Hello Everyone,

It has come to my attention that there are SEVERAL Family Members posting work that does not belong to them. Some of you I've emailed, requesting that you remove the property if it's not yours. I've posted a "Copyright Infringement" announcement that appears on every page in this forum for all to see. Yet in spite of this, I'm still being told that folk are posting work that does not belong to them.

I'm grateful to those of you who bring these things to my attention, as I don't have time to read each post. Please continue to let me know if you see work that you recognize as someone else's.

First of all, to claim work copyrighted by another, or use it without their express written permission, is stealing. In addition, it simply is not welcome here! This forum is not about posting your favorite work that someone else created. This forum is about YOUR work, YOUR flow, YOUR words, what YOU created. I don't care how much you think of Langston Hughes or Nikki Giovanni ... don't put their work on this site! (Of course they are welcome to join us and post it themselves.)

Last but hardly least, is the fact that we have very talented poets and authors here. If you infringe on the work of others, you will do the same to those that present their work here. This type of behavior is not allowed by any who have membership here.

If you don't have confidence in your own work, your own words, email a fellow family member and ask them to write with you. I'm sure they'd be happy to oblige. That's how I started writing poetry, with the help of these same poets. Before long, you'll be presenting beautiful work that you created.

This post is to let you know I have no patience for this. I consider it stealing and if you'll steal from them you'll steal from us.

Again, if you have posted work on this site that belongs to someone else, and have not included their permission for it be here, remove it right away.

Thank You.

Destee

I am in total agreement with your stand on this issue. Let them know.

one love,blak

All in favor - sign of "I"
Any substained ??
All who disagree - sign of "Nay"...

Thanks Destee!!

I totally agree about people posting work as if it were there own but the part about Langston Hughs and Nikki Giovanni.....and so and so on well those are just of few of my fav's and ONE time I posted a poem by Maya Anelou and I stated that it was by here and I thought it was sorta nice, alot of these "legends" are inspirations to few and I feel like if you have posted your own creative work than why is it not ok to post your inspiration as long as you give credit to where credit is due?
I mean you may have not addressed it particularly to me or just me but i just wanted it to be known that i did not mean anything by it and that i did not and would not pass anything off as my work when it is not and a few enjoyed that particular piece. I just want to clear the air to let everyone know that if you took any offense to it none was meant....sorry fromm now i will keep my inspirations to myself and share them with my fellow poets on Poetry Night once again i apologize

Ladybug,

This post is to you and anyone that has posted work on this site that belongs to someone else. Langston Hughes, Nikki Giovanni, Maya Angelou and many others, get paid for their work. If you or others think so highly of their accomplishments, then you should buy their books, cd's, movies, etc., and give them as gifts. This is a wonderful way to show your admiration. Don't take their work and post it on a web site where they get no compensation.

It is perfectly okay to hold someone in high esteem and recommend them to others ... but don't put their livelihood at risk by making their work available to the public for free.

With many up and coming authors, artists and poets on this site (some already published), respecting like work cannot be compromised. If you find this requirement too restrictive, I understand and we will miss you.

My position is firm on this. The poetry categories are for posting your own work, not the work of others. Additional categories are available for all other topics, none of which should include property that belongs to someone else.

Destee

i agree thats y i don't post anything
i love the poets here and there work
if i write it would be of there work so
i don't post just reply .....destee is right
thats a NO NO!!!!!!blessings come in bunchies
u can't get it by others art......

Destee thanks

DANG DESTEE YOU ON THE MONEY GIRL IT REALLY SHOCKED EVERY ONE THAT YOU WOULD PUT YOUR FOOT DOWN LIKE THAT KEEP REPPING GIRL

Thanks everyone for your support.

To those who have posted work that belongs to someone else, this will be the last time I ask you to remove it. If I have to remove it, I'll be deleting your username/password from this forum.

I'd much rather you remove it and continue sharing YOUR flows with us.

Destee

100% AGREE

Hello Family ... it seems this issue has come up again, only with a slightly different twist. So I thought I'd add this new concern to this existing thread, for the sake of those new to the Family, that may not know and/or understand this policy.

--------

It's come to my attention that one of our Members read (at an open mic function) a peace of poetry written by another Member, without first obtaining permission to do so. While I have no independent evidence that this in fact happened, the thought of it is quite upsetting.

If a Family Member hadn't brought this to my attention, I'd never know. So I do thank you for that.

It's one thing for strangers/visitors to violate us, but when it is happening by those that have Membership here, that are a part of this Family ... well ... that's quite different.

Gosh ... it's about respect and consideration of those things that belong to another, such a basic act of decency that I'm almost surprised to be discussing it. All one has to do is ask, get permission first.

I'm disappointed, to say the least, and am considering making the forums private (viewable only by those who have Membership and are in good standing). This would mean that we'd never have to worry about a non-Member using the work here and if a Member uses it without permission (and we find out about it), they would no longer have Membership here. This would be an extreme response, but in an effort to protect what belongs to the Members here, I'm more than willing to do it.

This is about all of us, for the work presented here makes this forum what it is. Therefore, I welcome your comments.

Destee

Destee I agree i've had a notion about dis and felt it would
happen i just wish they stop and be right about it but some
time u have to put ya foot down and bang!!!! i'm with u 100%
and standing on ya side to da left............

I am in total agreement

We as poets have been granted a gift, everyone has a gift within them, seek your own thoughts and experiences and use them as an expression, there is no need to steal or impose upon someone elses creativity when you hold your own within....it's all about looking within and just go with the flow. :)

Destee, this may sound a little harsh, but I agree with your "closed door" idea or private forums. During high school some of the english classes were made to write five original poems all on one chosen subject. One particular girl I know of, browsed the web and found work of talented, unpublished writers, like those on this site, and took their work without asking. She simply copied and pasted. Needless to say, she received an A on "her" assignment.
I've always been worried about some lazy, rude person doing the same to me, but I HAVE to write online, because I don't share my work with "real" people. Anyway, that's just my views on the topic.
Even though I'm a relatively new member, it upsets me greatly that family members would do that to each other. Have some respect people.

*Emma*

i agree with this totally. i had to blow up on a person on blackplanet.com who took the liberty of posting a few of my pieces as his own...amen destee and thanks, this needed to be stated...

One,
Derrick Jay

I am totally with you on this because I personally, have experienced the very thing you are teed off about. Had it not been for SACARRONWELL (spelling?) who is one of our fellow members, I would never have known.

He posted a copyright warning to all of us on this very board, sometime ago. He had made a special trip to New York to attend a poetry slam. While there, someone read the poem...Ain't Nuthin Like A Dark Skinned Man! He said the poem was throughly enjoyed by the audience because of the profundity of it.
However, the person who read my poem at this poetry slam was not the author nor did she EVER even asked permission from me and I never would have found out about it, had one of our own members not been there.

So girlfriend, do what you feel you have to do...I am sure our work is being used off and on all the time without our knowing it and your efforts to protect it only show me the you truly have a heart for the poets.:)

i've seen poets get a spin off of my pieces here
but
i didn't sweat it
but
to show their teeth :D at open mic sessions is resickulous :uzi:

Although I thought there might be a slim chance such violations might occur, I didn't feel there was a serious or common incidence of it, until now. Destee, you have my support, should you decide to make the Poetry forum private. It's a shame the world we live in is so full of scavengers for others' styles and ideas.

Hello Everyone,

I'll try to address my concerns and provide a way for us to deal with like situations in the future.

First of all, I'm not a babysitter of folk and their integrity ... and even if I were, everyone here is grown ... hence, none of you qualify for "baby"sitting. I don't have time for drama, foolishness or "he said / she said" kind of carrying on. I spend a lot of long hours maintaining this forum and to think that I have time to be investigator, police, and judge, none of which I'm qualified for, is ridiculous.

The entire situation has me considering things that undermine my longstanding hope for this forum, inclusiveness. Anyone who has been here from the beginning knows that this is my quest, to make everyone feel welcome. I don't ever want anything that appears as fences, barriers, chains ... separating us or keeping some in and others out. As I thought on making the forum private and how different that is from what I want it to be ... it gave me to know that I'd rather shut it down, than do that.

In addition, making it private would not mean that poetry posted on this forum would be safe from someone using it. As a matter of fact, it would exclude the "visitors/guests" but it wasn't a visitor accused of violating. A long standing Member was accused. So in essence, I'd be locking the fox up in the hen house, doing nothing to guarantee that your poetry is safe from being used by another. This comes only from each individual person's integrity, and in some cases, even God hasn't bothered to do much with some folk.

I do care about what you share here. I even care if you don't share here, yet find your property here without your permission. I believe that what happens and/or is allowed on this Forum, is a direct reflection of my own integrity. This is why I encourage everyone to treat others (and that that belongs to them) as they'd want their property to be treated.

With this in mind, I've created a policy/procedure for dealing with violations, so that I'm not put in the middle with no real evidence to address any of it.

We now have a new Forum, the "Violations Forum (http://destee.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=96)." This newly created Forum is for any and all forum violation complaints. This will provide an easy way to let everyone know we may have a violator in our midst. It also provides the accused the opportunity to know they are being accused, who their accuser(s) is and the opportunity to defend themselves.

Please post to the "Violations Forum (http://destee.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=96)," if you are aware of any of the following:

A. Poetry/Property in this forum, that belongs to you, and does not have permission to be here.

B. Poetry/Property in this forum, that belongs to someone other than the person who posted it here, and permission from the owner is not included in that post (along w/their web site and/or email address).

C. A Member of this Forum has used Poetry/Property belonging to another Member of this forum, without permission.

Please post the details of the violation in the "Violations Forum (http://destee.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=96)." Provide as much information as possible, such as the violating Member's username, the URL where the content in this forum can be found, as well as the copyright owner's name and/or web site where the copyrighted information resides. If it is from a book, movie, or cd, please name it.

If you are not a Member of this Forum, you are welcome to email me, Destee@destee.com, rather than posting in the Violations Forum (http://destee.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=96).

Your concern will be addressed immediately.

Again, I can't require or enforce a person's level of integrity, honor and/or decency. I can provide the steps above to expose and if necessary, ban them from this forum as well as remove any property that should not be here. I'm not the police, but your local police are there if you feel your rights/property have been violated. If necessary, call on them. If anything on this forum will help your case in prosecuting the offender, you are more than welcome to it.

Destee

Destee...you never cease to amaze me. :) This is so much better.
I didn't want it to be a private forum either...but was willingly to comply with your wishes if you deemed necessary. I believe this is the best possible way for you to put a damper on anyone who violates the poetry here. I have been associated with several forums in the past. I must say that not only is this the most beautiful and well organized forum on the net, but it also contains an unusally high number of really good poets. There are poets and then there ARE poets...if you know what I mean. One can find read after read after read of well crafted, good poetry.

Thank You for a job well, well done here. :)

...gotta question...I just joined a site called Pathetic.com a poetry site where when you post it automatically copyrights your work ...what would it take to have that capability here ?
thanks
g-man

Thank You Joyce, your continued and unwavering support is so appreciated. I love hearing you say that this is the most beautiful and well organized forum on the net ... :blush: ... Thanks Sis. I do believe that we have the very best poets, which makes this copyright issue even more of an "issue" for us. Thanks Sis. :heart:


--------------------------


Hello GYPSYMAN ... always a pleasure to speak with you. :)

Based on the information provided by the US Copyright Office, specifically regarding poetry, it says that in order for the copyright to be registered you must send the following three elements in the same package/envelope to them:

1. A completed and signed application form;
2. A $30.00 non-refundable filing fee for each application; and
3. A non-returnable deposit of the work being registered.

The above information and more can be read in its entirety at the following URL: http://www.loc.gov/copyright/fls/fl106.pdf.

I visited the site you mentioned, but it says they are in the middle of a move and not currently available. Once they come back up I'll take a peek around and see what they are offering in terms of "automatic copyright" as a result of posting to their site. Based on the information at the US Copyright Office's web site, more than posting to a forum is required.

Here are some additional links regarding copyright that you might find helpful:

US Copyright Office (http://www.loc.gov/copyright/)
Copyright Basics (http://www.loc.gov/copyright/circs/circ1.html)
Copyright Registration Procedures (http://www.loc.gov/copyright/reg.html)
Copyright Infringement & Remedies (http://www.loc.gov/copyright/title17/92chap5.html)

If you have any additional questions, as always, I'm right here.

Much Love,

Destee

ps ... what are you doing on another poetry site ... :nono: .... :kiss: ... :love:

Thanks 4 the general copyright info Destee...and to be honest I have only posted one poem on the site{pathetic.com} and that was the one I submitted for entry on the site(You have to submit a poem for review before receiving a password) It lacks the flavor and familiar warmth of here- but it was the situation as far as having my work copywritten{is that a word ?} automatically that made me apply to them..but Ive been accepted for about a month but you know it's weird I haven't been back since I got my password...but with this new problem I am really going to take steps to get my stuff copywritten..I pulled all of my work just last week from Here- from my first poem to my last and printed it -then.. you know..three hole punched it, organized it and put it in a binder and the realization hit me of how some one could really benefit from my work or the work of others by just printing our stuff...because most of the time I just go to "new topic" and write from my head and submit without even making a copy...so all this to say that this seems to be another warning for us all as artists to begin to protect our work...cause the reality is- if an untalented or simply shrewd business person with no conscious is out to make a dollar or gain a little recognition...why would'nt they steal our stuff...?

again ..thanks for the info ..and I'll see what I can find out as far as Pathetic.com and the related subject matter..

p.s.--- and you know there's only one true home for me Destee...however you know Im the Gypsy..and wandering is just in my blood...forgive me ;) :D

peace
g-man

Thank you GYPSYMAN for turning this thread into something positive and informative. You are so right, so many of the poets have a wealth of talent in these thousands of posts. Unfortunately, there are people who will take your stuff. If they will climb in your bedroom window to steal from you, not even knowing if you're home, they'll take it from this site (and any other web site). The difference on Destee is that my disdain for stealing (online) did not start with this forum. On my own web site, you will not find images that belong and/or were created by others (unless paid in full for). Nor will you find text written by someone else regarding the development/support services that I provide. If I want folk to respect my work, then I must respect theirs. It has been this way with me from the beginning, so the way I deal with this forum is truly a reflection of me and (I'd like to think) my integrity.

Anywho ... enough about that. I too will check out the pathetic.com site when they come back up and see if there is any legitimacy to what they are saying they can do. If they can do it, we can do it too! :)

As you know, I've encouraged the poets on more than one occasion to make sure they have printed copies of the work they post here. Anything could happen. I remember one poet sharing with me that someone challenged the ownership of a peace she'd written. She was able to go back to this forum (or maybe it was when we were on Afronet) and prove it was hers by the date that it was posted (long before the other person claimed they'd written it). I hope I got the story right, but that poet is still with us and may share the actual experience and how having it posted on the forum may have helped her in that instance.

Yes ... each poet must be vigilant by taking whatever steps are available to protect their property ... because if anything is worth stealing ... the kind of talent we have on our forum is.

I was just teasing with you about "cheating" on us ... hehehehe ... :wink: ... I know you know where home is ... :love: ... Besides, what if we are able to copyright by posting to a forum?? You brought the information home after "gypsying" around ... :) ... if you find any other good stuff (features) that other folk have, that we want ... holla!

Much Much Love,

Destee

I've known some low M---- F-----'s in my lifetime. I mean low. But for a person to call themself a Poet and steal someone's work then pass it off as their own is beyond low. That person is f----ed up for sure, and has problems stealing won't cure, only they don't know it. Copyright does not and will not stop someone from stealing your work... it only protects you if one, you catch them , two, they have made money from your work and you can get some of it, and three, you can stop them from using your work again if you catch them again. The whole thing is messed up. Thanks Destee for looking out for us like you do.

This type of behavior has always boggled my mind. But then again, lack of respect starts with self. And only a person with low self-esteem could possibly sleep at night knowing they had stolen work belonging to someone else. And only a fool would try to publish a book of plagiarized material. What's also interesting is, the caliber of work stolen, usually surpasses the theif's own level of skill... The authenticity of the work would always be "suspect".....

I'm smiling because no good can come to a person who takes another's work, in part or in whole, and signs their own name to the bottom. They'll be dealt with in ways and on levels we can't even imagine.

Thanks Destee. I always enjoy watching you handle bidness, sis! :)

a

Heartbeat and Alyce, thank you both for your support! You know, when I have yall on my side, I know I'm doing the right thing. So if anyone wants me to be on their side, get Heartbeat or Alyce on your side ... and you got me :) I do value you both so very much.

Fam, let this be our notice. If any of us have the nerve to CHOOSE to post something violation-ish in this forum ... know that you are also CHOOSING to be called out. This includes me and everyone else. Folk here will be shooting first (posting to the Violations Forum) and asking questions later. If you are shot by mistake, we'll apologize.

It's really a good thing that GYPSYMAN (and everyone) visits other poetry sites, open mics, reads books, listens to music ... all that ... 'cause we'll be looking for our stuff (and each other's) while we're out there. We do bee iz Family and we do bee iz know'n our stuff when we see it!

You will be called out (http://destee.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=96).

If you don't mind, neither do we.

Destee

It's just not right to ever think of using the inner life of someone else's soul! Shame on the empty heart that does. I am currently in NY trying to publish 2 books( a book of poems and one of social-status experience). If someone was to dare do such a thing with my work I would cuss the them out then pray for them lol.....

I agree with you and am apauled by poetry theft but I have one question?
since they can not steel here any more
can those of us not guilty still tell lies here?
just kid'n

Lovin the way you handled the situation destee. I have to say I searched for months online before I found this site (I was a member of another, but it closed down, so had to find a new one) and I love it. No other site compares and I log on here everytime I'm online. Thanks for creating such an open, friendly and overall great forum destee.
Lovin' this site
*Emma*

Thank you all for the support. I'm going to move this thread to its new home in the Violations Forum.

Destee

Kemetstry,

I'm hoping that this forum can address that too. While we have absolutely no control over what anyone does away from this forum, we can address issues of alleged violations by those who have Membership here.

If a Member has reason to believe that another Member is using their work without permission (stealing), post it here. Provide as much detail as possible, because such a claim will not be taken lightly, by the one accused or the Family. Members may also choose to handle it privately, but this Forum is here, if needed.

If a Member feels violated in any way, not just copyright infringement issues, but any behavior that violates our rules or undermines our vision ... post it to this Forum. It makes no difference who the alleged violator is (Member, Moderator or Administrator).

As I said before, let this be our notice. If any of us have the nerve to CHOOSE to violate ... know that you are also CHOOSING to be called out in this Forum. Folk here will be shooting first (posting to the Violations Forum) and asking questions later. If you are shot by mistake, we'll apologize.

Destee

Thank you for this Destee!!!!! The problem has been fixed on that other site as far as I can see. Much Love

Destee
I agree with you all the way

ATTENTION POETS

if you don't have a rhyme
for the next line
take the time
to relax your mind
R
find another poet
to rhyme with you
this is not hard to do
AND
if it's good to go
start to flow
and this is how we floss our show
with heart and soul
and honesty too
cause no one can do it
like we do

whisper

[Dear forum I recently subscribed but have no idea how to post my poetry please let me know as I would also like to share my poetry and get others feedback on what they think. Thank you for your website and your resourceful panel. Sincerely tdogg

welcome......just as you posted in this thread
go to the Poetry get your flow on forum
and click the new topic and you can create you thread of poetry
we love to read you and feel your flow .....let me know if
you need me more to help you get your poetry posted up .

Thank u $Rich$ for the information and immediate response and I look forward to hearing your feedback enjoy! Tdogg