Hi all,

Love the site, and been meaning to hear your thoughts on this
one. As an African, born and bred in Africa, I find it very interesting when individuals, who sometimes don't even know where Afrika is on the globe go on about what it is to be African.

Motion:

What to you personally refer to when using the word African?

The reason I ask this question is when most our brothers and sistas land in Africa for the first time, their expectations and preconcieved ideas of what Africa is like are usually far from the reality.

Ntombi

Ngumbi ... Welcome and Thanks for joining us. I was not born and bred in Africa but when i think of her, when i use the word African, my Spirit connects with all those who have gone before me. All my Ancestors are wrapped up in the word Africa / African. I feel a spiritual kinship with her and all those who are African. I have never been to Africa but i can't imagine being disappointed in any way, shape, form or fashion, regardless of how things might be when i get there. To simply stand, breathe, and touch Africa would alone be a pleasure beyond measure.

I hope i've answered your question.

I have a question for you, if you don't mind. You specified that you are an African, born and bred in Africa. Do you consider those of us who are not born and bred in Africa, somehow less African (if African at all)?

I'm glad that you love the site and hope you will make yourself at home here, because you are.

:heart:

Destee

Originally posted by Ngumbi:
What to you personally refer to when using the word African?I too welcome you to one of the premier Black websites on the Internet.

^5 Sister Destee...

In addition to Sister Destee's brilliant narration, Brother Ngumbi, I personally refer to the word "African" whenever I am asked to describe myself. My response is always: I am a Black man born in America of African descent...

Thank u all for a warm welcome.
In response to Destee's question, there is no easy answer to this question, however I think 'African' is not just a label, it's a way of life, tradition, language, history, heritage etc. and I must say it must be a challange when u are so 'removed' from it, I consider those who are not born and bred in Africa 'of African descent'.

I find that the tone of describing Africa is inappropriately romanticised. Africa is war torn, poverty stricken and an empty shell whose rescourses were systematically raped by the coloniser. As much as it home to some of us, it is irrational to look at it through rose tinted glasses as it is no longer the paradise you seem to describe.

no disrespect, but a brother i met from south africa told me something once:

anybody from africa that looks at your black skin and doesnt recognize you as an african doesnt understand what it means to be one anymore than they think you do.

Hello ngumbi and welcome!

You've asked good questions and they give some of us, once again, another opportunity to express our views on who is African. But let me ask you...should it really matter what indigenous Africans think about what African Americans call themselves?

Don't you think what's more important is what each of us believes we are and why doesn't it make you 'proud' that some of us identify with our mother land and not this foreign land (America)?

Seems to me your concern or criticism is misplaced. I would be more concerned if we thumbed our noses up at Africa and didn't want anything, real or imagined, to do with her.

Many African/Americans are not naive about Africa and her history even though many of us have never had the pleasure of setting foot on her soil. What you might be mistaking as romanticism I think is a genuine sense of pride and devotion to a continent and her people, of which we have something in common. We are well aware of the importance of Africa's role in the history of mankind and many of us want to assist in her rebirth so that she can assume her rightful place as a powerful nation.

Join us in this struggle ngumbi. Fighting side by side with us makes you part of the solution and not part of the problem!

Peace!

First off Ngumbi
i really like the start of your
post even though not intended it started with my very point,so I will use it as a platform
to air my views on
What is African? I believe the coupling of the word "African" and "American" helped turn it into a cheap whore
(the name)Im sure after jayz finishes degrading African women and glorifying western forms of transgression, he calls himself "African" American (dear, dear),
I have tried to make this point for some time
so that we recognise the destruction the blind use of the title does. But i know that is not what you were implying so (as i flip it orn ya)
If i wernt so darn(YUCK,see what you got
me saying Destee, "darn")comfortable where
im sitting i would stand up and give
XXPANTHAXX a standing ovation.
He said:
"
It is very unfortunate that you dwell in the negativity imposed on our home Africa; it is also ironic that a seemingly intelligent African like yourself would seek to do our oppressors work and bidding, namely by continuing to seek to divide and attempt to cause dis-unity among our People."

Too right bru, one cannot come and tarnish
this beautiful spectacle of a Land (that we have God Given birthright to) as a barren war torn dump. Y'see the problem is:
That is your experience, wherever your living. so might i suggest you travel to the far East,maybe Zanzibar or Tanzania or even waltz further
South and see the gorgeous treasured sights
of Zimbabwe. Unfortunately for you some of us dont just talk it but weve walked it
extensively and have some wonderful
reasons why we should NEVER deny our
Ancestry and heritage, much to the upset of
our slavers and oppressors.

I would really like to believe that you are a
proud African but it seems today that
much of the Garbage (hype)America has fed the rest of the world has led them(like a magnet) to believe that the grass is greener over here, which truly truly saddens me. Whenever you have these
thoughts again just remember those of us
who call ourselves African do not share the
desires of most westerners and only seek
spiritual fullfilment and to stop the madness.

One final thing before you rush out here
seeking the Amerikkkan dream.
Mans Downfall started with the Apple
and will certainly end with the BIG APPLE.
(Note how all hollywood movies point you here, for what, you should ask?)

So
"hurry hurry Step right up."









*

Africa contains a multitude of different cultural, geographical, religious, linguistic, and even colonial powers and influences that have moulded us into very unique variations!

With that said, I have three questions:

1. So which variation is closest to you?
2. There is no generic! and even if there was, what makes you
think that you would belong to such a category?
3. Why are you not in 'The Motherland'

Ntombi

1. Black
2. Black again
3. OOOOH good question!

For questions 1 & 2 you really must try to stop
reasoning my reasoning in good old
eurocentric fashion,these are matters
of the Soul and not debatable.

as I said before
ITS MY BIRTHRIGHT!
Fortunately I am a little more secure than other black people, where the thought of your
questioning would have them resort to saying
"I aint African even
Africans dont want us."
In which i reply dont
think you are, know you are.
LISTEN BUDDY YOU ARE NOT THE GATE
KEEPER.
This is the same argument i have with blacks
and Islam they often negate a massive part
of our traditions and disciplines because the
arabs dont recognise them.

I,
HESAID
AM EVERYTHING!
and i get it, even if you or anyone else dont,
I'll still remain attached to anything that lifts my spirit and engraves a potent part of our
History on my Soul regardless of whether a dumb Arab or ignorant other invites me
IM STAYING
Its my covenant with GOD not you.
Question 3. I will be in the Motherland,soon
when my work is done here,lets just say
just before God wrecks the Sh**.
Beware;
Politics and philosophy are two of the evil P's
and they were used to keep people running
round in circles,so as clever as we seem we
will continue talking and doing very little walking. (What ya need to do is call my bluff
and offer a brother to buy some land)









*

Quote (ngumbi):

“As an African, born and bred in Africa, I find it very interesting when individuals, who sometimes don't even know where Afrika is on the globe go on about what it is to be African.”

Peace brother ngumbi,

These questions you pose in this thread are not necessarily invalid, but I have some problems with the intent.

First of all the words “bred” and “variations” are used here as if you were talking about specie of plants and breeds of horses.

Who defines, who and what is an African? Where does Africa end and where does it begin? As you know, Europeans have played with these definitions geographically, ethnically, and racially for the last 400 hundred years.

NOW HERE, WE GO, AGAIN, WITH THIS CONFUSION.

Believe me, I have heard this queried before; fore, I have Yoruba family members and friends, though I am a BLACK MAN (of African descent), born in the United States.

First there was the Egypt/Middle-east designation game, then the Hamitic language/racial identity game, then the sub-Saharan groupings and now Diaspora’s exiled/enslaved African compared to the continental colonized African. We are probably more divided by these types of schisms, than any other group of people in the world.

Paraphrasing, Malcolm X, “If a cat, who’s placed in a oven, has a litter of kittens, do you call the kittens, “biscuits”!

I THINK NOT!

Many Africans from the continent (not all!) have an elitist and arrogant view of their selves, as it relates to Africans who are not. We are not totally ignorant of how you sometimes SEE YOUR SEVLES.

Say brother, there are Africa born Africans who are

“MORE BRITISH THAN THE BRITISH

AND MORE FRENCH THAN THE FRENCH”

Africans in the continent are going through identity crisis, just as much as ALL Africans have worldwide. I have talked to some Africans from the continent about indigenous African religion and they called it, “devil worship”.

Based upon African tradition itself, we are given our ancestral legacy by birthright, no matter how ignorant or smart we are. The Jews are given their right to heritage and land, without question, based upon birthright and they have been exiled supposedly 2000 years (not to give credence or validity to Zionism). They had to even, reinvent and relearn a modern form of the Hebrew language.

But here WE ARE queried about our authenticity.

IS THIS THE INQUISITION AGAIN?

These questionings sound like the bean counting and test Africans, in the southern United States, had to contend with, in order to vote. Remember the old saying,

“WHEN YOU LEARN ALL THE ANSWERS, THEY ALWAYS CHANGE THE QUESTIONS”

(This statement usually referred to the unjust examinations of our viabilities, by racist white people!!)

Being an “African” has always been a worldwide reality. Study the Olmec culture of ancient Mexico and read THEY CAME BEFORE COLUMBUS by Ivan Van Sertima.
African culture is so broad and intrinsic, multi-dimensional and multi-faceted, that It’s more about what’s in your head and heart then identifying European cartographical parameters on a map!

The ancestors are influencing me, to ask YOU a question:

“WHO DIED AND MADE YOU THE SPECULATOR OF AFRICAN IDENITY “

I once went to a discussion pertaining to the EVIDENCE OF AFRICAN ARTIFACTS IN BRAZIL and how, at what level of discovery does it prove the African-ness of Black Brazilians. The speaker was constantly trying to compare these artifacts with pre-colonial indigenous African carvings, symbols and meanings, and using that as the ONLY litmus for the presence of African culture and “true” African people in Brazil. But I asked him, “What came first, the artifact or the African” because I figured anything an African puts his or her hands to with an African-centered conscience and spirit, which can only be induced by our spiritual ancestors, in a context applicable to our surroundings, is an African cultural expression.

But in closing my brother, I respect your right as a free African to openly dialogue with your people. As my Benin friend (a master woodcarver) once said, with tears pouring down his cheeks, invoked by listening to some Afro-Cuban Lucumi chants to the orishas, “surely, blood is thicker than water”. For, all he could do was contemplate the rhythms, that embraced the soul of OUR HOME. AFRIKA.

PEACE, LOVE AND ASHE,

Sun Ship

P.S. – Here’s a page from Sun Ship’s Believe It or Not. “I remember when the 1968 World Book encyclopedia, I believe in the section about the races of Africa, called the West African “Negro” the only “true Negro” based upon his cephalic index and other physical features.” (Unbelievable isn’t it.)

And there you have it.








THE END.

Well said Sun Ship....IM AN AFRICAN!!!!

Out of curiosity how do you veiw whites and asians that call themselves african? are they more african than those from the americas and europe?

God forgive the sick minds of our people,

Look, you are viewing who you are, from a white man’s anthropological view of yourself.

I haven’t met an Irishmen yet who speaks Gaelic. But still, he calls himself an Irishman.

Most Euro-Americans and Europeans no longer speak the original language of their ethnically designated groupings. But, they have no problem telling you that they are Welsh, Bavarian, Belgium and so forth. Many of these countries were broken up, at one time, into smaller diverse ethnicities, with their own sub-languages and/or dialects, much like Africa is, or was in some cases. Have you ever heard anyone speak Brit, of course you haven’t, because the British (Englanders) speak linguistically, a Germanic language derived from their Angles and Saxon ancestors. The original Britons, no longer exist. But this doesn’t stop the Anglo-Saxons from calling their selves Britians (Britons).

What is truly the American culture? Even American scholars have a hard time with that question. I’ve heard the white man in America call himself, white, Caucasian, Anglo-Saxon, of European descent, American, German, German American, Irish and anything that he pleases and NO ONE CHALLENGES HIM, NOT EVEN HIS EUROPEAN COUSINS. Man, what is wrong with us!!!!!


Look, an African, is not a breed of human or a zoological specimen!!


The National Geographics’ and the Wild Kingdom’s approach to cultural anthropology, ARE OVER, SISTERS AND BROTHERS!!


This kind of__WHAT IS A TRUE OR PURE AFRICAN TALK, SOUND LIKE WHITE FOLKS!!

NO WONDER WE ARE IN TROUBLE.

I’m sorry, Isanusu, you have been bamboozled and deceived!!

YOU NEED TO READ MORE!!!!!!!


Peace, Love and Ashe,

Sun Ship

@Sunship
Exactly.
Why oh Why do our pessimist minds
destroy any form of solution to our current state?
ARE WE SCARED?

"Am a stay r,right hyere wit masser,he
go protec me, i..i..
I aint Afrikeen!"

Yes of course we have been away for a while
but you gotta feel it in the spirit and
become your own personal little African
self again.
Anyway
bro whatever, to each their own,but when
that wave of Kharma hits (Oh and it will hit dont kid yourselves now)
M-F's wont give a **** where in Africa they came from or for that matter what language is spoke, s'long as they safe.
Yeah we spoilt Alright,
All we do is politic on why we aint African.
man Pleease!

Who's getting on ma ship?
(Noah before the flood)






*

<<<Out of curiosity how do you veiw whites and asians that call themselves african? are they more african than those from the americas and europe?>>>


There is a difference between an indignous and a non-indignous African. Those white and asians are the same people who invaded the continent and slaughtered black (indignous) africans centuries ago. They are not African, they've just been living in our homeland for a period of time.

Easier still!

"The answer is in the question!"

"They're whites and Asians"

:confused:







*

XXPANTHAXX
OH Sh...
Telepathy!
We gettin there.

N
G
U
M
B
I


W
H
E
R
E


R

U

?






*

I had to amuse myself by waiting for the venom to be spewed on Ngumbi before I posted my thoughts. First off, I think Ngumbi is right. If you were born in a place radically different from Africa then you have no idea what it is like to have grown up and lived there. For those of you who have 'walked the walk', have you ever LIVED in an African nation? have you had to deal with the lack of infrastructure, the inherent safety issues and other problems affecting 90% of the continent? I'm not talking about going on vacation there for a little while but living there and dealing with the same issues that Africans deal with on a daily basis. This is where you misty eyed romantics get it all wrong. This is where, once again, you do the white man's bidding. Let me turn a derrogatory snipe back around on it's originator: "Yes missah white man!! I bee's goin' back tuh aferickuh!! pleez don bee's whippin' me's no moh!! I bee's leavin' yo white cuntree!! I aint no THREAT to you's!!! Wonder what I mean by that? Whites want us to focus on the notion that we aren't part of America, that we somehow are less than them and should leave ( or in their best case scenario, be re-enslaved) and go back to a place that cannot even support the people that are there already. Many of you in this forum need to stop doing the white man's bidding and stop believing these klan paid hucksters that are doing everything they can to assure themselves a nice easy job in the big house.
While I have your attention, let me make one more point. As a whole, Africa is in crisis, and this cannot be denied. How may I ask can Africa take her place in the world without support? In the past, history has shown us that most other countries and governing bodies were only interested in Africas resources and realized that in order to USE Africa as a source of cheap _______ (fill it in with whatever you want, it probably wouldn't be far from the truth) the people would have to remain in a state of perpetual poverty and political upheaval. How might I ask would this change without a viable financial engine to provide funding to build the infrastructure necessary to make Africa financially independent? Here's a more important question: how could we as a people do this without using the best tool we have at our disposal, the wealth WE generate here in America? How WOULD we be able to accomplish this if we cut ourselves off from the wealth building engine that is the American economy? If we as a people finally saw the light and instead of focusing on silly mysticism ( you ready for that?) and this destructive black media culture that we seem to want so badly we would be in a much better position to uplift ourselves and Africa. But you know what? From what I've seen here, I don't think you all are really ready for that.

Tetsujin, you ask a lot of good questions but I don't see any concrete suggestions from you. You offer little NEW information about the condition of Africa that many of us aren't already aware of in spite of some of our "misty eyed romantic or silly mysticism" as you snidely refer to it as. I don't quite follow your notion that people who have a "love" for Africa is doing the white man's bidding. I haven't seen a strategic plan of action drawn up here in this thread that says that if some Black people move to Africa, that they won't be able to help build or rebuild a strong infrastucture or economic power base there. I think there's evidence that other people have been known to live in one country and invest accumulated wealth in others that they feel culturally connected to. What did you read here to presume that this couldn't be done by us?

Maybe I'm confused by what you wrote. Please help me to understand if I am.

Peace.

No sis let me...
He has a point about living in Africa but
as I said I think he and those who think alike concerning our HOME are truly afraid.
Let me Flip it back again.
If one knows his spirit and Knows the plan of
the Almighty he also knows that the
(as you put it)Whiteman has a keen interest in
Africa -this country that-
Quote:
"cannot support the people that are there"

"CANNOT SUPPORT THE PEOPLE THERE"

Why?

Maybe because we are supporting the country
that strips it Fu...ing bare.

Sorry.. Tets but its MAD!

Just one point to note.
1. White America has never ever, ever, ever, ever,ever supported the notion that blacks
could leave America.Matter of fact Brother
Malik Shabaz was killed when he spoke of this. WHY?
(Brother you must reverse your thinking and
think as the enemy would remember he came from you, there isnt a plan he can design that you cannot penetrate)
The reason is he needs you here to make his
Shi.. function
Ahah! exactly!
Wouldnt Africa benefit from the labour of
our people if we up and left.
Would not America fall (QUICKER)
Do you honestly think that is'nt the ultimate
payback for being dragged across the world
to work for free. Are we not just paid slaves.
We just made the prison home (I know..
some of us were here already yada yada TRUE.)
Ysee the slaver thinks in generations. You see
today he sees tommorow and :confused:
believe me he knew you'd forget.

Look for the Petersons Projection map of the
world in its true Dimension and see how Africa
swallows America and all its neighbors in its
vast size and then tell me where you at.

We gotta stop idealing and be real, quickly.
Dont fool yself As hard as it is to admit
America is FALLING!
It aint gonna fawll on me.














*

Also the slaver is deceptive this should answer
why America appears so large on a standard
map. Its all for appeal. Even the myth that
America is running the global economy is an
ideal pulled over our eyes.
Great Britain never gave up the land or Rule
in America,Australia,Canada or anywhere
else in the world.
DECEPTION.

It's pretty easy from where I'm standing, NN. you don't go off to battle unarmed. My point about the economic plight of blacks that would choose to move to Africa is this: once your there you would not have access to the financial vehicles that would be needed to build the countries infrastructure. we can best do this from where we are.

You wan't some cohesive plan from me? I hope you didn't ask me hoping that I couldn't answer. Whatever your motivations, here you go:


The Not So Easy Way to Develop Africa

by Tetsu, no rights reserved. reprint at your discretion.

Now more than at any other time in the history of America do blacks have the opporitunity to help in the investment of the African economy. We control more capital and own more businesses than ever and this is during the time of greatest freedom for us in this usually heavilly repressive society. First let me say that blacks should support black businesses. We should not accept anything but the best from our business community but at the same time we should make sure our entrepeneurs understand that they are building the global black economy. We should encourage our businesspeople to expand their markets to new areas in an effort to increase their available capital. In the process they would be creating an iron business community, one that could alter the policy of nations and make the investment in Africa possible. At this time we should make one thing crystal clear to our entrepeneurs: they will not be supported if they do not invest in Africa. Ther should be no exceptions to this rule. A consortium of African and black leaders and businessmen should be created to handle the finer points of pressuring the U.N. and the heads of African nations and other groups to begin the process of stabilization of governments to make the process of educating the people and bulding the roads, schools, water treatment plants, farms, civic structures and the like possible. This should coincide with the union pressuring dictators and genocidal maniacs to leave office. As a part of this plan, the biggest part, Africans must be educated in large numbers so that primary and secondary education can become a reality for a greater number of Africans. The consortium of leaders and businessmen could pay for this and also leveredge the U.N. for the funds to offset the costs. Once you have a teaching body in place, it would not take long to train the youth so that they can effectively take the jobs in the new African economy. A strong workforce equals a strong economy and a strong economy has staying power and the ability to grow.

With an educated group in place throughout the continent, AIDS education and prevention can begin in earnest. As it stands, The U.N. earmarks money for programs that increase AIDS awareness and offer things like condoms and AIDS treatment in Africa. With a little inexpensive research the consortium of leaders and businessmen and women could find more effective ways to stem the spread of the virus through Africa. If these people are respected and can be shown to be truly affectionate about Africas plight, they could have a lot of clout in the argument that prostitution and the lack of use of condoms by African men should change. AIDS is the greatest threat to African stability and the consortium should petition the U.N. to recieve the money that it allocates to AIDS programs directly. This way the consortium could more effectively distribute the programs to the places that need the money and education most. With a growing infrastructure, this would be more likely to succeed.

I'm going to anger a lot of people with this next area but, well I don't really care so-
There is a real problem with the political stability of Africa that will have to be adressed in the very near future. Muslims and Christians have been putting their dirty little mitts in Africas cookie jar for hundreds of years. These people have looked to Africa for no other reason than to fatten their pockets and to extend empire. In my plan, this would end IMMEDIATLY. Not tomorrow, not next week but NOW. This consortium should make it very clear that religious domination and the spread of radical elements that wish to destabilize change and real progress will be dealt with. Most of these elements are religion based and these people would turn the clock back on any progress that Africa could have. I don't believe that the free expression should cease in Africa but I don't believe that any one group has the right to annihilate another because they look at their god from a different side of the fence. If the consortium has played their cards right then it would make it easier to getthe blue helmets behind them to help them make the more radical elements sit down.

One last thing. White America wants us to believe things like leaving America is the answer to our problems instead of addressing them by fostering education within our community and strengthening our familial structure. While we are being bamboozled by hucksters that tell us to shoot each other to fornicate like rabbits to do everything but focus on what we should be doing which is to build a strong black community, white America gets stronger everyday. Mass exodus is not the answer to the problems our society faces. It would not help Africa either. All the white man would do is to label us a terrorist threat and isolate us from the world and prevent us from making Africa into the great supernation that it should be. As I said before, stop doing the white mans bidding and realize that our place is right next to him where the missle that would take us out would take him out too, so to speak.

Dagg that was quick!!!

I see you've been in the Lab!
I have no problem with the Idea of building
the economy from within America (FOR NOW).
This is being done as we
speak but there comes a time when we have to physically extract ouselves from America for there will come a time where it will be
unhealthy to dwell there. My concern is
(speaking more relaxed now)
How many of us will be able to move when the
time comes?
We tend to reason things out forever. We
need to know when to take physical action.

The problem of religious diversity is only
continued through a western influence. I believe the deceptive views of God have been placed by capitalism.
If indeed one chooses to practice what he will
by way of worship it should have no reflection on the economy. what is needed is true leaders,who care not for wealth regardless of their religion because if a mans heart is pure his rule will reflect this. The problem is'nt religion but GREED. In Ghana Muslims and Christians live at peace.
Til Bush gets there.
Also look how many succesful brothers from
America and England are buying land in
Ghana,the times coming.

I still believe we need to be there to share our
experiences so the puzzle will form.
That part cannot be done in America.






*




*

Originally posted by Tetsujin
You wan't some cohesive plan from me? I hope you didn't ask me hoping that I couldn't answer. Whatever your motivations, here you go:

Tetsu, I'm not that type of sister. If I asked you to explain, you can believe I was serious in that I was seeking more information from you. The thought that you couldn't answer my questions never crossed my mind.

Now, thank you for the comprehensive response. You've shared some very good points that are provocative but I'm wondering what it would take for such a plan to be put in action. You cover a wide spectrum: education, health and welfare, religion, and the economy. It sounds like a total overhaul in mindset for Black people within and between one nation (America) and a continent (Africa). The ideology of your plan is not that complicated but the reality of it ever coming into existence--well, I'm just wondering what you propose be done to get such a plan started.

For example, the consortium that you speak of--how do you invision it being be set up and who decides who will participate in it and the decisions it makes? What comes first and how do we begin?

Originally posted by Tetsujin
First let me say that blacks should support black businesses. We should not accept anything but the best from our business community but at the same time we should make sure our entrepeneurs understand that they are building the global black economy.

Originally posted by Tetsujin
We should encourage our businesspeople to expand their markets to new areas in an effort to increase their available capital. . . we should make one thing crystal clear to our entrepeneurs: they will not be supported if they do not invest in Africa.

Originally posted by Tetsujin
A consortium of African and black leaders and businessmen should be created to handle the finer points of pressuring the U.N. and the heads of African nations and other groups to begin the process of stabilization of governments to make the process of educating the people and building the roads, schools, water treatment plants, farms, civic structures and the like possible. This should coincide with the union pressuring dictators and genocidal maniacs to leave office.

Originally posted by Tetsujin
With an educated group in place throughout the continent, AIDS education and prevention can begin in earnest.

Originally posted by Tetsujin
This consortium should make it very clear that religious domination and the spread of radical elements that wish to destabilize change and real progress will be dealt with. Most of these elements are religion based and these people would turn the clock back on any progress that Africa could have. I don't believe that the free expression should cease in Africa but I don't believe that any one group has the right to annihilate another because they look at their god from a different side of the fence. If the consortium has played their cards right then it would make it easier to getthe blue helmets behind them to help them make the more radical elements sit down.

Originally posted by Tetsujin
Mass exodus is not the answer to the problems our society faces. It would not help Africa either. All the white man would do is to label us a terrorist threat and isolate us from the world and prevent us from making Africa into the great supernation that it should be. As I said before, stop doing the white mans bidding and realize that our place is right next to him where the missle that would take us out would take him out too, so to speak.

Finally, I wouldn't put down or criticize people here who have never set foot on African soil but have a genuine love for Africa. I don't think that we all have to see things with our own eyes in order to begin to understand the plight and conditions of a people and a nation. Why is it so wrong for us to identify with the continent of our ancestors? Because we do, why do you presume that we don't know what modern day Africa is going through?

Any type of action must start with a decision. Decisions come from ideas which are fed by information. Call it romantic notions, call it mystical but we have to start somewhere don't we? Many of us want to know the real Africa and hopefully, they will have the opportunity. We want to see all of her healthy and strong and some of us here want to be a part of the revolution that makes that happen. Don't be overly concerned about what we call ourselves, but take note of what we answer to.

This is getting a bit away from the topic of this thread so maybe this is a discussion that belongs in another or it's own thread.

Five things that I doubt will be dealt with:

1) I have talked to many African brothers over the years, But It seems with all this concern about African Americans participation in Africa’s future and with all of the human resources in the African Diaspora, there would be, at least, a few Africa nations, that would offer DUAL CITIZNESHIP to Africans in the Diaspora. Israel has it for the Diasporic Jews.

2) Why aren’t whites constantly questioned about their romanticism and mysticism when it comes to Africa? Whites have romanticized, mystified and capitalized off their images and (false and strange) ideas of Africa, more than Africans have. But our brothers, from the African continent, spend all of their time attacking Africans in the Diaspora, about what they believe. I wonder why? This is interesting. Any of Africa’s dismal conditions have never stopped whites from vacationing, prospecting or even living in Africa.

3) How did the Europeans feel about Europe during the DARK AGES? This was Europe’s darkest hour. IT LASTED FOR CENTURIES!! Did the potato famine of Ireland, stop Irish Americans from thinking about their beloved Ireland. Did the dismal history of Germany, from the poverty and peasant revolts of the 19th century to the failed Aryanist governments of the 20th century, stopped the Germans throughout the world, from thinking about, their beloved Deutschland?

4) What about Africans’ (from the continent) strange, romantic and mystical ideas about AMERICA? Did it get quiet in the church?

5) And last of all, Africans in the continent have NO ownership over the African beliefs and ideas, of Africans, throughout the world.

OUR ANCESTORS WHO LIVED AND DIED FOR OUR SURVIVAL, DID NOT, LEAVE US IN THE CHARGE OF THOSE WHO DID NOT!!!!!!!!



We can debate on the backwardness of some of Africa, as it applies to its infrastructure, but from this thread, there is NO DEBATE ABOUT THE BACKWARDNESS OF SOME OF THE AFRICANS, THEMSELVES.


Ashe!

Sun Ship

Exactly
Please dont ignore SunShips comments. I think
you need to digest this in its Spiritual sense and
refrain from the mental & political angles that
keep us seperated.











*

Brother Sun Ship is always on point!!!

Ashe!

Sunship...I'm bowing down here.

as a black man born in america, assimilated over the course of multiple generations and indoctrinated with the cultural mores, it is perplexing to think that i am anything but american. i have virtually no knowledge, at least not on a first hand basis, of the religion, culture, gods, politics, social hierarchy, etc etc with respect to africa. i have read books, watched tapes and listened to lectures, but i have not lived africa. how would i fare in an africa that is foreign to me. my guess is that it would be much like taking me out of the city and putting me on a dairy farm. i would be totally out of my character. the dialect, language, customs, traditions, climate, politics etc would all be foreign to me. africa is part of me. american is who i am.

" i would be totally out of my character. the dialect, language, customs, traditions, climate, politics etc would all be foreign to me. africa is part of me. american is who i am."

Dont be so sure of that.
the television has a fixation with making you believe that.
Its a matter of Spirit,in the west we deal with
way too much contemplation and fear and least

TRUST.
:heart:















*

@Rosetta
Technically your right of course there are many
other names for Africa but thats another
can of worms,its a case of
start where we have the most association,
we have to have something that we can
relate to so we can advance to that point and
agree together on the (Neccesary) renaming
but for now there arent too many of our
people who can relate, I mean look how hard
it is to Keep people to relate to AFRICA.

Im so tired man!
















*

lol Hesaid, We're on the same page.. Im just tired of being tired!

Y Ou KnOw!

Wit threads like these you
realise that unity is a
FANTASY!

"The most basic FACTS!"










*

LOCI(Laughin out cryin inside).








*

Shoshana Johnson
AFRICAN AMERICAN!
LOL.

Because it doesnt appear to be the issue at the
moment. Shoo we cant even agree on the place
let alone the name.










*

Is the original poster truthfully a black African in Africa or of the caucasion persuasion???

emprezz,
I was wondering the same thing.

For those who are questioning my race, I am very African, South African to be more specific , Zulu by tribe and cosmopolitan by circustances and now by choice. The inspiration behind the post was that not only did I want to know what your views are on the subject but it was also the fact that as much as I reside in the motherland, being brought up in Johannesburg, and that resulted in my first language being English, my second being the opressors language (Afrikaans) and my third language being Zulu, which I rarely speak and not by choice but we have 11 official languages and so communication can be problamatic at times.

I work for one of the big global consulting firms, drive a German car, have access to world class technology etc. and because of the great devide of the haves and the have nots, rural areas where people still practice their traditions and customs and yes the fact that I am guilty of not falling into that category as both my parents were born in the city. Am I considered African by my own people, sadly the answer to that question is NO. Why you might ask. Their reasoning is that I can't even begin to appreciate what living the 'African' way truly is and the fact that I have not taken the time to learn about who I am and where I am from is a big problem with them. The fact of the matter is most people who reside in the Southern Regions of Africa are also misplaced people, the true natives of the country I call my own are the San and the Hottentots. My point was and still is, is the fact that as much as Africa is home to me, Even Africans face many challenges belonging to South Africa and imagine that it must be a whole lot more difficult for brothers and sisters who are so far removed from the Motherland.

With that said, my intention was never to cause the 'great devide' or to define the level of Africaness in people but to let you know that one's Africanness is not only questioned in individuals not residing in the motherland.

Ntombizodwa Gumbi

Peace Brother ngumbi,

Africans need to stop this foolishness! What I have called in other post, the National Geographic and Wild Kingdom analysis of the authenticity of cultural, tribal and ethnic credibility. There are no other people in the world that has been scrutinized and categorized like Africans worldwide and then through some sort of sub-consciously induced propaganda or subliminal suggestion we internalize this scrutiny and skepticism of what is Black and/or truly African and what is not. WE ACT LIKE WE ARE SPECIMENS, instead of a diverse and every changing progressive people. Cultural sociology is unwittingly replaced with a pseudo-anthropomorphic zoology, constantly exploring the so-called “pure-true African hypothesis”.

Africans have never promoted cultural stagnation or societal isolation. Europeans do this job on all first world people of color (so-called third world), as they, in turn, glorify the fact that Western Europe is an advance civilization because it is always innovating, evolving and progressing.

WHERE IS THE ORIGINAL AND AUTHENTIC EUROPEAN (TROGLODYTE, CAVEMAN, AND POSSIBLY NEANDERTHAL)?

What is a culturally correct Irishman, German, Englishman, Frenchman or Spaniard?

What are the cultural validities of Afrikaners?

It is one thing to reexamine and embrace our aboriginal and cultural roots, but we need to construct our own criteria governing, what is necessary for African cultural consistency.
We just don’t understand how much field anthropologist and racist ethnologist have affected us. This constant cross-examination of Blackness and African-ness is very destructive to our future goals, as a progressive force to be revered and reckoned with.

THEY (WHITE PEOPLE) DIVIDE AND CONQUER ALL THE TIME.

DIVIDE AND CONQUER ALL THE TIME.

DIVIDE AND CONQUER ALL THE TIME.

DIVIDE AND CONQUER ALL THE TIME.

AND THE SAD PART IS, THAT WE FALL FOR IT.

Wake up Black people!!! P-l-e-e-e-e-e-e-e-e-e-e-e-e-a-s-e (?)

Peace, Love and Ashe,

Sun Ship

This discussion thread is really interesting. I've been reading postings put up by different people and I have a few comments that have come to my mind. I am a first generation African born in America, my mother is Liberian and my father is Nigerian. This is not meant to insult anyone in this forum, but it always amazes me the amount of people who will call themselves Africans , but who know nothing about Africa or Africans and when faced with an issue dealing with Africa to which they are in a position to help, they look the other way.
I am currently a college student in Massachusetts and I have seen this happen at my own university many times, where people wear the name "African" on their sleeves but do not really care about what is going on in Africa. For instance, I was part of a group that sent money and supplies to an AIDS hospice in South Africa. Although, many people seemed interested in helping out, when it came down to the important heavily weighted matters, it was other Africans who were there and a few White people. This is not something that I have seen happen once. I have read threads stating that Africans have never helped them, so why should they help us. But I beg to differ, because the world's largest rubber plantation (yes plantation) is in Liberia (owned by Firestone, the only place not destroyed by the war), the majority of the world's diamonds (even though imported from other countries to the US) come from Africa, cocoa, mohagany and a very large portion of the world's natural resources have come from Africa. In addition to this the poor people who are suffering in Africa right now are probably not the one's whose ancestors sold other Africans (who at the time did not consider themselves Africans because that was a word Europeans called all peoples living on the continent). The African's whose families were heavily involved in the slave trade, are probably the wealthy, well-to-do families in Africa right now. Remember only the wealthy and the chiefs benefitted from slavery, the general African population was just as much in danger of being sold as people who were sold, some people just had worse fates than others.
* * *
As many of you know by now my mother is from Liberia which is currently war torn, although not all of Africa is like this and there are many enjoyable aspects of Africa, it bothers me when people romanticize Africa. I know this has been stated time and time again through out this forum, but I feel the need to say it again. Romanticization of Africa is something that I can fully understand, especially from the wonderful stories that my parents have told me, however I feel that a more realistic view of Africa must me taken.
* * *
In my personal interactions with many Black or African peoples whose roots in America go deeper than mine, I am oftentimes offended. This is not to say that there are not arrogant Africans, but I am not one of them. It really hurts me when a person of African descent mocks my name or laughs at the meaning of my name or makes jokes about naked Africans, and so on and so forth.( This is not just the uneducated, but people I have met in college, people who should know.) It is things like that which anger some of my friends (who are first generation Africans born in America also) and me causing us to shy away from African Americans. This is not because of hate but simply, I don't want to feel as though I have to constantly defend myself and my culture. And when I do defend my culture, I do not want anyone feeling as though I am being arrogant, when I simply am just proud of my heritage. This is not an experience that I have had solely with African Americans but also Caribbean Americans, who have insulted me unknowingly, assuming that I am of Caribbean descent, "anything but African."


Another point that this discussion has brought to mind is what people expect African people to look like. Many people do not understand that we too have diversity in terms of skin tone and racial make up. This may seem like a far stretch from the conversation, but it is amazing to me how many people will assume, rather incorrectly that I am from Haiti or Jamaica and similarly assume that my mother is Hispanic. So she constantly finds herself caught in embarrasingly funny situations where someone is speaking to her in Spanish. My mother was born and raised in Liberia West Africa (part Americo- Liberian part Kru), but her granfather is Lebonese. This is a concept that is hard to grasp for many people who do not understand why anyone Lebonese would be in West Africa (ignorant of the fact that many Arab traders live and marry women there). I have another friend who "looks half-Hindi Indian" but is actually Ghanian and is constantly plagued with the question "what are you?" and when the response is "Ghanian" people are very shocked. My point of all this is to ask "Why?"
People are so stuck with this romanticized view of Africa and this wonderful land full of Black people, that they sometimes forget that there are other people of other nationalities there. There are White people, Asian people and Black people some of which have returned to live on the continent. With all these different people, racial mixing is bound to occur, and so the "typical African looking" African person is not always the face that a person may encounter when meeting someone from Africa. Therefore it is a real nuisance to me when people have this picture of what Africans look like and make incorrect assumptions about our ethnicities. The same way that African Americans come in all shades and hues, we do also.

Finally (sorry for the long posting),When I think about all of these issues and I then hear someone who was not born in Africa and does not have parents born in Africa call themself African, it makes me wonder if it is sincere or something that is just popular for the moment. This is not to say that I do not embrace Black people who consider themselves Africans as my fellow Africans, but the issues that I stated above make me wonder "why?" and "what does African mean to these people?"

Oleremi
Your statements are poor, poor, poor,
and selfish. I am not gonna make this
long just deep.
Do you know that the

CIA need men like you?
Being privileged to be born with a direct
connection to the motherland does in no way
make you a gatekeeper!

Come on you cant be serious
read the thoughts of this Family
These are not your average americans.

It is very naive of you to even think that
your argument over African commitment would
hold weight HERE.
In this place
YOU THINK THATS AIR THAT YOUR BREATHING NOW?

OKAY america has some not so commited AFRICANS
(cos thats what we are)
but just the fact that
people post here should tell you that
we/they are searching. Your attitude is no
better in this age than the Brother way back
then who sold us TO AMERICANS.
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE dont take it upon
yourself to try to disrupt the dreams and aspirations of SOULS seeking unification or
reconnecting with what they once were
connected to.
Remember you know nothing outside what is
expressed as scribbled digital letters on a website in cyberspace.
FEEL MY SOUL WHEN I TELL YOU THIS
AND FEEL IT GOOD

I AM AN AFRICAN!
This I know.
Regardless of where I manifested this time.
**** man Brothers tryna take you
away from the Motherland like its
Crack or suppen.

For the sake of Black unity Worldwide
Please can you Show that
commitment where its needed cos it aint
doin much but destroying peoples hopes
and disconnecting our People here.

(and take Isanusu wit ya)


:maddd:






*

I find this debate about the African-ness or African-ism of people of African descent disturbing, at this time in our history. Before there was a land or continental designation defined as Africa, people with the phenotype of West, Central, and East Africans dominated and/or originated some of the most advanced cultures in the world. Lets celebrate the fact that people with dolichocephalic heads, profuse melanin, Steatopygia and facial prognathism (and originators of all features!) were more than just the footstools of history and gave the world its spirituality, religions, medicine, culture and high artistic expressions.

Africans can debate everyday on what is African or what is not. But realistically, there has never been a collective African cultural design that all Africans could use to judge their selves by. There is more diversity between East and West Africans, than there is between the West African Yoruba and the Yoruba descendents of Cuba or Brazil. Some of my relatives, who are Black Panamanians, grew up eating fu-fu (a starchy West African dish) in their native Panama.

What’s so interesting, is that, when African Americans were voluntarily going to Ethiopia, in the late 1930’s, to fight against the colonial Italian occupiers and when African Americans were protesting, being arrested and going to jail to exacerbate the end of apartheid in South Africa, no one squawked about how African we were or were not. To appreciate what African Americans have done for the liberation of Africa you need to read more.

Brothers, the legacies of Malcolm X, Kwame Nkrumah, Marcus Garvey, Patrice Lumumba, Billie Holiday, Dr. Cheikh Anta Diop, Celia Cruz and Fela BELONG TO ALL OF US.

Some of the comments made by Africans (from the continent or N. Amer.) in this thread are based more on ignorance and colonial brainwashing, than concern. Brothers, don’t you know that people of African descent are dieing from AIDS at alarming rates all over the Pan African world (including North America).

It’s not that some of the posts in this thread are right or wrong, they are just convoluted.

This “true African” debate is from another time and is very childish, archaic and pseudo-racist.

The minds and thought processes, of Black people, are not only sometimes beyond perplexing, but are down right scary.


Whatever,

Sun Ship

I said all I need to say above.
Apart from sorry if you feel I am Mocking
personally I call it passion Brother.

"Hesaid:
He doesn 't have to take me to Africa. I've been 3 times."
(me 4 times from west to farthest east)
I didnt mean to Africa I meant where serious convincing is needed
for example Rappers who think theyre Pimps,
am sayin theres alot more useful work to do there.
then go to the carribean and see
the same people the same cultures, then go to nigeria and see how JAMAICANS
RESEMBLE NIGERIANS and tell me we aint the same people)Now can you absorb what im saying your point is POINTLESS.
At this point I must ask you
are you saying WE should not call ourselves African?
if so i dare say Malcolm,Garvey and also half the
Rastafarian community
would disagree leading us where?
I believe nowhere in the western world do you find such
patriotism even amongst blacks who detach from the Slave master
but keep 1 shackle on just in case. Dont worry bro AMERICAs going down
thought you would know it was
all hype.

If I conceed into your belief then I must ask you where and how were
the best parts of our Human Character shaped and where and how did we lose it?
What name? what direction? What location? God ?rah rah rah...
(You cant tell me it was'nt the little traces of Africa (that we kept against the wishes of our slavers) still instilled in the
southern states. where you think cornbread came from covering heads in church.....)
If the Answer to the latter is america then you have this debate
otherwise
Goodbye.



Still with Love
(and a bit a dissapointment)

Originally posted by Sun Ship
I find this debate about the African-ness or African-ism of people of African descent disturbing, at this time in our history. Before there was a land or continental designation defined as Africa, people with the phenotype of West, Central, and East Africans dominated and/or originated some of the most advanced cultures in the world. Lets celebrate the fact that people with dolichocephalic heads, profuse melanin, Steatopygia and facial prognathism (and originators of all features!) were more than just the footstools of history and gave the world its spirituality, religions, medicine, culture and high artistic expressions.

Brothers, the legacies of Malcolm X, Kwame Nkrumah, Marcus Garvey, Patrice Lumumba, Billie Holiday, Dr. Cheikh Anta Diop, Celia Cruz and Fela BELONG TO ALL OF US.

It’s not that some of the posts in this thread are right or wrong, they are just convoluted.

This “true African” debate is from another time and is very childish, archaic and pseudo-racist.

The minds and thought processes, of Black people, are not only sometimes beyond perplexing, but are down right scary.



Again Brother Sun Ship, you force the debate into a more conscious direction. Ashe!

I agree, there's no right or wrong response to the question of what you call yourself. Whatever it might be, the important thing is, what you do when its time to answer the call.

Peace!

Hesaid
first of all I am not a man I am a woman. I don't know what put the idea in your mind that I am a man. Secondly my comments were not meant to offend anyone or to define who is African and who is not . I think Isanusu is the only person who understood my point of view and I wish that you would re-read my posting. The comments I made were because I am hurt and offended by the lack of knowledge that SOME people, who call themselves Africans, have about Africa. I did not personally insult anyone and I made NO comment, I repeat NO comment about anyone who posted here on this site. I commented on people that I have had direct contact with. I have no problems with you disagreeing with me, but if you are going to disagree with me , at least try to understand my point of view. I did take time to write what I wrote and did not personally attack anyone.

In response to NNQueen my comments on Africans contributions to current day society were meant for a thread posted on a previous page, not to bring up a debate on whether or not African Americans help Africans or vice versa. I'm sorry you misunderstood me.

Jambo!
Na im playin!
I guess you came in when I was just
tired a this.


Anyway

you to your way me to mine
(La kum de nukum walli a deen!)

Welcome &
Sorry & much Love and Peace!



















*

Sister Oluremi,

After reviewing my own post, I have to first apologize if I, even indirectly implied, in any way, that you were a man. If so, I reiterate. You have my most humble apology. But, you may want to read several of my post on this subject and then re-read your own post. I am not here to insult, dismiss or devaluate your comments. I have a very close relative who’s from Nigeria and have a lot of respect and admiration for his character. Sometimes, on a variety of subjects, we disagree and sometimes we don’t. You seem to be a very intelligent and socially aware Sister. But there’s more to the divisions and diverse views of Africans and Africans in America, than just the ignorant and off-color remarks of (some) small-minded Africans, regardless of where they come from.

When you see cats barking like dogs and robins quacking like ducks, you must conclude that something has gone, horribly, wrong in the nature of these creatures. This is analogous to Africans verbally attacking their own aboriginal cultures and roots. Through my own Nigerian relatives, I am constantly interacting with brothers from the continent and you should hear some of their degrading comments about their tribal and cultural beliefs. You would think they were talking about witchcraft and barbarism, as they try to disassociate their selves from, self-perceived, ancestral “cultural heathenism”. They to, are also dealing with a sort of cultural schizophrenia. Matter of fact, I had one friend from Benin, refer to a sermon at an African American Baptist church, he visited, as resembling West African tribal ritualism (“Voodoo”), in comparison to the very conservative Euro-Christian church he belonged to, in Africa.

Africans, from the continent, do not have clean hands or a perfect record when it comes to the problems of brotherhood, understanding and unity, between Africans exiled in North America and those of them who have arrived recently.

The whole world knows that African American culture is unique and is part of a larger African cultural expression, from religion, visual art, to music, to cuisine, to dance. I am well studied in some of these areas and received my legacy directly from my own “tribal” elders, in these idioms, in the confines of my own “tribal” community (Africans brought to America via the slave trade).

SLAVERY DID NOT DESTROY THE INNER-RHYTHMS OF OUR CULTURES OR WHAT SOME HAVE CALLED THE GENETIC MEMORY OF AFRICANS.

EUROPEANS DON’T WANT YOU TO ACKNOWLEDGE THESE CONNECTIONS AND SIMILARITIES OF YOUR INTERNATIONALLY DIVERSE FAMILY!!

You may not be interested in the shortcomings of Africans, from the continent, as they relate to international pan-African unity. But you have no idea of the psychological destruction and cultural genocide that was performed on Africans worldwide, after the initiation of the trans-Atlantic slave trade and after slavery itself. The demonstrative evidence of diabolic monstrosities and spiritual demoralization is overwhelming.

If you need references and sources, I may be of some help.

Believe me, Sister Oluremi, we need compassion, concern and respect to come from both sides of the Atlantic, and let’s keep communicating with, educating and celebrating each other. I’m sure the spiritual ancestors of all Black people, from Africa and beyond will embrace our endeavors.


Peace, Love and Ashe,

Sun Ship

P.S. - If Africans could love one another, with the same love and understanding we give to others, It might invoke HEAVEN ON EARTH.

Greetings to the board. I've been following this thread for some time and decided it was time to tell My Story. I was born and raised (not bred) in SAVANNA(H), GA. (I conveniently put parenthesis around the 'H', to show relation to the Afrikan word). Savanna(h) imported African slaves from the Caribbean and the Continent. Savanna(h) is complete with Islands and Swamp/Marshland. This is ideal for growing rice hence the "Lowcountry" being mainly composed of Rice Plantations. West Africans (the ones who survived the middle passage) were brought there to work the rice fields since they were already experts at it. (Savannah was named so because of the resemblance of the land to certain places on the coast of West Africa <NOT a coincidence!>) The Patriarch of my mother's family was an ex-slave who built a community in rural GA for the rest of his family who existed at the time in the 19th century. His mother was an Afrikan who was born on the continent. The patriarch of my father's family did the same thing in another rural GA town. You see, I'm part of the FOURTH generation of Afrikans who were enslaved here in GA. Have I ever been to Africa? No, I have not had the pleasure as of yet. Am I not an Afrikan? OF COURSE I AM!! Not in the PC definition. But to all "Black" people who would deny my birthright, I pose ONE QUESTION: If extraterrastrials (let's just say Martians) landed anywhere on Earth, procreated, and after a couple of generations would they still be martians or earthlings?? I know this is a bit of a stretch but the laws still apply. Just like brother Malcolm said, putting kittens in the oven DON'T MAKE THEM BISCUITS. Now, there are some "Black" people who feel the need to deny themselves and everyone else (misery loves company) of their ancestry. One more question, my lil' cousin is half Nigerian half Georgian. Is he an Afrikan? The thing is you would never know it unless he told you. My Brother-in-law is Haitian and whenever he comes to GA (not a big concentration of Haitians) He is "mistaken" for being from the Continent because of his skin tone, accent, right down to the food that he eats. And we all have heard some knowledge of the traditions that Haitians have kept to this day. But according to some, Haitians are not Afrikan because of where they are on a map(???) I have news for SOME of you. Right across the Savannah River in South Carolina there are some AFRIKAN settlements that have survived. Yes, I'm referring to the GEECHIE/GULLAH nation, who still speak a "pidgin" or creole dialect mixed with english AND West African words. Sorry for the long post but I HAD to get this off my chest. I'm tired of the division. How in the HELL are we supposed to UNITE and we're jabberin' and slobberin' profusely about who is what? What are YOU? http://www.ccpl.org/ccl/gullah.html http://www.islandpacket.com/man/gullah/ http://www.blackconsciousness.com

To Brother Isanusu,

The question is not have I experienced perceived spirits, but do the spirit perceive my experience, in this world. Believe me, I know it does. For, I have a special relationship with the spiritual world.

And by the way Brother Isanusu, If it's taking you, more than, 42 years to become an African, you might need some new African "rituals", or maybe, It takes more than rituals to be yourself.

Sun ship

AUM
Although it appears your deep and meaningful post went over our heads
I Hear You!!!!
Totally!
Welcome my Brother and let us not let
these western Phylosophical squables ever divide
our AFRICAN selves again but then again this to
me is Judgement day and rather than being drawn into this,(for me) its best to carefully observe individuals possitions on the matter so before the (proverbial) **** hits the fan you know
who is who!
One thing I ask is what inspires people to come
together but I see everyones struggle motives
are different these things are often discovered in
hindsite. After all some just deep down want a
piece of the Apple.
Even though its rotten.


Peace.







*

Peace Brother Isanusu,

Though, like the majority of Black people in this country, I was raised a Christian and a Baptist, but today, I am not a Christian, in the ecumenical sense. I have studied the Judeo-Christian religion for its historical, socio-cultural and anthropological relevance, or lack thereof, as it applies to African-Americans and the other ancient African-Asiatic cultures i.e., Canaanites, Sumerians, Kemetic Egyptians, etc.

First of all, I have found out, for one, that apologist, racist revisionist and Greco-Roman scholars have extensively revised the true nature and cultural sociology of the original African-Hebraic people. Secondly, though I reject corrupted Christian doctrines and ideologies, that have been, rammed down the throats of our people, I have observed how Black people, once again, through genetic memory and spiritual intervention, display unique non-European ritualism, in their relationship and worship of the Most high and I accept the spiritual nurturing and gratification I received from my upbringing. For, it was the catalyst that opened my mind to the spiritual world, furthering the inquest of my spiritual dispositions as an African man.

Now, in answering your other question, I am also aware of the extraordinarily awesome contributions Africans have given to the societies of the world.

FOR, WE ARE THE SPIRITUAL AND INTELLECTUAL FOUNDATION, BACKBONE AND SALT OF THE EARTH.

And to go further with this reattribution, the world is, probably, only looking at the tip of the iceberg, as it pertains to ancient African cultural and scientific civility. For, the destruction and decline of Black civilization is not just 400 years old or 4,000 thousand years old, and scientific evidence and spiritual enlightenment is revealing that, African high civilization may be as old as time itself.

If you notice in my previous posts, I only talk about non-evasive and alternative forms of technology and energy; innovative sciences, in relation to natural laws and phenomenon that could invoke independent living, apart from our oppressors (international capitalist and interventionist). These oppressors helped, if not instigate, the expeditious destruction of our rituals, cultures and continuities, with greatness.

I hope that this post answers your questions. For, I am not part of these discussions to destroy progress and hope, but to assist in the furthering of our development, toward hopefully a non-rhetorical and function African reality.

Peace,

Brother Sun Ship

Brother Isanusu,

This type of discourse is healthy for our people. For, it wasn’t easy for those who came before us and we shouldn’t be looking for an easy way out, of this exilic condition. We have a humongous job ahead of us, as it applies to the re-enlightenment of our people and the first battle starts with ourselves.

I have read the post relating to your daughter’s adventures and research. I found it very interesting and will make other comments in that thread.

I agree, we are really pursuing the same goals and neither one of our journeys are more important than the others. We have dealt with important issues as it applies to how we see ourselves spiritually, which, I would agree, is the most defining dimension of who we are as Black people of African descent.

So, stay steadfast on your spiritual path, my brother, and let not your inquiries and/or works ever cease in your spiritual pursuits.

Ashe,

Sun Ship