Once upon a time in America, women could enter the military but only have desk jobs or be nurses. Women were never permitted to fight on the front lines. American laws and society have changed.

Recently in the war against Iraq, a woman (African American) was taken POW. Pictures of her being interrogated by the Iraqi's showed a woman that was absolutely terrified. I believe she was a store clerk before she entered the military. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Do you think that women should fight in wars and if the draft should ever come back, do you think that women will now be drafted along with men?

I believe in the same pay for the same job. If a woman is capable to perform up to standards then let her fight. Although keep in mind men and women are not equal. Once there was a news report on letting women doing so called "men-jobs". This lady, about 5 foot 5 and 95lbs wanted to be a firefighter. Although, the the axe firefighters use is like 50lbs, packpack like another 50lbs, ladder was not so light either. Even though she was given a change she struggled because of limited strength.

I personally do not like to see women in combat. Combat boots, M16 rifle and a grenade launcher strapped on a woman is not my idea of being feminine :) I'm a contractor for the Army and I was in Kuwait during the last hiccup when Saddam was threatening an encounter with the U.S. That was the first time I actually saw women in full battle gear...I struggled with that vision for days and even asked a similar question on a discussion board at that time. The sister (POW) over in Iraq looked terrified, and very much out of place...I hope she and the other POWs return home safely.

Now the devil on my left shoulder is saying...certainly women are capable of combat; they wanted to do everything men do, so yeah, they should be right there in the foxhole with the men. As the saying goes...be careful what you ask for :)

I have a certain image that I visualize when think of a woman, and being strapped for combat is definitely not it.

With that said, I don't know if they would be drafted if the draft was reinstated, but based on what is going on in the world today...it's only "fair" that they be included.

Keme...and here I thought Darwin's Theory of Evolution was a joke!

ZG...your points are well taken...again!

As we can see, there are some women that don't have a problem with being engaged in combat...on a battlefield, that is. And, for those that don't have a problem with it, more power to them. I, for one, do not wish to put my life at risk like that when I know the chances are pretty darn good that I might take a bullet(s) at any time, or like the sister who is a POW...face the cruelty and torture of people who want to kill you.

How many people are fighting in this war and asking themselves, why am I here?

Like you, I also have a mental image of what a woman looks like...not should look like...but looks like. The gear that you described is not my idea either of an outfit I'd like to wear when I greet my man when he comes home at night

However, if I had no choice and was put in a position where I had to defend me and mine against people who want to bring the war to me....I wouldn't hesitate at all to grab a weapon and do what I have to do. And I can do that wearing high heels and pantyhose too.

Hi Queen :uzi:
I think that a Woman would be a big distraction for some men, thy would feel more protective of her hence something could
go very wrong:nono: . God only knows what happens to female POWs not to mention the psychological effect it can take on her
family. What comes to mind when I think of a female POW is rape and prostitution, of cores the same thing could be done
to a man but I think not to the extent as a female, Think about THE MOST unholy sex act imaginable and its a good bet she would suffer it. PRAY FOR OUR POW SISTER PRAY HARD FOR HER.:bowdown:
GOOD POST Q.

Thinking about any POW is sad enough. Thinking about a female POW is almost unthinkable to me. The 19 year-old woman POW that was rescued yesterday, is reportedly in good shape. At least that's what was on the news last night. This morning, it was reported that she had been shot several times and lay in a hospital with dead bodies of other American soldiers.

Prometheus, like you, I've also wondered whether the women POW's would be subjected to rape while being held captive. I've always thought that one of the worst crimes that can be committed is rape. Just thinking about it makes my head spin.

I have prayed for everyone's safety and hope that the one's that are still alive, are returned safely. For those that have died, there isn't much that we can do for them anymore.

A woman fighting on the front line @e!! NO. Yea... she should be fighting alright.. On the home front.... You know how many wars we go through just to survive in our own country alone.... And i'm gonna go over to someone else's home land that i know nothing about.. leave my kids that i've birthed and so forth... To risk my life for someone in office who may or may not know me... But will definitely know me pending on the circumstance....

Now that i have voiced my opinion...
I will contradict myself and say...
LIVE AND LET LIVE!!!!!!

As far as I'm concerned, we've been on the front lines since we arrived in this country as chattel.
Althought I enjoy the limited freedoms this country affords would I risk life and limb to defend it? HELL NO!!! Would I pick up arms against a people who hate because I am "American" only to have America hate me because I am Black? HELL NO!
Should the draft be reinstated I doubt they'd draft women--America is too concerned with it's international image and would not want the world pointing a finger at the country who sent Sally-Sue the farmer's daughter from Buttscratch, Wisconsin, mother of 4 to her death at the hands of God-less infidels who hate all we hold dear. They can't stop women from enlisting but they wouldn't draft........

Does the sun shine in Buttscratch? :eek:

monetg, your response leans more toward racism as opposed to gender equality. I can relate to what you wrote. But let me ask you this. Do you think that Black men think similarly when they consider joining the military? And of those that might but join anyway, what do you think the over-riding factor was that led to their decision?

shaneak you provide an interesting response also. Could you elaborate on what you meant when you wrote: "A woman fighting on the front line @e!! NO. Yea... she should be fighting alright.. On the home front....You know how many wars we go through just to survive in our own country alone..."

Did you mean wars fought due to racism or as a woman?

Queenie,

Before this country sees me as a person or a woman it views me as Black primary and a woman secondary. Everything in this country is based on race FIRST. When the "Women's Movement" piggy-backed the Civil Rights Movement who benefitted first? WHITE WOMEN! So yes my response leans more toward racism than gender equality.
To answer your question--I think that maybe Black men feel as if they fight they will "earn" the rights that are automatically affored to Whites.

I see your point scorp, but I'm very curious about this. Why do most Black women take such a strong position on "racism", to the degree that their awareness of it affects decisions they make, but Black men will often view it the same but act or approach it differently. So does the concept of gender come to play AS WELL AS race issues are far as Black men think?

Actually.. I meant both.. racism and negativity we receive even for being a woman... more over.. a black woman.
Hope that explains it more.. it just upsets me to really go into detail... the thought alone bothers me...
like.. why our brothers don't show us the respect that we deserve. Why many have such a negative aspect inregards to us... Things like dhat... Not to say all... But it is a very big issue... We lack highly in our respect and honor as a black woman. Which is more often than so... Not recognized... nor appreciated...

Hope I said that right:D

well i just dont understand why a woman wants to go into the military knowin a war could start....but if she does...she knew what was up when she applied..

and as far as the draft...i think the days of that r long gone...aint nobody up with that no mo

I feel it perfectly find for women to fight in the war. If women choose to fight why not they receive trainingjust like the men.

If the draft should come back around I guess they will draft the men first, then the women.

I would not fight in war and would be headed to Canada if the draft was reinstated, women added to the list and my number called.

Should women be allowed in combact? No, I consider myself a modern traditionalist, and women in combat does not mesh with my view of female gender roles. We can support a war effort if we choose to and I know there are women who would choose to fight. Many sistas (and brothas) enter the military to advance in a career, get money for college or as an avenue to escape a difficult home environment (based on some of the responses I've heard from military personnel). They, probably like the sista POW or reservits, did not expect the US to go to war or that they would be involved in this type of military action.

When Jenna and Barbara Bush are put on the front lines, I'll think about it (but the answer will prbably still be helllllll naw).

lmbo@LadyJ

Monster,

I wouldn't begin to speak for "most Black women", I can only speak for myself. My presumption as to why we react differently to racism is becuase although by no means are we "safe" we are not being gunned down, beat down, and racially-profiled AS MUCH AS-NOTICE I SAID--AS MUCH AS--YES, IT HAPPENS TO US TOO-BUT NOT AS MUCH AS our male counterparts.
But back to war--as long as this country veils but enforces it's systematic oppression--why should I pick up arms to defend it's right to oppress me?

NNQUEEN

in this day and age of equality I think that if women are prepared to fight in wars then yes they should and it should be looked upon as their decision and right to do so....

putting aside all the feminazi crap and just looking at it from the standpoint of a woman simply choosing to join the military for her own reasons, one of the conditions of her joining the armed forces, is that there may be a chance of war and if so she will be called upon to fight in it...she has a brain, she can think for herself and she knows the risks she may have to take...is she prepared for it?..is anyone ever truly prepared for the atrocities and realities of war?...

I don't mean to sound harsh, but if a woman puts herself in this position and risks the chance of capture, then she must, even if it's in the back of her mind, be aware of what she may have to face....sure enough she'll be scared to death, so will a man..and yes there's a probability she will be raped or pack raped and tortured, the probability is the same for a man...could a man handle these conditions easier simply because he's a man, as far as I'm concerned that depends on his willpower and fortitude and all round strength, not on his gender....and the same goes for a woman...she makes the initial choice on whether or not she joins in the first place....

K

Scorp, right. We don't want to presume that "most" Black women accept your view on this topic. So I stand corrected. I agree that the more compelling position is one that addresses what you refer to as "systematic oppression." For me, Black men and women who are willing to put their lives on the line AGAIN for this country, defies all sense of logic. Even after the tragedy of the WTC, I still could not wave, wear or hang the American flag. To do so reeks of hypocrisy if you're Black. It would take a lot for this country to do on behalf of Black Americans for me to adopt a sense of nationalism. It's not that I would lift a finger to harm the country, but why would I die to save it?

Monster,

It's funny you should bring up 9/11. Strangely enough, after 9/11, like many New-Yorkers I displayed an American flag outside my home. Not due to any semblance of American pride but in respect for the thousands of lives senselessly lost and because on 9/11 and in the days immedaitely afterward I caught a glimpse of what this country COULD and SHOULD be.
On that day color didn't matter, class didn't matter, gender didn't matter, life is all that mattered. I thank God to this day I wasn't at work that day (I took a vacation day) ordinarily I would have been in Manhattan but a few miles from Ground Zero. I was on my way into "the City" as the planes hit--and trying frantically to reach loved ones as the towers came crashing down less than 2 hours later and in the midst of all that chaos and death, I saw humanity.

How soon we forget. Americans seem like rubber bands. Situations, even tragic ones, can touch our hearts deeply. Penetrate through the outter layers of hate, poverty, oppression and all the mundane issues that we deal with daily. We become "humane" in our thoughts, our dreams, our actions and our priorities shift quickly to love, compassion and sharing. We expand and reach new heights and for a fleeting moment, we become like one. But like a rubber band, we quickly contract and form back into the shape that we were in originally and business goes on as usual.

:(

Monster,

Is being so resilient a blessing or a curse?

Scorp, I'm not sure I understand your question.

Monster,

I guess what I'm trying to say is--the fact that we have the abilty to expand in times of tradegy, distress, etc and be more than we ever thought possible demonstrates our capacity for growth. Unfortunately, that growth is not usually positively sustained and we shrink back to our "average" selves.
Should I be encouraged that mankind's potential is still so evident or should I be disheartened that it takes disaster to bring about that growth and that growth is usually so short-lived?

Well, I think that it's good to be resilient. If pain were to strike us and never go away, then what good would it do to continue living? I think we were designed to overcome the effects of hardships and tragedies because as humans, the "inevitables" of life will always happen.

However, I also think that we were meant to learn and grow from hardships...as Iyala VanZant wrote, "There's Value In The Valley." To bounce back or contract is to become whole again; to absorb what we have learned and to grow from the experience. To see through "new" eyes and to change...mature...evolve...however you want to describe it.

Don't forget the pain of an experience but don't let it consume you either. Just remember what it felt like when you were there and if you didn't like how it felt, focus on the lesson you learned and then do whatever you can to eradicate the "disease" that caused it.

That's my perspective and I hope it addresses your question scorp!

Monster,

Buy that's my point--we experience the pain, forget it and seem not to learn from the experience although we survive the experience.
We don't mature, we don't evolve, we don't change. How have we changed post-9/11 other that this new alert system and more prejudice towards foreigners of color? That's what I mean by are we blessed or cursed? It seems we're smart enough to be stupid--smart enough to get through but not get over.
Am I making sense?

Scorp, you're making perfect sense and I'm wondering whether this is a cultural phenomenon. Americans are accused of being insensitive and arrogant. We have so much available to us, an open society, numerous resources and a sense of indestructability, even in the aftermath of 9/11. Have we been so desensitized by our culture that some of us have become immune to human compassion and common sense? Is the fact that the U.S. is being aggressive and fighting "back", reinforce the false feeling of security so that life should continue as it did before 9/11?

A person accused of murder can be a victim also. But most people aren't sympathetic of someone who has taken a life or lives of others. They don't care if their lives have been harsh due to circumstances beyond their control. A lot of people look at perpetrators of criminal acts, the same way most children look at each other on the school playground..."you hit me and I'm going to hit you back."

I believe most children are taught to hit back, either by another child and most often by their parents.

You're right...most people aren't sympathetic to someone that has taken the life of others...unless it is in self-defense...what other reason should someone take a life? Because they mad you mad? ... because they said something you didn't like? ...because they stole or took something that belonged to you? Society isn't sympathetic because usually killings today are senseless in nature and to be frank, imho, is hard to muster up sympathy for anyone that kills for no justifiable reason.

What say you?


oh, btw...congrats on becoming a 'Moderator' (if I have overlooked it in the past, my apology) ... well deserved my friend :toast:

No, you didn't miss anything. My becoming a moderator is fairly recent so thank you for the acknowledgment and your kind words! :)

How did we get off into this topic when we should be talking about whether women should fight in wars? LOL Maybe we should take this discussion to my other thread on capital punishment at the "Kemestry Forum."

But to answer your question ZG...I agree that there is a great deal of senseless killing occurring and it's unfortunate that some of it has to be in self-defense. And I realize there are some heinous crimes being committed too and I've often thought about if someone murdered a close family member or friend, how I would feel.

Naturally I would be devastated and hurt beyond comprehension. I would be angry and initially would want to lash out and hurt the person responsible. And I know this is easy to say because I've never experienced anything like that before but I think that after a while, I could feel some sense of sympathy or compassion, toward the perpetrator in spite of what they had done.

I saw once where the mother of a murdered child spoke on behalf of the child's killer at his trial. She said that God had forgiven him and she had too. Now, I'm not sure how I would act on my feelings...but I do think I'm capable of feeling less anger and some compassion toward the perp.

what the perps are counting on.

So I shouldn't sit on their jury huh? lol

The following link is for public consumption. It's a fact sheet about women in the military between 1980-1990 and was produced by The Women's Research and Education Institute (WREI) which is an independent, national, public policy research and education center.

The fact sheet addresses women in the military in the U.S.and other NATO countries. Although the data is 13 years old, I still found it interesting in view of this discussion. Check out the statistics toward the sections on FOCUS ON MINORITY WOMEN IN THE MILITARY and APPENDIX - COMBAT EXCLUSIONS.

http://www.mith2.umd.edu/WomensStudies/GovernmentPolitics/Military/factsheet

No womans should not fight in wars because they a still banned from high positions in politics. I think that when we have an equal sare of saying and we are willing to go to war then we should fight. Did you also notice that the white woman was freed and the black woman just died! Maybe that where just circumstances but i don't really trust that!

NNQueen,

My family experienced the murder of a loved one, my uncle, by the hands of a woman. He was the one who was battered and a victim of domestic violence. And no, I don't feel sorry for her because she is a female. She is a murderer. She got less time because the one dissenting juror, who happened to be a Black women, didn't think my uncle's life was worth a first degree murder charge. Most women want to be equal as long as it benefits them. When it doesn't, they pull out the "female as the weaker gender" card.

Most women feel that way you think? I'm not sure that I agree with you Regina that MOST women want the benefits of being "equal" without the consequences. I don't have any hard statistics to support my belief but maybe I'm looking at different types of women than you are. I have NEVER perceived Black women as "the weaker gender", and I've never had the misfortune of ever meeting one that thought of herself that way either. But....I guess there's always a first time.

Also, what happened to your uncle was unfortunate. You're right, a murderer is a murderer under the circumstances in which you described.

As far as women fighting in wars, I know of men who don't want to fight in them so it doesn't surprise me any that some women wouldn't either.

Peace!

black men or black women should not fight in any war for the man that oppresses us. We need to be fighting a spiritual war, right here and now. We are dealing principalities in country. The violence and terror we inflict upon each other is a direct result of an unseen hand pulling our strings.... they get us with emotion

Hello My Nubian Queen, :luv: :luvv:

I consider a tour in the military as being a physically and mentally challenging ordeal, but contrary to that I feel women can serve in most military capacities. Being in the military means prestige, honor, pride, and the sheer satisfaction that comes along with engaging what is considered one of the most valiant and traditionally revered professions on the face of the earth. Women in the U.S. have long fought for the right to be included in many facets of society, from the right to vote to getting elected to major government offices, just a few of the reasons I personally am not opposed to women being in the military. And all African-Americans should be proud of 1st Lt. Vernice Armour for making history by becoming the military’s first African-American female combat pilot.

Right now the United States Military is voluntary, the women that are joining the military are not being forced. However, if the draft were implemented I don’t think women would be drafted. The women that do join the military voluntarily should consider the possibility of being in a war zone, of being captured and all that might happen to a person in a war zone. Some women as well as men have joined the military with the idea that they will never have to go to a combat area even though it has been fully explained to them before they signed their contract.

In closing let me share this joke with you:

A large group of Iraqi soldiers are moving down a road when they hear a woman’s voice call from behind a sand dune.

"One Woman United States Marine is better than ten Iraqis!"

The Iraqi commander quickly sends 10 of his best
soldiers over the dune, whereupon a gun battle breaks and continues for a few minutes, then silence.

The woman’s voice then calls out "One Woman United States Marine is better than one hundred Iraqis!"

Furious, the Iraqi commander sends his next best 100 troops over the dune and instantly a huge firefight commences.

After 10 minutes of battle, again silence.
The female American voice calls out again "One Woman United States Marine is better than one thousand Iraqis!"

The enraged Iraqi Commander musters one thousand fighters and sends them across the dune.

Cannons, rockets and machine guns ring out as a huge battle is fought...Then silence.

Eventually one wounded Iraqi fighter crawls back over the dune and with his dying words tells his commander,

"Don't send any more men, it's a trap. There's two of them!"
:lol:

Welcome to the Forums sweetheart and thank you for your post. :love:

Your point about the military are well respected by me and I understand where you're coming from and yes, I am proud of all of our people who put their lives at risk to keep us as safe as possible. It's not a choice that I would make for a couple of reasons, but I do respect those of us--men and women--that do choose this career option.

General question: This leads me to something I've been thinking about recently as I watch Bush flying around the globe. The Secret Service--first of all, why is it a secret? Second, has there ever been a woman employed in this profession who has guarded the president?

I,M SORT OF IN BETWEEN WOMEN FIGHTING IN WARS OR NOT FIGHTING BECAUSE IF WAR SHOULD BREAK OUT WHERE I LIVE AND THE MEN ARE GONE OFF FIGHTING SOMEWHERE ELSE I WANT TO KNOW HOW TO DEFEND MYSELF AND CHILDREN WITH ALL THE MIGHT AND KNOWLEDGE I HAVE LEARNED. bUT IF WOMEN ARE DRAFTED TO FIGHT IN WARS AND ARE KILLED, THIS AFFECTS THE REPRODUCTION OF MAN. WOMEN SHOULD KNOW HOW TO PICK UP A M16 AND USE IT CORRECTLY OR TOSS A GERNADE AT AT A ENEMY WHO COMES TO HARM HER AND HER FAMILY. THE THOUGHT OF BEING IN HARMS WAY SUCH AS THIS FRIGHTENS ME IMMENSLY. BEING A BLACK WOMEN I NEVER WANT TO SEE MY CHILDREN CARRIED OFF AND KILLED OR ENSLAVED AGAIN AS MY ANCESTORS WAS. BEING SAID THAT I WOULD WANT TO KNOW HOW FIGHT IN A WAR BUT MY FIGHT WOULD START WHEN THE ENEMY HAS STEP FOOT ONTO MY HOMELAND. WOMEN SHOULD FIGHT IN THE WAR WHEN ITS PRESENTED IN THE HOMELAND. WE DEFINITELY NEED TO KNOW HOW TO HOLD IT DOWN WHEN NECESSARY.

Liberia's rebel women warriors

After years of raping and looting, it's time for respect -- and revenge

By GLENN MCKENZIE
THE ASSOCIATED PRESS

TUBMANBURG, Liberia -- Her uniform is a red beret, spaghetti-strap halter top and black jeans. Her weapons are Kalashnikovs and mortars.

Black Diamond, 22, is a Liberian rebel commander -- known by her nom de guerre and feared by friends and foes alike in a war-shattered nation where women and girls are more likely to be victims than avengers.

Read the complete story about Black Diamond here...
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/national/136355_liberia23.html

That article was very emotional for me sister NNQueen.
Women! Women defended each other and no longer allowing themselves to fall victims to abuse because they are indeed women. I'm all for that! I too would rather die than see my sisters, daughters, brothers and sons fall victim to a massacrering mobb. Thankyou for this post sister Queenie!

You are welcome Sister Purplemoons!!

:heart:

Sister NNQueen :bowdown:

I think this is an interesting thread, but this topic is very broad, if we were to look at it from an African-centered point of view. I think an answer pertaining to ANYBODY, be they male or female, fighting in a war, is only relevant to the particular war itself.

Basically, FIGHTING FOR WHOM AND FOR WHAT.

We can easily debate who should fight, but we have a hard time in America debating why we are warring and for whom.

I’M JUST HOPE THAT WOMEN, DON’T BECOME AS STUPID AS MEN. The female may be our ONLY HOPE for peace.

PLEASE SISTERS DON’T EMULATE THE WAR-MONGERS.

Ashe,

Sun Ship

P.S. – as it’s been said, “The hand that rocks the cradle, rules the world”.

Sun Ship, as usual you make a good point. In the case of Black Diamond spoken of in the article I posted, I could understand her struggle and her fight.

In the case of any woman in the US military, particularly African American women, what are they fighting in wars for? Are they fighting for a cause? Are they fighting against any and all injustices around the world? To defend their country? To spread democracy and human rights around the world? To end terrorism? If either is the case, then why isn't the war taking place on American soil?

Just a thought.

Peace sister NNQueen :bowdown:

I read up on this sister. They call her Colonel Black Diamond :bowdown: her name is supposedly Mawata Tranaray. One of her comrades had a weave and an AK clutch to her side, So much for reading a book by its cover :laugh:. Maybe if more African men and women in America can see images like this, they would know, that its not the cover of the book, but the contents itself.

I invoke the faith that yearns for this sister to survive the conflict and enjoy the reconstruction of peaceful new Africa. For still, peace is greater than war and Africans worldwide greatest battle, is the battle within.


Here are some more articles with PHOTOS of this warrior queen:

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/World/2003/08/22/166482-ap.html

http://thunderbay.indymedia.org/news/2003/08/8084.php

http://www.csmonitor.com/2003/0826/p07s01-woaf.html

http://www.bouzou.com/culture/present/blackdiamond.html

Ashe!

Sun Ship

P.S. – Lets post this sister picture on our walls and the walls of others.

Brother Sun Ship, thanks for the additional information about Black Diamond and her women warriors. I find the difference between our brothers and sisters in Africa and us in America, amazing. This is the 21st Century and they have no qualms about becoming rebels and fighting for what they believe in. Once upon a time didn't we too have the natural instinct to fight against oppression like this? Where did the 'fight' in us go?

Heavenly Peace Upon You, Sister NNQueen :bowdown:

A revolution is not to be always associated with violent upheaval. The definition of revolution is very specific and at its root the word has broad implications outside of the realm of armed action. The idea of revolution is a primer for evolutionary pro-activity.
Progressive thought need to reach beyond guerilla warfare and insurrection,

FOR THIS WILL NEVER WORK TO A PRODUCTIVE END IN AMERICA.

Africans in America need to focus on the actual structure of independent living, which is one of the root problems of progressive Africans worldwide. A parasite will always need its host and you cannot kill what you feed upon and survive! We have to stop fantasizing and romancing modern day mau mau-ism. We (Africans in America) are in this information driven society for a reason. And I believe our part to play in the renewal of African, as well other progressive peoples, civility is different than our warrior sister Colonel Black Diamond :bowdown: at this time in our progression.

We never look at collectivism and the constructive role it could play rebuking a profit driven society. Communalism, polygyny, co-housing, co-operatives and collective farming have become unspeakable boogie-men among the intellectual ramblings of progressive Black thinkers. Our quest for freedom has almost become metaphysical and ethereal. There are only a few black people who even know about true black nationalism or the Kawaida theory from which the Nguza Saba principles were formulated!

To try to tie my digression in with the original posting, I think the battles that sisters need to fight are more substantive than the end result of a bullet. Look at Africa’s long revolutionary road. After the last bullets were shot, this was only the beginning. The lack of independent and technologically advanced infrastructures literally re-colonized the liberated.

So lets expand our minds to the evolution of revolution and start thinking about solar and wind generated energy, organic farming, and alternative non-western health care. God forbid looming our own material, functional pottery and actual building skills (i.e. bricklaying, carpentry, plumbing, etc.) Do you know how many so-called NATION BUILDING black activist/revolutionaries can’t even swing a hammer and hit a nail or have never grown a tomato!! There is a whole plethora of ideas from communications to transportation that are revolutionary in nature and looking for a people who need an alternative to this capital and material driven matrix.

WE NEED MORE DO-IT-YOURSELF BOOKS THEN WE NEED MORE RADICAL OR REVOLUTION EMBRACING ROMANCE NOVELS!!


Believe me, I’m not dismissing the great Black nationalist and activist that have taken us to this point, but we think revolution is a massive effort of back alley warriors tearing down one bureaucracy and racist institution after another, but believe me, this is a waste of time. Or as one sage said, “it’s like fighting with fire, because it burns” So lets start where there is no blame and possibly actual results. For if I could pull sustenance from the ground and feed you and your children from my hand with no intervention, the revolution has begun.

FOR SOMETIMES, GOD IS IN THE DETAILS.

Peace, Love and Ashe

Sun Ship

Brother Sun Ship, I feel you and can relate to what you wrote. I have swung hammers to hit nails and have grown organic tomatoes among other fruits and vegetables. I've sewn fabric together to make clothes, not as a hobby but to experience what it feels like to live in harmony with nature, be creative, free and independent.

More and more I like the concept of communalism and can see very clearly where it can be a positive and powerful influence on our community. I'm not driven by owning the cookie cutter single family home in the Cleaver suburbs with the two-car garage with sports vehicle and luxury sedan, or the neatly manicured lawn all with an astonomical mortgage and ridiculous property taxes. You have to fight to get it and then fight to keep it--the ADT labels on the window reflects a different type of war people fight in America.

Ah, I too digress so as I end this, I want to tell you Brother Sun Ship that I find the following quote from you to be very inspiring to me:

"For if I could pull sustenance from the ground and feed you and your children from my hand with no intervention, the revolution has begun."

Ashe!
Queenie

I am searching for Black Diamond, leader of a Liberian women's rebel unit. For swedish television I am planning to cover "what happened to her and her women fighters after the war?"

If any of you have any information about her, like where she is now. Please e mail me on malinwestberg@hotmail.com

Love
/m

welcome to destee.com
welcome to the family of love peace and uplifting spirits

I think women should fight.

Women should definitely be able to fight in wars, especially if they can be in the military. I would definitely go out there and take a bullet to protect my family. I do doubt that if Bush does instate the draft again that women will be included because American still isn't ready to send thier wives and daughters into combat.

I don't want to seem insincere here, but I don't think women should fight. Not for the reason most would think. I think war is a STUPID man thing and we shouldn't encourage it. I figure if I can have a rottweiler and a feline living in the same house with no quarrels, there is no way we as humans shouldn't be able to work things out. Women don't need to fight because I don't think men should have to. I think war is for ego trippin' and we as women (and as humans) shouldn't be involved in the mess. Do I feel women can handle the challenge.....INDEED.