining of two families not just two individuals. It is essential that the two families know and respect each other. Most importantly it is important that the families have love for one another, if the married couple is to have a healthy and lasting relationship.

This is evident in Ghana, where across ethnic groups, people screen their potential partners and their families for any undesirable traits (contagious diseases, criminal backgrounds, common religious background, violent behavior, etc). Family interaction is an important part of the marriage process and both bride and groom will be checked out to see if they are respectable people.

This is apparent in Sierra Leone, where girls (usually between the ages of 12 and 18) attend schools to learn the art of being a wife. At these schools they learn secret codes to help them communicate with other married women, in order to ask advice about marriage. Before a wedding takes place among the Mande the elders of the village assemble with the bride to offer advice and bring gifts.

This is obvious in Nigeria, where the family of the groom goes to the house of the bride to ask for her hand in marriage. Out of respect for the brides family, the family of the groom usually kneels when the enter into the house. The two families then go to opposite sides of the room, while the bride and groom go to the center (accompanied by a representative from both families). The representative from the groom’s family then presents gifts and a proposal letter to the bride’s family, which is responded to immediately. If the bride’s family accepts, then both families pray for a fruitful and happy marriage and the feast together.

If an African selection process is adopted in our community. There wouldn't be any baby momma/daddy drama. Men in Africa view children as a treasure (a gift from God). An African man who takes care of his child is an expectation, not an exception. Also women in African are trained to value respectful/hardworking men, not pimp/playa types. Africans are trained about what to expect in relationship, and receive counsel when problems arise (they aren't encouraged to divorce at the 1st sign of trouble)! These unions are developed for longevity, not instant gratification! Our future lies with returning to our roots! :luvv:

Interesting Pan.

Only some elements could be brought over realistically, but taking some of those tradtions and mixing it with the reality of North American life would help for sure. People need to change their way of thinking mostly....you are right about the instant gratification thing!!

I am in agreement with you that among African Americans the relationship selection is very poor…
The morals are all wrong lack of respect for the family and way of living we have adopted and accepted the European meaning and view of what marriage should be…instead of being true to our self.....so relationships take on a different view….we have ppl marrying for the wrong reasons not the right reasons…. With a fight they ready to split up instead of working it out…lack of communication, respect and love is missing from a lot of these unions...

To adopt an African Selection Process I see that being hard to do.....we have kids raising kids that aint been fully raised them self....I can see it now momma's fixin they daughters up with the drug dealer down the street so her crack be free...smh..but something needs to be done....

ok...thas my 3 cent
Peace
Angel

Thank you Brother, for posting this information. The concept of the 'Process' is actually very beautiful and would, I believe, be much easier to do here than we think. The key is bringing the information forward, bringing the ideas forth, so we will have them in our collective consciousness, to work with. Asante Sana.

To adopt an African Selection Process I see that being hard to do.....we have kids raising kids that aint been fully raised them self....I can see it now momma's fixin they daughters up with the drug dealer down the street so her crack be free...smh..but something needs to be done....

This is true sister MBA, and it is exactly why an African Selection Process needs to be adopted in our community! Like brother OldSoul I also don't think adopting the African Selection Process to African American dating/mating choices would be difficult. It does involve changing our attitudes...admitting that we have a problem! We read articles daily about the problems in our marriages...in our children...in our relationships. This is a solution to that problem (a more practical solution than go get a white man/woman).

The training that Africans receive when choosing who they want to be with is essential. Women in Africa are trained & focused on finding men who will be good husbands and providers. Under an African Selection Process neither mother nor daughter would be interested in said drug dealer. Indeed he would be a pariah in that society (although he still might exist). When we look at situations like child support, single mothers solely raising children....they all come back to one thing: Irresponsible Men. However although many of these men are irresponsible, the reality is most were never responsible to begin with! Therefore the ultimate problem is that women make poor choices in the men they choose (style over substance)!

As much as some women complain publically about the pimp/playa/hustler...the truth is that many (most) are attracted to these types. If this was not the case, such a large number of playa type men would not exist. Men behave in ways that attract the attention of women! To behave in ways which turn women off is contrary to a man's nature! If a large amount of men in the African American community behave in irresponsible ways, it is because a large amount of women are attracted to that type of behavior!

Again the African Selection Process would eliminate this. A playa doesn't make a good provider (what ever money he makes is temporary because he will end up in jail or dead), nor a good father. Therefore a woman would be trained to avoid him. Such a man would also be screen by the woman's family, and he certainly wouldn't pass the test! As a result of this criteria...there would not be a large amount of men behaving in this manner, because they know that they could not get a woman with it. This is a cause & effort pattern! The African Selection Process would make this cause & effort a positive one!

I understand what you saying…but I still would say it is hard.

Our thought process is European, to adopt a different way of thinking means a undo process deprogramming if I may say, we have folks that don’t read the newspaper let a lone have pick up a book since being out of school. So how would we install something that most of our ppl can care less about?Then what generation we start with? How do we get them to pick up a book read and article? How would this change be installed? We still got that same baby momma trying to mate her daughter with that drug dealer. The thing is if they not seeing the problem they not going to admit to it. When you talk on change you have to think of the folk’s attitudes about a change. I don’t want know one picking my mate..and I do believe most feel that way as well.

The raising starts at home. The respect starts at home. The loving and support starts at home. We got kids raising kids in which they follow sometimes in how they were brought up. So if it was not a loving and respectful home then their home they provide for a child may not be loving….not trying to make this hard. So how they gone pick somebodies mate? When they aint got a clue of thier own. Want to understand how would this even be done...If it was gonna happen

Peace
Angel

I think this process should be for those who need it. I do not think my mother knows what I need in a woman, nor does my father. However there are certain parents who have this ability, so I think for those who need these they should adopt it.

The total inclusion of parents in the African Selection Process is meant to ensure the son/daughter is marrying a person of good character. It is also symbolic of the African view that a marriage is the joining of two families, not just two individuals. I have seen many times in African relationships where a woman can go to her in-laws to express concern over her husband's (their son's) behavior. The result is counseling from someone that the husband respects. The same occurs for a man who is having problems with his wife. The result is a lot of saved marriages.

One universal theme however, that one will find in most African wedding traditions is the total inclusion of family. Africans in general believe that a marriage is the joining of two families not just two individuals. It is essential that the two families know and respect each other. Most importantly it is important that the families have love for one another, if the married couple is to have a healthy and lasting relationship.

Hmmph.. guesss I should have known my relationship was doomed when his mother didn't like me, huh? :)

If an African selection process is adopted in our community. There wouldn't be any baby momma/daddy drama. Men in Africa view children as a treasure (a gift from God). An African man who takes care of his child is an expectation, not an exception. Also women in African are trained to value respectful/hardworking men, not pimp/playa types. Africans are trained about what to expect in relationship, and receive counsel when problems arise (they aren't encouraged to divorce at the 1st sign of trouble)! These unions are developed for longevity, not instant gratification! Our future lies with returning to our roots! :luvv:

Beautiful thoughts.. now if we can make it reality in our community, it would be better! Yes, we spend too much time worried about instant gratification and not enough time worrying about the moment/"mourning" after. Like Brother Pan said in chat not too long ago, a man will act a certain way because a woman allows it. So, if we sisters join together and refuse to accept certian behaviors, perhaps brothers will have to change their attitutdes or kiss the sisters good-bye. But it doesn't stop there. We women have to unlearn all the behaviors that this twisted Western society had taught us.

I understand what you saying…but I still would say it is hard.

Our thought process is European, to adopt a different way of thinking means a undo process deprogramming if I may say, we have folks that don’t read the newspaper let a lone have pick up a book since being out of school. So how would we install something that most of our ppl can care less about?Then what generation we start with? How do we get them to pick up a book read and article? How would this change be installed? We still got that same baby momma trying to mate her daughter with that drug dealer. The thing is if they not seeing the problem they not going to admit to it. When you talk on change you have to think of the folk’s attitudes about a change. I don’t want know one picking my mate..and I do believe most feel that way as well.

The raising starts at home. The respect starts at home. The loving and support starts at home. We got kids raising kids in which they follow sometimes in how they were brought up. So if it was not a loving and respectful home then their home they provide for a child may not be loving….not trying to make this hard. So how they gone pick somebodies mate? When they aint got a clue of thier own. Want to understand how would this even be done...If it was gonna happen

Peace
Angel

These are 2 VERY important points to note!

Hmmph.. guesss I should have known my relationship was doomed when his mother didn't like me, huh?

Sister Toylin in hindsight, you can say that your mother in law's disapproval was a sign of hard times to come. However the disapproval of in-laws has become a part of American culture (and in my opinion it is part of what is wrong with American culture). It is common for white people not to get along with their in-laws. Indeed this is so common that it has become an expectation (and the subject of many jokes). Like many negatives within American society, African Americans have over time also adopted this practice.

However, African society is completely different, as getting along with the family of your husband/wife is a basic requirement. Again in African societies a marriage is the joining of two families, not just two individuals. It is a major problem if one does not get along with their in-law. If you think about it, this conclusion is quite logical. How can you profess to love & respect someone, but not respect the people who created & raised them (their parents)? A person's parents play a major part in the man/woman they become. Therefore a potential husband/wife should feel indebted to their in-laws & want their respect...not seek to have an adversarial relationship with them.

Toylin in a African society the marriage between you and your ex-husband probably would not have occured. However one beautiful aspect of this custom is that your mother-law would not have encouraged your husband in his disrespect of you. Husbands/Wives often go to their in-laws with concerns, and get help with their problems. They aren't turned away or ignored as is the norm in America.

Originally Posted by mzblkangel
I understand what you saying…but I still would say it is hard.

Our thought process is European, to adopt a different way of thinking means a undo process deprogramming if I may say, we have folks that don’t read the newspaper let a lone have pick up a book since being out of school. So how would we install something that most of our ppl can care less about?Then what generation we start with? How do we get them to pick up a book read and article? How would this change be installed? We still got that same baby momma trying to mate her daughter with that drug dealer. The thing is if they not seeing the problem they not going to admit to it. When you talk on change you have to think of the folk’s attitudes about a change. I don’t want know one picking my mate..and I do believe most feel that way as well.

The raising starts at home. The respect starts at home. The loving and support starts at home. We got kids raising kids in which they follow sometimes in how they were brought up. So if it was not a loving and respectful home then their home they provide for a child may not be loving….not trying to make this hard. So how they gone pick somebodies mate? When they aint got a clue of thier own. Want to understand how would this even be done...If it was gonna happen

Peace
Angel


These are 2 VERY important points to note!

Mr. Blak:

Those were very important points made by sister MBA. However I don't feel that we should be scared of changing people's attitudes. Indeed the solution to almost every problem in the African American community (African communities worldwide) involves changing the way people think. This is not easy, but it is possible. If people can be programmed to think one we, they can also be deprogrammed. It simply involves patience & education! I really don't believe we have a choice, because the only alternative is to continue to watch our communities self-destruct. This is not an option!

You definitely got a point about this not being an option Pan. I would love to see this succeed....in my lifetime. What would be the first step though? There is much ground to cover.

Brother Blak:

I see this as a grass roots movement! In many African societies children attend special schools, outside of their official schooling, where they are trained in the specific aspects of their culture. In addition to lessons about how to be a man/woman, to are taught the proper selection of a mate. These schools are taught to children only, because in Africa the parents have already learned these lessons. I would hope we could initiate similar schools in this country, of course this could not be instituted in mass, but I don't believe any change in attitude could. We have to start locally, improve one neighborhood, and work on another!

Thank you Mr blak……
Thanks Pan

I don’t think it would be a scary thing to try and change people’s attitudes, but what about the way of thinking? All folks don’t think alike or is easily moved…I agree it will take patience and education….but we still got the ones who have not pick up a book or paper since out of school or even know the history…

Yes you can start with one community at a time but what good will that do...if they really don’t see the problem? What would you be deprogramming thas where the problem will lay…

I fully understand what you’re saying but as you know our ppl are very diverse and don’t like no one thinking for them or telling them what’s right or wrong. Pride already stand in the way…Before you can change a culture you need to change the ppl's way of thinking...and I still see it being hard to do…

So it goes back to, what generation would you start with? Would it be a mandatory thing? How do you take those mommas who want to hook up their daughters with the drug dealer? When they are set on doing what they want to do….after all it was planted in us that America is the land of the free, opportunity and full of justice for all….to deprogram this statement is work all on its own….

I fully understand what you’re saying but as you know our ppl are very diverse and don’t like no one thinking for them or telling them what’s right or wrong. Pride already stand in the way…Before you can change a culture you need to change the ppl's way of thinking...and I still see it being hard to do…
So it goes back to, what generation would you start with? Would it be a mandatory thing? How do you take those mommas who want to hook up their daughters with the drug dealer? When they are set on doing what they want to do….after all it was planted in us that America is the land of the free, opportunity and full of justice for all….to deprogram this statement is work all on its own….

MBA;

This is an excellent observation! In my experience working with teenagers, I have come to realize that no matter how disfunctional a home is, one of the hardest things you can do is tell someone: "Your Mother is wrong"! People's basic value system does indeed come from the home, and it is difficult to break this influence (whether it is positive or negative). Nevertheless it is still possible to change these attitudes, and the change is going to have to occur with the youth.

This is the price we pay for the freedoms we demand.

Queenie :spinstar:

I read some commentary about arrainged marriages in Africa, and ran across an important viewpoint:

In Africa, marriage has always been seen as a union between two families, based on this, the families involved, are always expected to have a say. This is based on the fact that Africa is a society of virtues, most families feel that they have a name to protect, and will want to know the 'family' their daughter or son is bringing home. However modernity has reduced the influence of parents on choice of their children but has not totally stopped them from making their feelings known.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/4425551.stm

I feel this is an excellent point of view, one that has seemingly disappear within the African American community. Marriage as a union between two families. That during such a union the type of family (their virtues) should be considered. I for one feel that such considerations could only improve marriages and relationships in our community. What does the rest of the family feel on this?

Up until the 60's and free love divorce was not at all common. People went into marriage with realistic expectations. So many now arn't prepared for the struggles they may have to deal with.

I don't agree at all with arranged marriages. I will try to raise my children the best way I know how. But, in the end, when they're grown, they'll make choices that I may not agree with.

We can look at the way some Africans view marriage and family. But, I think we need to realize that it's not perfect their either. Other wise they wouldn't be having all the problems with AIDS. It certainly isn't spreading it self, it's being helped along the way with infidelity and pre-marrital sex.

Up until the 60's and free love divorce was not at all common. People went into marriage with realistic expectations. So many now arn't prepared for the struggles they may have to deal with.

I don't agree at all with arranged marriages. I will try to raise my children the best way I know how. But, in the end, when they're grown, they'll make choices that I may not agree with.

We can look at the way some Africans view marriage and family. But, I think we need to realize that it's not perfect their either. Other wise they wouldn't be having all the problems with AIDS. It certainly isn't spreading it self, it's being helped along the way with infidelity and pre-marrital sex.

Indya if you actually read this thread neither arrainged marriages, infidelity, or pre-maritial sex are being endorsed. What is being endorsed is more family involvement in mate selection & changing what is valued in a mate. Do you have any thoughts on that?

P.S. By the way AIDS is doing a good job of being spread in the good ole USA just like it is in Africa. AIDS in Africa can be contributed as much to a lack of medical resources than it can to risky behaviors!

I read some commentary about arrainged marriages in Africa, and ran across an important viewpoint:



http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/4425551.stm

I feel this is an excellent point of view, one that has seemingly disappear within the African American community. Marriage as a union between two families. That during such a union the type of family (their virtues) should be considered. I for one feel that such considerations could only improve marriages and relationships in our community. What does the rest of the family feel on this?

Pan, this is where arranged marriages was brought up. I gave my oppinion. NO, infidelity and pre-marital sex wasn't endorced and I never said it was.

People do need to change their views when picking a mate. Many people pick a partner and don't consider how hard marriage can be or even if they're compatable. Also it does help if everyone gets along with their in-laws.In the end children grow up and they will either accept their parents values or reject them.

Pan

Problem is, unlike most marriages in Africa where both the bride and groom come from the same tribe.....we as AfroAmericans come from such a varied back ground that usually when we get our respective families involved conflict always breaks out.

The groom comes from a family of criminals and ballers, the bride comes from a family of Boule degreed negroes who look down on anyone not making six figures.

Or one family comes from the Eastside and the other from the Westside.

Sometimes it's best to just leave families the hell out.

Problem is, unlike most marriages in Africa where both the bride and groom come from the same tribe.....we as AfroAmericans come from such a varied back ground that usually when we get our respective families involved conflict always breaks out. The groom comes from a family of criminals and ballers, the bride comes from a family of Boule degreed negroes who look down on anyone not making six figures. Or one family comes from the Eastside and the other from the Westside. Sometimes it's best to just leave families the hell out.

Make no mistake about it brother Ralfa'il after 400 years all African Americans have become the same "tribe", rather ethnic group, because Africans consider the term tribe to be insulting. However in the first example you listed: Wife from a respectable family, Husband from a family of criminals & ballers....in this case, the wife's family has a reason to object! This actually was the entire point of the thread. About family background & values, because people do take on the customs (positive & negative) of the family they were raised in. Now if you gave Rich vs Poor, I may not object. However I have a daughter, and I wouldn't want her to marry into a family of criminals & ballers myself! In the second example Eastside vs Westside is not a reason to do object to a union. One thing I think is important to point out however is that the African view of marriage: That it is the joining of two families not just two individuals. This is a not a matter of opinion, it is a fact of life! The nosey mother in-law & opinionated father in-law is a European invention!

I think if you're from a strong family, you're doing this anyway. And getting along with the in-laws is pretty much a given in order to keep the family unit healthy.

Pan

Make no mistake about it brother Ralfa'il after 400 years all African Americans have become the same "tribe", rather ethnic group, because Africans consider the term tribe to be insulting. However in the first example you listed: Wife from a respectable family, Husband from a family of criminals & ballers....in this case, the wife's family has a reason to object! This actually was the entire point of the thread. About family background & values, because people do take on the customs (positive & negative) of the family they were raised in. Now if you gave Rich vs Poor, I may not object. However I have a daughter, and I wouldn't want her to marry into a family of criminals & ballers myself! In the second example Eastside vs Westside is not a reason to do object to a union. One thing I think is important to point out however is that the African view of marriage: That it is the joining of two families not just two individuals. This is a not a matter of opinion, it is a fact of life! The nosey mother in-law & opinionated father in-law is a European invention!


I've heard before that some Africans find the word tribe insuling, and some Native Americans as well. Perhaps it's the imagery that the word "tribe" conjures up when one thinks of it. Like the thought of a bunch of half naked uncivilized people running around in the wilderness. But when I use the term I'm not thinking of any negativity or derogation in any way, it's just another category within a social system to me.



Now that's one part about Eastern culture that I don't like, the family is involved too much.

Although too much individualism is no good for society, I'm against the concept of extended families because it passes too many negative traits and habits down from one generation to the next.

I stress the so-called nuclear family.

As long as it's legal and done properly, 2 (or 3,4,5) people should marry eachother and become ONE family or a NEW family and leave other people outside the union.

From my own experiences, one of the reasons relationships and families break up is from too much outside pressure from other family members. Trust me bro, it ain't just a white man's invention.

Now that's one part about Eastern culture that I don't like, the family is involved too much. Although too much individualism is no good for society, I'm against the concept of extended families because it passes too many negative traits and habits down from one generation to the next.
I stress the so-called nuclear family. As long as it's legal and done properly, 2 (or 3,4,5) people should marry eachother and become ONE family or a NEW family and leave other people outside the union. From my own experiences, one of the reasons relationships and families break up is from too much outside pressure from other family members. Trust me bro, it ain't just a white man's invention.

Brother Ralfa'il I apologize for taking so long to respond (I know you don't like to wait); however, I just saw this post. One of my favorite African professors once told me that there are no words to describe Aunt or Uncle in Africa: One's Uncles are considered to be their father. One's Aunts are considered to be their mother. One's Cousins are considered to be their brothers & sisters. This is the African concept of family! I didn't know if my old professor was referring to Africans in general, or was he just describing his particular ethnic group. Since then I have talked to several Africans (including my wife) about this philosophy, and they all confirmed it. The "nuclear" family is a European concept! At the very least it isn't an African concept. Don't take my word for it though brother. If I remember correctly you stated that you'd like to marry an African woman (from Senegal or Ghana). If this wish comes true for you, then you'll find out what I'm talking about 1st hand.

Pan

Brother Ralfa'il I apologize for taking so long to respond (I know you don't like to wait); however, I just saw this post. One of my favorite African professors once told me that there are no words to describe Aunt or Uncle in Africa: One's Uncles are considered to be their father. One's Aunts are considered to be their mother. One's Cousins are considered to be their brothers & sisters. This is the African concept of family! I didn't know if my old professor was referring to Africans in general, or was he just describing his particular ethnic group. Since then I have talked to several Africans (including my wife) about this philosophy, and they all confirmed it. The "nuclear" family is a European concept! At the very least it isn't an African concept. Don't take my word for it though brother. If I remember correctly you stated that you'd like to marry an African woman (from Senegal or Ghana). If this wish comes true for you, then you'll find out what I'm talking about 1st hand.


Ahhhh brutha man, the only time I get anxious for a response is in a heated argument.
Other than that...I'm just chillin'.


What you said makes a lot of sense because from personal experience most of my cousins were like brothers and sisters to me, especially when we were children. And when my mother died, not only did I get closer to my aunts but they started acting more motherly and authoritative toward me in the same why my mother was.


Perhaps our intense affiliation toward family as black people ain't just cultural, but genetic and will always be in our nature. I just want to know that my wife is loyal to me and I to her without so many voices whispering in our ears and sabatoging our relationship.

Speaking of African women, the fact that so many sistaz from Africa are so loyal to the men of their own nationality is another reason I'm so against these extended-families.
To many won't give a brutha like me a chance simply because I'm not from the same tribe and know the customs.

You know men, most of us don't really care about a woman's ethinic background...and some of us find it exotic for her to be foreign. But most women like comfort and a man who knows her culture.

I just want to know that my wife is loyal to me and I to her without so many voices whispering in our ears and sabatoging our relationship.

Speaking of African women, the fact that so many sistaz from Africa are so loyal to the men of their own nationality is another reason I'm so against these extended-families.
To many won't give a brutha like me a chance simply because I'm not from the same tribe and know the customs.

You know men, most of us don't really care about a woman's ethinic background...and some of us find it exotic for her to be foreign. But most women like comfort and a man who knows her culture.

I find that if you make the effort to learn about the particular woman's ethnic group, culture, and country....her music....her food (which is extremely important)....her values. If one makes an effort to learn this, any resistance to a "foreigner" breaks down from both the woman & her family. Doing this is particularly important in making a positive impression on her father, which you will definately need to do. I had to do this with my wife. When we were dating, before the relationship could progress further...her father, mother, and brothers came from Spain (her parents moved there from Africa) to meet both me & my parents. Indeed they had to not only approve of me, but my family as well (they did). To marry my wife I had to then gain the approval of her Uncles on her father's side (father-uncles) and mother's side (mother-uncles). Obviously I gained their approval as well. Actually I found the entire process to be a beautiful one, although it probably helped that I always viewed marriage to be the joining of two families, not just two individuals (even before I started dating an African woman). To me this is how the dating/engagement/marriage process should be!

Pan

You are too on point about impressing a woman's father to get to her.

When I meet black people from the East I always like to kick knowledge and have deep conversations with them, I try to let them know all young AfroAmerican men aren't ignorant of other cultures.

But when I go to Canada and do this with older men from African countries like Somalia or Sudan who have daughters or younger sisters....many of them are so impresses that they practically OFFER me their hands in marriage.

As protective and defensive African men are about the women in thier families, they seem to be just as bold about trying to hook them up with men they percieve as decent and marriage material.



Unfortunatly me and a lot of other black men are so used to dealing with women without fathers, we don't feel comfortable about the old fashioned "sit down in the livingroom with daddy" routine.

I actually never had a girl bring me to her father to formally introduce me and we have that "shotgun" talk.

Maybe this is why so many men disrespect their women, they know there are no other men in their lives that care enough for them to actually defend them if they are hurt.

Unfortunatly me and a lot of other black men are so used to dealing with women without fathers, we don't feel comfortable about the old fashioned "sit down in the livingroom with daddy" routine.

I actually never had a girl bring me to her father to formally introduce me and we have that "shotgun" talk.

Maybe this is why so many men disrespect their women, they know there are no other men in their lives that care enough for them to actually defend them if they are hurt.

This is definately why so many men disrespect their women! When no one is around to protect a woman's honor, predators sense an easy target. This is one of the primary reasons I fight so hard to restore the man's role in the African American family.

I believe the selection process among African Americans is poor, and our relationships suffer as a result. Immediate gratification is a large part of American (European) culture, and African Americans have adopted this mentality to our detriment. Immediate gratification is evident in the careers we choose and the investments we make. However the most damaging example of immediate gratification within our communtity, is the criteria many of us choose to selection of mates. Many in our community are selecting mates based on superficial aspects (money, clothes, etc), instead of quality of character. It is common in our community to ignore/overlook the family background & personal history of potential mates, as if this information is not vitale to determining whether to be with someone.

When people turn away from the culture of their ancestors, it leads to destructive/detrimental behavior. The African American communty & the state of the black family is a classic example of this. We come from a land, where family was the most important aspect of life. We currently live in a land where family is not considered to be important. The two can not mix, and as we adopt more European view on family & relationships...the disturbing numbers which plague our community (60% divorce rate, 70% of children born out of wedlock, etc) will continue to increase. The only was to reverse this downward trend is to return to the culture of our ancestors. Specifically we need to adopt an African Selection Process:

There are many subtle differences between wedding ceremonies and traditions between the various African countries and cultures. One universal theme however, that one will find in most African wedding traditions is the total inclusion of family. Africans in general believe that a marriage is the joining of two families not just two individuals. It is essential that the two families know and respect each other. Most importantly it is important that the families have love for one another, if the married couple is to have a healthy and lasting relationship.

This is evident in Ghana, where across ethnic groups, people screen their potential partners and their families for any undesirable traits (contagious diseases, criminal backgrounds, common religious background, violent behavior, etc). Family interaction is an important part of the marriage process and both bride and groom will be checked out to see if they are respectable people.

This is apparent in Sierra Leone, where girls (usually between the ages of 12 and 18) attend schools to learn the art of being a wife. At these schools they learn secret codes to help them communicate with other married women, in order to ask advice about marriage. Before a wedding takes place among the Mande the elders of the village assemble with the bride to offer advice and bring gifts.

This is obvious in Nigeria, where the family of the groom goes to the house of the bride to ask for her hand in marriage. Out of respect for the brides family, the family of the groom usually kneels when the enter into the house. The two families then go to opposite sides of the room, while the bride and groom go to the center (accompanied by a representative from both families). The representative from the groom’s family then presents gifts and a proposal letter to the bride’s family, which is responded to immediately. If the bride’s family accepts, then both families pray for a fruitful and happy marriage and the feast together.

If an African selection process is adopted in our community. There wouldn't be any baby momma/daddy drama. Men in Africa view children as a treasure (a gift from God). An African man who takes care of his child is an expectation, not an exception. Also women in African are trained to value respectful/hardworking men, not pimp/playa types. Africans are trained about what to expect in relationship, and receive counsel when problems arise (they aren't encouraged to divorce at the 1st sign of trouble)! These unions are developed for longevity, not instant gratification! Our future lies with returning to our roots! :luvv:

Thank you for sharing this!

This speaks to the state of our present-day Black family or rather, lack thereof.